I keep telling you I have already seen it done. If you must grab the throat maybe you should consider hooking behind the head in sort of a half can opener grip. That makes it easier to stack the guy and harder to get armbarred. But if you try that pass on a good BJJ guy I give you 50-50 odds of getting snagged in an armbar.
Guard Pass
- Thread starter Andrew Green
- Start date
OP
- Thread Starter
- #22
And I can tell by your posts that what you have done is not the same. For one I am not grabbing the throat, but using it as a base, so grabbing the back of the head is not an option.
I'm sure you've seen guys get caught in triangles doing a arm under pass too. But, same thing here, done right you won't get caught. Done wrong, you probably will.
We've tested your technique, as it does appear to be a option. But it does not work. (ie "I'm going to do this, I want you to try and do this...") It only works if the top guy screws up.
I'm sure you've seen guys get caught in triangles doing a arm under pass too. But, same thing here, done right you won't get caught. Done wrong, you probably will.
We've tested your technique, as it does appear to be a option. But it does not work. (ie "I'm going to do this, I want you to try and do this...") It only works if the top guy screws up.
Am I the only one who thinks you two would have to get on the mat and try it out to settle this argument?
Kempojujutsu
Master Black Belt
I have used the arm as bait before. It works great! If someone has a very good guard and you are not able to pass it. Letting them go for the arm bar is good. I have never been arm barred before while trying this technique before. If you wait till he has the arm bar on, yeah you will get summited. But if you react as soon as he opens his legs, you can easily pass the guard.
Eternal Beginner
Brown Belt
I suppose, as with most techniques, that this one is effective when done at the right time with the right circumstances. I can honestly say I have seen many people armbarred from that position* and I can just as honestly say I've seen it work just as many times.
The thing to remember is that seeing the opportunity for the right technique is an extremely important part of grappling, mma, whatever. A square peg will never fit properly in a round hole, and if the holes are temporary and constantly changing and moving it is even more imperative to identify proper technique, timing and the adaptibility to change as the circumstances change.
It is also important to remember that the higher calibre of training partner the less "concrete" these things are and the more 'fluid' they become. No one who is experienced is going to let you stand up, post on their throat and whale away...there will be a strong counter as to any other technique in MMA. So rather than saying a technique is wrong, it is reality that every technique has flaws and counters - that is why we keep studying, practicing, competing and training with others better than ourselves, to reduce the likelihood of being without a strategy in any scenario.
*(lots of guys will be able to withstand the shots from above and you have to remember they are well experienced in defending them...excellent example of tremendous defence is Joe Doerksen against Joe Riggs in UFC 49. Even though he lost, Joe D. withstood tremendous aggression from the very strong Joe R.)
The thing to remember is that seeing the opportunity for the right technique is an extremely important part of grappling, mma, whatever. A square peg will never fit properly in a round hole, and if the holes are temporary and constantly changing and moving it is even more imperative to identify proper technique, timing and the adaptibility to change as the circumstances change.
It is also important to remember that the higher calibre of training partner the less "concrete" these things are and the more 'fluid' they become. No one who is experienced is going to let you stand up, post on their throat and whale away...there will be a strong counter as to any other technique in MMA. So rather than saying a technique is wrong, it is reality that every technique has flaws and counters - that is why we keep studying, practicing, competing and training with others better than ourselves, to reduce the likelihood of being without a strategy in any scenario.
*(lots of guys will be able to withstand the shots from above and you have to remember they are well experienced in defending them...excellent example of tremendous defence is Joe Doerksen against Joe Riggs in UFC 49. Even though he lost, Joe D. withstood tremendous aggression from the very strong Joe R.)
I've been armbarred from that position before...I've also toughed it out.
