New Gyokko Ryu Book

Chris Parker

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Hey Pablo,

Yeah, I have it. It's an English translation of a book they presented in German first, all in all, not bad. The diagrams are not entirely accurate, and there are some interpretations of kata that I don't entirely agree with, but the main reason I got it was for a cross-reference with other versions of the Gyokko Densho I already have.

The intro is interesting, and the glossary is well done, with the kanji supplied (as well as the kanji for each individual kata), and it wasn't too expensive, so I was pretty happy with it. Apparently there is going to be Koto Ryu next, and others to follow (I'd probably expect Shinden Fudo, myself).
 

Muawijhe

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I do not have the book, but according to the website you linked us Kukishinden Ryu will be the next available (the Deutsche Ausgabe is currently in print), with Togakure Ryu to follow.
 

Chris Parker

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Ah, the page has changed since last I was there.... these should be fun. Honestly, I wasn't expecting them to go to Togakure so early, it has such a limited Taijutsu aspect to it. Still, very cool.
 

Troy Wideman

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I looked at the Takagi Yoshin Ryu download. And as I said before some of the patterns preformed by Manaka don't look like Ishitani or Mizuta. I know he received menkyo kaiden but I am confused as to why his patterns are so different.
The download shows some patterns in the okuden sections which are shinden fudo ryu, not takagi yoshin ryu.

Kind Regards,

Troy Wideman
 

Supra Vijai

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Took a look at the Gyokko Ryu book download, didn't seem too bad except for a few differences from what we've been shown in terms of targetting etc. Mind you that could just be my lack of experience with the techniques talking.

However according to my friend, the Togakure book was funny! Seems one of the techniques (at work now so can't download the file and look at the name) shows a picture of a ninja in full kabuki costume "hiding" on top of a wall with one leg hanging over at perfect eye level to his samurai attacker before leaping out to kick the attacker before going back to hiding on top of the wall.

Hopefully no one is trying to teach themselves anything based on these books!
 

Chris Parker

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Er, hate to tell you this, Supra, but the kata Shige Gaeshi and Shige Dori are legitmate kata of Togakure Ryu, found within the Hiden Gata section. They fit in with the rest of the Ryu quite well, actually, but they do need to be looked at within context, and for the reasons they exist. Wait until July onwards for these things.... but it's not funny when you know what it actually is, so you know.
 

Supra Vijai

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Er, hate to tell you this, Supra, but the kata Shige Gaeshi and Shige Dori are legitmate kata of Togakure Ryu, found within the Hiden Gata section. They fit in with the rest of the Ryu quite well, actually, but they do need to be looked at within context, and for the reasons they exist. Wait until July onwards for these things.... but it's not funny when you know what it actually is, so you know.

Will do Sensei! Sorry didn't mean to say the entire book was funny, more the images of the shozoku clad ninja. I still haven't had a chance to look at that particular book myself, due to extended working hours over the holidays so cannot put forward any particular thoughts at this stage. That being said, as you mentioned, I think I'll leave it till we cover things in class and take notes based on what we cover so I'm not jumping ahead. It's the reason I've only looked at the Gyokko book so far (given we've just spent 6 months on the Ryu)
 

Chris Parker

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The Togakure download is the Jinenkan web-store list, with the kata being demonstrated by Manaka Sensei. He wears a dark blue keikogi with Hakama tucked into his tabi, and a scarf tied over his head. It's not exactly the same as a movie-style Shinobi Shozoku, and this manner of dressing was semi-common in old Japan. There are numerous ukiyo-e and so forth depicting this, by the way.
 

Bruno@MT

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Wow, I totally rescind my previous post about the book being funny then! Apologies to any students who might have taken offense.

I know neither the book mentioned nor much about Togakure ryu, but I do know that Manaka sensei is a traditionalist when it comes to training, and he follows the scrolls very closely. So if I would see him do anything, my first guess would not be that it was made up or added for the hollywood favor.

Generally it pays not to judge things if you are not certain about whether what you think is correct or not. That way your sensei does not have to make you eat your words in public. :)
 

Supra Vijai

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Point well taken Bruno! As I said I had not seen the book myself, I've only looked at the Gyokko Ryu book so far as that's what we've just covered. Also I had no idea that it was Manaka Sensei himself in the pictures.

That's no excuse though, you're right of course, I was wrong to post something that came across as judgmental or belittling based on something a friend said. I took his word on it as he's had a lot of spare time recently and supposedly was doing a lot of reading on the topic etc. Won't happen again :)
 

Chris Parker

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Just out of interest, would I know the friend who's done a fair bit of reading no the topic? Send an email if you'd rather not put it up here, of course, my private messages are rather full at present....
 

Supra Vijai

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Sure Sensei, Mr. Evans. Not saying he's specifically studied any of the ryu-ha (I honestly don't know) but he has been studying the overall histories etc. Without wanting to cause any trouble for him so to speak, the following is the message I received from him:

I had a flick through togakure complete
liam is suspicious
theres one technique where its like, disappear onto a wall, the top of the wall mind you and when an enemy comes past on clearly some sort of stroll you fly out and kick them and then go back tohiding on top of the wall -_-, it.has.photos. its not taking cover in the shadows
its broad daylight, he's dressed as a "ninja" and his leg is hanging over the edge of the wall in the eyeline of his "samurai" attacker"
 

Chris Parker

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Ha, okay. I'll see if I can explain it a little more to you both when we return in a few weeks... but it's suffice to say that the "daylight" aspect is mainly so you can see what is going on in the photo. The "shadow" principle is covered elsewhere in the Ryu-ha's teachings (along with other aspects), that particular part of the Ryu is dealing with it's Taijutsu. Ideally it all gets used together, especially in kata like the Shige forms, but for demonstration purposes it is photographed so you can see what's happening.

Oh, and his description is a bit out as well, the entire kata involves teaching how to obtain the hiding spot, how to move from it, and how to get down and away. A wall is only one representation of the principles. Feel free to send him a link to this thread....
 

Supra Vijai

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Have done Sensei. I've also been telling him for the past month to find his login details (he signed up and then never visited so doesn't remember them) so maybe this will be a good motivator.

Again, apologies for the way my post came across. It should have been phrased a question rather than a statement. I'll be mindful of it in future and avoid making judgment calls on things I have no basis in.
 

Chris Parker

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Completely seperate area of study, but one of the pieces of advice I live by is "never judge". I may take you through some of that at some point (at present a couple of the City guys are being taken through some initial bits). Other than that, don't stress about it. Mistakes are part of learning, remember. Humans learn by making mistakes, if we didn't make them, we wouldn't learn.
 

Supra Vijai

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No stress :) I've just spent today reading threads by DoubleZ711 and spent a fair while on the posts by Joab that Aikido is ineffective against hard/fast attacks even though he had no personal experience. A lot of posters seemed to take offense to that (rightfully so IMO) and I just didn't want to offend any Jinenkan practitioners who may come across this thread.

That being said, thanks for all your advice lately, as I said in my email I know I'm asking a lot of questions but I'm not sure how much of what I find on the internet as an answer will be accurate.
 

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