Shaolin-Do Curriculum?

[Doomx2001]

Hello everybody,
I was looking for some info into Shaolin-Do. I've heard the controversy and read about it in great length. But, what I'm looking for is actual details about the art itself, and not so much the history. Also, I'm not trying to cause any grief or controversy, I'm just intereseted in the facts. I study martial arts, and I just enjoy learning/practicing different arts.

Here's my questions:

1.) From White belt to Black, how many self defense techniques are there?
As far as I know, white belt - green belt is the only self defense stuff taught (roughly 30 chin na techniques), and the rest is nothing but forms?

2.) Is the curriculum still growing? With so much alledged material, one would think that more stuff would be added to the curriculum.

3.) Is the self defense applications of the forms taught?


Thats it for now. I appreciate any responses.

 

[Doomx2001]

Anybody?

 

[Domino]

Never heard of the art to be fair but youtube has some bits. roll eyes

 

[clfsean]

Seriously? You posted an initial note @1205 & then are out looking for responses @1242.

Chill.

To answer your questions though...

1.) From White belt to Black, how many self defense techniques are there?
As far as I know, white belt - green belt is the only self defense stuff taught (roughly 30 chin na techniques), and the rest is nothing but forms?

There's more to it that that, but yes that's about the size of it in a nutshell. This goes along with the continued training of the previous material as you would with any martial art to develop skill with the material.

2.) Is the curriculum still growing? With so much alledged material, one would think that more stuff would be added to the curriculum.

Couldn't answer that.

3.) Is the self defense applications of the forms taught?

With their background & base training yes.

 

[Tez3]

Seriously? You posted an initial note @1205 & then are out looking for responses @1242.

Chill.

To answer your questions though...



There's more to it that that, but yes that's about the size of it in a nutshell. This goes along with the continued training of the previous material as you would with any martial art to develop skill with the material.


Couldn't answer that.


With their background & base training yes.

It was five past five in the morning our time so not many reading at that time lol!

 

[Flying Crane]

Hello everybody,
I was looking for some info into Shaolin-Do. I've heard the controversy and read about it in great length. But, what I'm looking for is actual details about the art itself, and not so much the history. Also, I'm not trying to cause any grief or controversy, I'm just intereseted in the facts. I study martial arts, and I just enjoy learning/practicing different arts.

ah, something from my illustrious past...

I trained in this system for a couple semesters when I was in college in the very early 1990s. The husband of a professor was a Shaolin-do guy and would come onto campus and use gym space to practice. I hooked up with him and trained for a while. It was my first experience with "Chinese" material, so I didn't know much how to evaluate it. I haven't looked at nor played with that stuff in many years, tho I still have the list somewhere at home.

Here's my questions:

1.) From White belt to Black, how many self defense techniques are there?
As far as I know, white belt - green belt is the only self defense stuff taught (roughly 30 chin na techniques), and the rest is nothing but forms?

that sounds about right, I believe the SD Techs were in the first two belts, maybe 20 and 10 respectively. then there were other groupings of things called simply "Techniques" and whatnot, that were really similar to the SD Techs. If memory serves, there might be a grand total of 40-50 of these things if you combine them all.

Then they had a list of "Short Forms" that were brief combinations, but meant to be practiced in a line one after the other. Individually they could be seen as similar to the "technique" material, but if you link them together they make another form.

THen they had their proper "forms", both empty-hand and weapons.

2.) Is the curriculum still growing? With so much alledged material, one would think that more stuff would be added to the curriculum.

I don't know the answer to that. The last claims I saw were something like 900 forms. If they feel they need more than that (or even need that much) then they ought to re-evaluate what they are doing and ask themselves some uncomfortable questions about why they need so much.

3.) Is the self defense applications of the forms taught?

in my case, not very well, not very much. Very little energy was spent on understanding the fundamentals too. He was just teaching me the material quickly, and in hindsight it was just movement without much meaning. At the time I didn't know better.

 

[Doomx2001]

Thanks for all the replies everyone.
The reason I was asking is because I currently study Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu (7yr) and Jun Tong Musool Hapkido (1yr) and I'm considering training in Shaolin-Do. I enjoy learning different martial arts, cross training, the history, different training methods, different workouts...everything.

I've been interested in Chinese martial arts for a while now, unfortuantly for me there isn't any schools near by where I'm from, except Shaolin-Do which is everywhere in Kentucky.
I know full well the reputation of Shaolin-Do, but I'm one of those people who see merit in everything.

 

[clfsean]

Thanks for all the replies everyone.
The reason I was asking is because I currently study Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu (7yr) and Jun Tong Musool Hapkido (1yr) and I'm considering training in Shaolin-Do. I enjoy learning different martial arts, cross training, the history, different training methods, different workouts...everything.

That's cool. Just make sure your plate doesn't become too full because then you loose the integrity of what you learned.

I've been interested in Chinese martial arts for a while now, unfortuantly for me there isn't any schools near by where I'm from, except Shaolin-Do which is everywhere in Kentucky.
I know full well the reputation of Shaolin-Do, but I'm one of those people who see merit in everything.

There is merit it in. The SD peeps know how to throw down. However... as an ex-SDer myself, spent plenty of time in it, met plenty of different people from schools all over & then moving to TCMA... understand one thing. SD isn't strictly CMA. I'm not knocking what they teach, you will learn things to use. But just keep in mind it's not TCMA. It's SD. It has it's own foundation, which is good because they do everything the same way. However, it also means that a lot of the stuff they do is technically/foundationally incorrect because it's being done the SD way, not the way the style they borrowed the set(s) from originally did because the foundation is lacking/missing to impart those particular skills properly. Again, they make it work, but not the way it was necessarily intended.

 

[ggg214]

it's a little weird to the name of Shaolin-do. because shaoli is buddhism or Zen, while Do is definitely a Taoist thing. it's a two different system. is it a combination of both?

 

[Xue Sheng]

it's a little weird to the name of Shaolin-do. because shaoli is buddhism or Zen, while Do is definitely a Taoist thing. it's a two different system. is it a combination of both?

Stranger yet I think it is a combination of the Chinese "Shaolin" and the Japanese "Do"

 

[clfsean]

Stranger yet I think it is a combination of the Chinese "Shaolin" and the Japanese "Do"

Not terribly worse than the Chinese "Jeet Kune" and Japanese "Do"... different, but not really.

 

[yak sao]

Sin The is from Indonesia. He learned Shaolin do from master Ie Chang Ming, who was Chinese and moved to Indonesia. I have heard that the Shaolin was blended with the Japanese karate that was already prevalent there at the time to make it more accepted.
I don't know if this is something that Ie did or Sin The.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Not terribly worse than the Chinese "Jeet Kune" and Japanese "Do"... different, but not really.

Yes, yes it is....and why is it different...because I say it is :mst:


Good point, I had not thought about that

 

[clfsean]

Yes, yes it is....and why is it different...because I say it is :mst:

Way to stand your ground!

Good point, I had not thought about that

Actually it's not but I was just using it as an example. :soapbox:

JKD uses Cantonese Dou6 in speaking & writing but the "u" was left off in English. In Mandarin it'd be Jie Quan Dao.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Way to stand your ground!



Actually it's not but I was just using it as an example. :soapbox:

JKD uses Cantonese Dou6 in speaking & writing but the "u" was left off in English. In Mandarin it'd be Jie Quan Dao.

OK I was trying REAL hard not to go the Southern Devil Speak and the "Northern Language of the Chosen" but I knew that.... I totally forgot about it... but I knew that

Now... NOW do you see why Southern Devil Speak is just plain WRONG!!!!

 

[Eric_H]

Avoid Shaolin Do at all costs.

 

[Doomx2001]

it's a little weird to the name of Shaolin-do. because shaoli is buddhism or Zen, while Do is definitely a Taoist thing. it's a two different system. is it a combination of both?

Well, here is the cliff notes version of Shaolin-Do:

It is said that Sin Kwan The' learned over 900 forms from his grandfather who claimed to be THE SHAOLIN GRANDMASTER of all of Shaolin. Sin Kwan The is from Indonesia and it is said that his chinese grandfather immigrated to indonesia (as many chinese did durring the boxer revolution and to many other countries as well such as Korea , Taiwan, and Japan).

In the 60's, Sin The' immigrated to the U.S to study to be an engineer at the University of Kentucky.
At the time the tv series 'Kung Fu' was popular along with Bruce Lee's Enter the Dragon. Sin The' made money on the side doing caligraphy and eventually teaching martial arts. He eventually gave up on being an engineer and focused entirely on teaching martial arts. For the first two decades his curriculum was 'hard'/external and later decades he began teaching 'soft/internal' material.

There are many claims by him that have been refuted for lack of evidence in China and nothing provided by him to back up his claims other than his word.

Today Shaolin-Do is practiced all over the U.S and is being spread throughout the world.

To answer the original question, many people were at the time becoming familiar with the word 'Shaolin' because of the tv series 'Kung Fu' and many martial arts at the time ended with 'do'. So he just combined the two.


Anyway, there is alot more stuff than that to make your head spin. But, to stay on topic, does anyone else have anything to add about the techniques or curriculum of Shaolin-Do? What about Chin-Na techniques?

 

[clfsean]

<<deleted party line stuff>>

Anyway, there is alot more stuff than that to make your head spin. But, to stay on topic, does anyone else have anything to add about the techniques or curriculum of Shaolin-Do? What about Chin-Na techniques?

Like what? Their kum na techniques aren't technically kum na. They're reversals & escapes from grabs & locks.

 

[oaktree]

Well, here is the cliff notes version of Shaolin-Do:

It is said that Sin Kwan The' learned over 900 forms from his grandfather who claimed to be THE SHAOLIN GRANDMASTER of all of Shaolin. Sin Kwan The is from Indonesia and it is said that his chinese grandfather immigrated to indonesia (as many chinese did durring the boxer revolution and to many other countries as well such as Korea , Taiwan, and Japan).

In the 60's, Sin The' immigrated to the U.S to study to be an engineer at the University of Kentucky.
At the time the tv series 'Kung Fu' was popular along with Bruce Lee's Enter the Dragon. Sin The' made money on the side doing caligraphy and eventually teaching martial arts. He eventually gave up on being an engineer and focused entirely on teaching martial arts. For the first two decades his curriculum was 'hard'/external and later decades he began teaching 'soft/internal' material.

There are many claims by him that have been refuted for lack of evidence in China and nothing provided by him to back up his claims other than his word.

Today Shaolin-Do is practiced all over the U.S and is being spread throughout the world.

To answer the original question, many people were at the time becoming familiar with the word 'Shaolin' because of the tv series 'Kung Fu' and many martial arts at the time ended with 'do'. So he just combined the two.

People spend their whole lives just learning 8 mother palm bagua, Wuxing from Xingyiquan and even Lao jia in Chen Taijiquan to think of learning even 100 forms you would miss out on so much martial application your muscle memory would be confused on what to do,
your form would be at a mediocre level at best.


Thinking of someone mastering 900 forms or more is just well let this guy explain it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1Sa6Umz8YA&feature=fvst

You can't just combine random Zhongwen because Shaolin-do just sounds retard.

JKD uses Cantonese Dou6 in speaking & writing but the "u" was left off in English. In Mandarin it'd be Jie Quan Dao.

6 tone sends shivers down my spine. At least the Mandarin is a sign of relief. :cheers:

 

[Doomx2001]

For me, what I would get out of learning Shaolin-Do would be to get a basic introduction into chinese martial arts (even if the Shaolin-Do understanding of their source arts is 'skewed') and to experience different 'taijutsu' or body movements to get me 'thinking' and experimenting with new ideas. If I found that after the first couple of classes that it had some merit to it, I'd keep training.