Is there such a thing as "chinese kenpo"

[MMAfighter]

Well, i was playing tekken 5 and one of the characters discription says chinese kenpo, yea i know "it's a video game", but then i was reading this thing on Mas oyama(the kyokushin creator) and it had said that his first martial arts was chinese kenpo, so I'm wondering, does anyone know if there is a such thing as chinese kenpo?? and is it similar to Japanese, american, ect. Kenpo

 

[Randy Strausbaugh]

Yes, there is such a thing as Chinese Kenpo.
When Masutatsu Oyama spoke of Chinese Kempo, he was referring to what we now call Kung Fu. He also spoke of Korean Kempo and Taiwan Kempo. Essentially the word kempo was used at the time to refer to any non-karate asian striking-based art.
Chinese Kenpo is also the name given to the art of Kenpo which was taught by SGM Ed Parker in the 1960's, prior to his development of American Kenpo. Stylistically, is was practically identical to what is now called Tracy's Kenpo.
At least, that's what my instructor told me. Further education on the topic by Kenpo seniors will be much appreciated.

 

[sandan]

That the story I've heard also

 

[lonekimono10]

Yes, there is such a thing as Chinese Kenpo.
When Masutatsu Oyama spoke of Chinese Kempo, he was referring to what we now call Kung Fu. He also spoke of Korean Kempo and Taiwan Kempo. Essentially the word kempo was used at the time to refer to any non-karate asian striking-based art.
Chinese Kenpo is also the name given to the art of Kenpo which was taught by SGM Ed Parker in the 1960's, prior to his development of American Kenpo. Stylistically, is was practically identical to what is now called Tracy's Kenpo.
At least, that's what my instructor told me. Further education on the topic by Kenpo seniors will be much appreciated.

you said it right.

 

[kenpochad]

I take chinese Kenpo .

traco is chinese kenpo , this is the history from master packer
i think he is the highest rank that is living in the traco style
which i was told it is chinese kenpo

http://www.akka.org/history.htm

 

[Sam]

not saying anything new here - I study tracy's kenpo - chinese kenpo.

 

[The Kai]

Most of what is advertised as "Chinese Kenpo" is not chinese per se, but a hawaiin based art form.

 

[Gentle Fist]

Master Bill Chun's system is Goshin Jitsu Kia Chinese Kempo. He was one of Professor Chow's highest ranked black belts.


I never heard of Al Tracy's Kenpo reflecting Chinese Kenpo.... And where did Ed Parker learn Chinese Kenpo from? He only studied under Chow for a very brief amount of time. Thanks for any answers!

 

[Gentle Fist]

Most of what is advertised as "Chinese Kenpo" is not chinese per se, but a hawaiin based art form.

I agree with that. Especially over in the States.

 

[BlackCatBonz]

ive never agreed with the whole chinese kempo terminology. the movements in kempo(japanese) hardly resemble the movements in chuanfa(chinese), even though it was influenced by it, it definitely is a japanese art.

 

[Kembudo-Kai Kempoka]

Parker was heavily influenced by Chinese teachers, including Ark Yuey Wong, and the San Soo crew. Implemented many of their ideas into his Hawaiian kenpo, giving it a more Chinese flavor. Hence, "Chinese Kenpo", a la Parker. It's been explored on many threads here; a scan through earlier threads will provide some great history on the developments in kenpo here in the U.S. Many posted by Mr. Chapel, who knew many of the key players back in the day.

Additionally, there are many martial arts teachers in Japan who teach "Chinese Kempo", each making dubious claims about the other. In essence (and yes, I know this is an over-simplification), whenever some Japanese or Okinawan guy trains in a Chinese art, he returns to his homeland to teach "Chinese Kempo". The names of the individual ryu may vary, depending on real or claimed heritage/lineage. I trained for a spell with a Brit who travelled to Japan to train with Sato Kimbei. He only ever called it Chinese Kempo. He used to laugh about the ninjutsu crowd glomming onto him as a great hidden sensei of ninjutsu/ninpo. Apparently a lot of politics there about lineage stuff between the bujinkan and it's splinter groups/competitors, and somehow this Chinese Kempo teacher fit into the intrigue. Still not clear on how, but then again...life has bigger fish to fry.

Regards,

Dave

 

[Bode]

Doc wrote this at some point. Notice the Chinese Kenpo, which came after the very Japanese looking 1961 kenpo.

Although there were varying degrees of crossover from one evolving method to another, there were at least five clear and distinct philosophies and/or styles created by Ed Parker Sr.


1. Kenpo Karate

What Ed Parker was doing when he arrived on the mainland, first as a brown and later as a black belt opening shop in Pasadena around 54. Wrote the book of the same name and published it in 1961. Teachers like Chuck Sullivan draw from this era.


2. Chinese Kenpo

When Ed Parker discovered the vast knowledge available and embraced the Chinese Arts while studying with and under Ark Wong and Haumea Lefiti. Also where he met Jimmy (James Wing) Woo, and Danny Inosanto. Here he also broke with the established "Yudansakai" governing board. During this period, he wrote "Secrets of Chinese Karate" and published it in 1963. Notice the compressed time . People like Frank Trejo's instructor, Steve Hearring still teach this perspective in Pasadena Ca..


3. American Kenpo

Began the codification process of his early understandings of Chinese Kenpo into a distinct evolving American interpretation. Here he dropped all Japanese - Chinese language and non-essential non-American cultural accoutrements. Notice the lack of the word "karate," considered an insult to the Chinese. Some like Dave Hebler draw from the beginnings of this version.


4. Ed Parker's American Kenpo Karate

A series of personal issues causes Ed Parker to decide to enter the commercial marketplace and expand in the second half of the sixties. Looking for a method that differed from the Kenpo franchises that preceded him that he felt were flawed, he drew upon his many "transfer" black belts from other styles. Stumbling upon "motion" as a base concept, it allowed him to create loose conceptual guidelines for already competent black belts. This further gave him the freedom to travel conducting seminars, belt tests, and selling, while seeing the majority of his "students" two or three times a year. Most of the well-known black belts came up under this system. Some came very late in the eighties and is the reason they are not on Parker’s published Family Tree. The rest came after Parker's death.

This was what he was sharing with a few private students in an effort to cash in on the publicity of Larry Tatum's student Jeff Speakman's movie, "Perfect Weapon." He hoped to rekindle a chain of schools that he directly controlled.
5. Ed Parker's Personal Kenpo

The ever-evolving personal art of Ed Parker that included elements left out of his commercial diversion or off shoots. However, in reality it is the "American Kenpo" Parker was himself utilizing before he passed away that was still evolving. Others that he may have taught may have other names for it, but to understand it, a person would have had to evolve with Parker because of a lack of its hard codification.

 

[kenpochad]

ive never agreed with the whole chinese kempo terminology. the movements in kempo(japanese) hardly resemble the movements in chuanfa(chinese), even though it was influenced by it, it definitely is a japanese art.

I think the term chinese kenpo is used becouse.
it has less japanese influence or more of the chinese influences have been brouht back to the art . it not pure chinese if it was it would not be called
kenpo or kempo it would chu'an fa
i do have kung fu forms in the system that iam taken
i know short 1,2,3,mass attack long 1,2,3,4 -kenpo
five animals dragon and tiger forms - kung fu
there are the rest of the kenpo forms in the system i just dont know them at this point.

so i would say there is chinese kenpo
but its not the ture chu'an fa
and i would say its deffernt than hawaiin kempo

 

[The Kai]

It's all Hawaain Kenpo

Unless your Kata's are The Pinan series and other Okinawan Forms

 

[kenpochad]

Thats like saying Spanish is spanish if your from mexico or spain its the same.

when its not

or its like me saying japanese ju jitsu is the same as bjj its just deffernt
not that one is better than the other there not the same

 

[The Kai]

While mexicans use a dilect (offshoot) the spanish language, there are clear traces of the original tongue and reason it evolved the way it did.
Kenpo was devolped by some tough SOB's on the island of hawaii, and has been shined up, repackaged and ornamentalized ever since.

 

[kenpochad]

While mexicans use a dilect (offshoot) the spanish language, there are clear traces of the original tongue and reason it evolved the way it did.
Kenpo was devolped by some tough SOB's on the island of hawaii, and has been shined up, repackaged and ornamentalized ever since.

So Do you belive that all Kenpo is the same ?
I belive its all a tight net family .I think names have changed becouse there are alot
of people out there thats say how much can you change some thing befor
its different .
i do not think that applies to kenpo to a exctent ,kenpo is all about evolution
and teaching what works

 

[KenpoDave]

ive never agreed with the whole chinese kempo terminology. the movements in kempo(japanese) hardly resemble the movements in chuanfa(chinese), even though it was influenced by it, it definitely is a japanese art.

Do the movements of kenpo resemble the movements of chuan fa of an earlier, pre-Wushu time? I was told that once kenpo hit Japan, it remained virtually unchanged, while chuan fa evolved, therefore, the two bear little resemblance today.

We could also surmise the opposite, kenpo hits Japan in the 1200s and undergoes 700 years of "japanization" before becoming "americanized," and would therefore, bear little resemblance to it's chinese ancestor.

Yet, chinese is still it's origin.

 

[KenpoDave]

Doc wrote this at some point. Notice the Chinese Kenpo, which came after the very Japanese looking 1961 kenpo.

Yep, it takes some credibility from the story that Chow learned from his Shaolin Monk father, yet taught Parker a japanese looking art. It would seem more likely that most of Chow's influence must have been japanese.

 

[Bode]

I have been archiving to DVD some very old footage of SGM Parker around 1961. The style is definetly very Japanese and I think little would argue this point for those who have seen it.
Later, in the 70's and 80's, footage of SGM becomes less Japanese and begins to look more Chinese in movement.
Today I watch Dr. Chapel and see very little, if any, Japanese in SL4. Even the old footage of Doc from the 80's is very much Chinese.

We could argue where the art originated from for days. However, examining SGM's movement and that of his students we can definetly see how SGM taught a very Chinese influenced art. Some teachers stopped learning from SGM during his Japenese influenced era. Some learned from a more Chinese influenced area.
When I discuss the SL4 I would actually say that my arts origins BEGIN with SGM Parker and don't bother tracing it back to China or Japan. Parker created something unique and as such, he is the originator. Mr. Parker is about as far back as I need to go. (With respect to those who came before him)