Northern Mantis vs Wing Chun

7starmantis

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OK so I ran across this video of a northern mantis guy fighting a wing chun guy. Dont really know much other backgroun than that. Its pretty interesting, I would love to hear your thoughts on it, the fighters, and their respective fighting styles.

Mantis vs WC

7sm
 

AceHBK

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Although he didnt really show any wc in the sparring match it was pretty good to see. The guy in the video made a good point in the comment that he posted. This is my first time seeing mantis in action. Great find 7m!
 

mantis

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7starmantis said:
OK so I ran across this video of a northern mantis guy fighting a wing chun guy. Dont really know much other backgroun than that. Its pretty interesting, I would love to hear your thoughts on it, the fighters, and their respective fighting styles.

Mantis vs WC

7sm
i am assuming the guy in white is the WC guy, and the other is mantis. i could only tell from the stiff extension of arms of WC and high kicks of the white guy.
i thought they both suck (disclaimer: im not saying im any better)
but they had their feet mismatching most of the time.
mantis did not show any stickiness. high kicks were floating around like crazy!
i wasnt expecting much, but i was at least expecting to see the basics of both arts.

however, i found this here that i thought is a beautiful piece of art.

thanks Adam for sharing that...
 

brothershaw

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I have seen that clip b4 neither guy seemed to have the intention to close and execute anything, which is hard to do against resistance but............

That motion capture video of northern mantis was pretty good
 

yipman_sifu

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They say it was a freindly match and that' true. No one really wanted to fight with real moves so nothing can be said about being it a spar. About Wing Chun. It was not up to the level in this clip, because he kicks just for show and forgets the idea of centerline and bridging the gap. Regarding the mantis, I think that he also didn't showed anything because it was just a friendly brawl.:supcool:
 

brothershaw

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You can be friendly, and still show some degree of skill, without hurting someone, especially if its with someone you know.
 

yipman_sifu

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brothershaw said:
You can be friendly, and still show some degree of skill, without hurting someone, especially if its with someone you know.

This needs some degree of experience my friend. The Wing Chun guy in this clip is a student. He cannot have that degree of control. After all it was more concerned about showing high kicks by the Wing Chun guy. This high kicking is not correct for a student to perform. Especially seing how nonsence his moves was. Wing Chun is using the minimum force to produce the maximum result, and this was producing maximum force for minimum result.
Regarding the Mantis fighter. I cannot judge because I have a little idea about the system.
(it's very difficult to spar using Wing Chun).
It is said traditional Wing Chun in here by the fighter:rolleyes: , Well not again.
 

brothershaw

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I agree, I was trying to be nice in my comments........:), but people think too much about sparring if someone wants to punch or kickbox, you have to try to get in and still do your wing chun or mantis and end it, not easy to do, since most people rather practice sparring than what I am talking about,
 

yipman_sifu

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brothershaw said:
I agree, I was trying to be nice in my comments........:), but people think too much about sparring if someone wants to punch or kickbox, you have to try to get in and still do your wing chun or mantis and end it, not easy to do, since most people rather practice sparring than what I am talking about,

Absloutely true, and above all of that you have to be very careful not to wound someone especially if it comes to Wing Chun. I personally crossed hands with my Sifu Mannes. He was able to hit my throat several times and I just felt something touching with a little push inside my neck. His control is really amazing. Another time he crossed hands with my Sihing and was using punches that were really fast towards the Sihing's nose. it looked like a real KO punch, but it's hit never inflicted any damage to the Sihing. Now if you have such control, I beleive that you can spar using Wing Chun.
Regarding Mantis, I think the same thing applies in if I am not mistaken.
 
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7starmantis

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Regarding the original video I posted, I think this is the mistake way too many CMA players make. They can't or dont transition from forms to fighting. They dont use their techniques and principles from their forms and training when fighting. It becomes a game of tag and principles and technique goes out the window. I saw no closing of the gap, no sticking, yielding, controlling the center, and basically no defining techniques. Its a friendly match so its easy to ignore intent. Thats a bad habit to get into. You can still use skill, attack with intent even in a friendly match. The WC guy looked more like a JKD guy to me and the mantis guy looked more like a kickboxer. They were both very tight and rigid especially in close and I saw no redirecting of any kind. Plus, both thier centers were up way too high as you can see by the takedowns.

Now, it was a friendly match and thats understandable, but I think this shows a bad mistake people make when having these "friendly" matches. To abandon skill and technqiue along with principles because its a friendly match is a mistake. People often abandon intent with their attacks because of a "friendly match". How will you progress then? Aren't all matches in training friendly? When its not friendly is outside the school, how will you react if all you have done is play around, kick blindly and lack intent and principled techniques?

7sm
 
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7starmantis

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So is it that mantis or WC are too deadly to spar with? Or is it possible to have sparring, using the principels and technique of the respective systems and still not hurt each other?

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Kensai

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7starmantis said:
So is it that mantis or WC are too deadly to spar with? Or is it possible to have sparring, using the principels and technique of the respective systems and still not hurt each other?

7sm

It is possible to spar in Wing Chun, but it doesn't have any real sporting element to it, i.e there's no point scoring for kicks, or throws such as in TKD, or judo, not putting those arts down, simply pointing out that such arts maybe more conducive to sparring. Lots of throat strikes, groin strikes, short sharp punches/attacks to vital areas along the centre line are predominantly what WC incorporates amongst other things. So, an effective art, but something that doesn't translate well to a gentle spar.
 

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