New anti Sine Wave pattern deliveries on Youtube

Earl Weiss

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Messages
3,076
Reaction score
573
I'll be you now and blame it on a translation error.
Sir, If you think you want to be me you have a world of disappointment ahead of you. As far as "Translation error" that would involve a lot of error in the explanation he provides which taken together cover a full page of text. Or perhaps I misunderstand and you are referring to your erroneous translation.
 

Earl Weiss

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Messages
3,076
Reaction score
573
I hate to bark up the wrong tree but Choi's black belt in Shotokan was never certified, was it Earl? :)
Sir, I really have no idea what this question has to do with anything. I know there are some who make the claim. I will readily admit I was not there and this I something I cannot attest to.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Sir, If you think not then I suggest you are not familiar with the Chang Hon Pattern Standard for Palm Pressing Blocks, Scooping Blocks, and others.

I thought we were talking about striking.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Sir, If you think you want to be me you have a world of disappointment ahead of you. As far as "Translation error" that would involve a lot of error in the explanation he provides which taken together cover a full page of text. Or perhaps I misunderstand and you are referring to your erroneous translation.

Novice
noun
  1. 1.
    a person new to and inexperienced in a job or situation.
Sounds like a white belt to me and not a black belt going by proper language.
 
Last edited:

Earl Weiss

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Messages
3,076
Reaction score
573
I thought we were talking about striking.
Sir, Since SW can also apply to blocking why would we only be talking about striking? We were addressing exaggerated motions not being practical, and my point is if you want to critique practicality, then there is a whole lot besides SW to critique as far as patterns are concerned.
 

Earl Weiss

Senior Master
Joined
Jan 27, 2009
Messages
3,076
Reaction score
573
Novice
noun
  1. 1.
    a person new to and inexperienced in a job or situation.
Sounds like a white belt to me and not a black belt going by proper language.

Sir, exactly the point. What it sounds like to you nd your opinion is not how many others choose to view it. Now, we have to agree (I hope) there are not hard and fast rules across martial arts delineating what a First Dan Knows or needs to be able to do. General Choi made some delineations and considers it Novice - New and inexperienced.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Sir, exactly the point. What it sounds like to you nd your opinion is not how many others choose to view it. Now, we have to agree (I hope) there are not hard and fast rules across martial arts delineating what a First Dan Knows or needs to be able to do. General Choi made some delineations and considers it Novice - New and inexperienced.

New and inexperienced to what?
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Sir, Since SW can also apply to blocking why would we only be talking about striking? .

Because hip twist for striking, more specifically punching, is in doubt. We had a shotokan player transitioning who still used hip twist in a grading session. Aforementioned Yeo Chin Huat, the examiner, made the point that it's how they used to do back in the day but not now. Again, deemphasizing hip twist, contrary to your claim that it is supposed to be left in tact.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
I would really encourage you to email Mr Yeo Chin Huat and tell him he's doing it wrong.

I'm happy to concede If I got it all twisted (no pun intended). Let's just say that I'm not holding my breath.
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
Sadly, there will always be outliers that make your statement true. But looking at the bigger picture belts are still very useful tools to help people navigate their training with an easy marker and/or target. In no way does that preclude a certain level of training. Quite the opposite.
It is a treacherous position when any swing dxxk can go out a purchase a black belt. Just like the same person can give themselves the title of President, CEO, GM, etc... The proof is in the pudding not the outward appearance.

I hope the perception of belting hasn't degraded to the point that they are a 'joke' to most people.

We are such strange creatures; how we seem to get more enjoyment out of watching people failures more than their successes.
This is where we get into perceived meaning again. "President" doesn't mean anything powerful. Technically, I'm the President of my company. Mind you, the Hobbit and I are the only members in the LLC, and I currently have no employees (had 3 at most). But "President" is still an appropriate title...because it does't mean much on its own. The meaning comes from what the person is president of. Just the a black belt, in and of itself, has little intrinsic meaning.
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
All those in-between colored belts and stripes is western capitalism. In asia you had two or three belts until 1st dan.
I've heard that argument before, but have yet to have anyone give an explanation how more colors increases income. Sure, some folks charge exorbitantly for testing, but that only makes the claim true of those folks. The vast majority of the belt-rank schools I have operational knowledge of either don't charge for testing (and only approximately charge cost for the actual belt), or charge a small testing fee (on the order of $10-20). So where's the "western capitalism" in that?
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
Novice
noun
  1. 1.
    a person new to and inexperienced in a job or situation.
Sounds like a white belt to me and not a black belt going by proper language.
"new" and "inexperienced" are both relative terms. Where black belts are awarded after a year or two, many of us would consider those folks mostly (likely with exceptions) to be novices.
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
Because hip twist for striking, more specifically punching, is in doubt. We had a shotokan player transitioning who still used hip twist in a grading session. Aforementioned Yeo Chin Huat, the examiner, made the point that it's how they used to do back in the day but not now. Again, deemphasizing hip twist, contrary to your claim that it is supposed to be left in tact.
I don't know if it is in TKD or not, but hip twist can be applied to blocks, as well.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
I've heard that argument before, but have yet to have anyone give an explanation how more colors increases income. Sure, some folks charge exorbitantly for testing, but that only makes the claim true of those folks. The vast majority of the belt-rank schools I have operational knowledge of either don't charge for testing (and only approximately charge cost for the actual belt), or charge a small testing fee (on the order of $10-20). So where's the "western capitalism" in that?

I don't remember the fee but it's at least 30 dollars, and that adds up if you have a lot of kid students.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Which is relevant to which part of this discussion??

We were talking about how Choi defines first Dan black belt. I thought it would be appropriate if he ever had one himself.

From what I gather he learned Karate from a korean and then switch to the japanese.

I did not buy that the japanese award him a black belt in 2 years, but it just so happens that they didn't, it was a Korean instructor. Then Choi supposedly got a second Dan from the Japanese.
 
OP
A

Acronym

Master of Arts
Joined
Jun 26, 2020
Messages
1,773
Reaction score
41
Then again, the Taekkyon claim is fairytales so who knows...

General Choi Hong Hi – Michal Košátko

"When he became older he went to Japan to study calligraphy. Choi had been studying calligraphy and Taek Kyon in Korea under Han Il Dong and upon arrival in Japan he started to study Shotokan Karate as a student of a Korean named Kim Hyun-soo, and after two years of intensive training he was presented with a first Dan Black Belt in Shotokan. He then went into Tokyo University where he studied under Master Gichin Funakoshi, founder of Shotokan, and gained his second Dan."
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
I don't remember the fee but it's at least 30 dollars, and that adds up if you have a lot of kid students.
Depending how testing is done, that may not be unreasonable. If it's extra time for the instructor (or other instructors, to cover class during testing), and there are other fees (cost of belt, registering with an association), it might be mostly a wash. If it takes regular class time (everyone in class is testing) and doesn't cover anything else, that's extra money.

I do know some schools use testing fees rather than higher monthly fees, in which case, the number of tests doesn't really make much difference. It actually works out well for students who are slower to test, since they get lower monthly fees in the deal.
 

gpseymour

MT Moderator
Staff member
Supporting Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2012
Messages
25,734
Reaction score
7,541
Location
Hendersonville, NC
We were talking about how Choi defines first Dan black belt. I thought it would be appropriate if he ever had one himself.

From what I gather he learned Karate from a korean and then switch to the japanese.

I did not buy that the japanese award him a black belt in 2 years, but it just so happens that they didn't, it was a Korean instructor. Then Choi supposedly got a second Dan from the Japanese.
But it's not, really. If someone came from a non-belt art (let's say boxing) and decided to use belts to make managing class easier, it wouldn't really matter to me that they'd never been awarded a BB rank - they're defining what that belt (and the others) signifies within their new system.
 

Latest Discussions

Top