No scale at home? Three field tests for tai chi sword weight and balance

[Same Trick74 25]

You picked the right founder to ask about, because the honest answer is also the interesting one.

The sword arrived late in the taiji repertoire. The earliest Yang line documents we have, the Wu Yuxiang manuals, record the sabre and the spear, but no sword form at all. That fits the times: by the Qing dynasty the jian had already lost its battlefield role to the sabre, and survived as a scholar's weapon, exactly the symbolism you describe. Yang Luchan's own reputation was built on empty hand work and the big spear. He almost certainly knew the jian, since nobody became Yang the Invincible in old Beijing without weapons skill, but there is no record of him teaching it.

The Yang sword form we practice today was fixed in his grandson's generation. Chen Weiming, who studied under Yang Chengfu, recorded it in pictures in the 1920s, and there is a persistent claim that Li Jinglin, the Wudang sword general and a close friend of Yang Chengfu, had a hand in shaping it. So the form carries the founder's name, but the art inside it is third generation work.

Which I find more satisfying, not less. The jian was the scholar's blade, so of course taiji adopted it late, after the art moved to the capital and started teaching scholars. The symbolism came first. The form followed.

Yes this how I have understood it, that weapons wize for the founder of Yang family taijiquan it was at least proficiency with the spear of which is mentioned in some book written by Tung Yingchieh(spelling?).
The idea that it was through General Li Jinglin the Jian was brought into Yang Taijiquan seems quite plausible

 

[MaryTaiChiArt1]

Jack, this whole thread is a public service. Eight years of tai chi here, mostly Yang empty hand, and my teacher started me on jian this past year. I've been practicing with an aluminum jian that weighs almost nothing. My circles look fine, but I can't feel the tip. The sword just does whatever my hand does, and there's nothing pushing back.

So I'm ready for a real steel training jian, but I don't want to wreck the form I already have by rushing the transition. I tried the thirty-second hold with a friend's steel jian, nicely balanced right around your three-inch zone, and my forearm was talking by twenty seconds. That's fine, I expect to work. I'd just rather not pick up new bad habits along the way. If this were one of your own students, how would you stage it — same form with the new sword, or back to basics for a few weeks first?

 

[Jack Xu19 6]

Welcome to the forum, and welcome to steel. What you describe is the normal aluminum to steel transition, and the fact that you already noticed the missing tip puts you ahead of most people making this jump.

Stage it in three steps, and keep your form the whole time. Step one, two weeks of ingredients instead of the recipe. Thrusts, splits, circles in front of the body, and your balance postures held with the sword. Ten quiet minutes, then stop. Your thirty second hold is the gauge: when the forearm stays silent past thirty, step one is done. Step two, the form at half speed. Run the whole thing, but slow enough that you can feel the tip draw every line. The moment the tip goes vague, slow down or end the session. Step three, full speed, with one rule: always finish while the form is still clean. Fatigue is where bad habits actually get installed, because the shoulder starts doing the waist's job. Ending early is not quitting, it is quality control.

One more thing: keep the aluminum sword in the rotation. Once a week, run the form with it right after a steel session. If your shapes look the same on both swords, you have not built tension into the transition. The aluminum jian used to hide the truth from you. Now its job is to check what the steel taught you.

The forearm talking at twenty seconds on a well balanced sword is just dues. Six weeks from now you will not remember it.

 

[Same Trick74 25]

Thread nicely staged , you think ?
Anyhow, good advicements about the Jian

 

[MaryTaiChiArt1]

Jack, the three-step staging makes sense. I had that aluminum backwards — I thought of it as the sword I practice with, not a check on the steel, so keeping it in the rotation once a week actually lands well.
Ending while the form is still clean is the part I know I'll be tempted to cheat on, so that's what I'll build my sessions around rather than how long I'm at them.
Anyway, the actual purchase. My hands are small, and I've been reading grip specs on listings like somebody with no business doing that. I can't put my hands on a jian before I buy one, so the numbers are all I have to go on, and I'm honestly not sure which ones matter. How much does grip diameter change things for hands my size?

 

[Jack Xu19 6]

Good instinct checking the staging first. Now the grip, and you are right that it matters more than most listings admit.

Here is the order of numbers when you cannot touch the sword. First balance, then total weight, then length by the ear test, and then grip. Grip comes last only because most listings do not publish it, not because it is minor. For small hands it is first class: a handle your fingers cannot close around forces a permanent half grip, and a half grip means the tip is never really yours. Worse, your hand compensates by squeezing, and a squeezed grip is forearm tension with a handle on it.

The fixable part: almost no seller lists grip dimensions, so make them. Ask in writing for the grip circumference. A serious dealer answers within a day. While you wait, do the kitchen drawer test: wrap your hand around a broom handle. If your thumb and middle finger meet comfortably, standard grips will fit you fine. If there is a gap, you want a slim handle, and you say so in your email. Slim jian handles exist, and smaller handed practitioners have used them for centuries. This is a normal request, not a fussy one.

One trap: do not trade grip for length. A short blade on a fat handle is still a fat handle. Get the length your ear test calls for, then match the grip to your hand, in that order.

Small hands, a quiet grip, three inches of balance. That combination disappears into the form, same as any other.