Girlie Man Economics

[michaeledward]

Arnold reported last night that the government numbers say everything is swell when it comes to the economy. The Wall Street Journal has a different look at that information. Do you have any thoughts on this?

http://bigpicture.typepad.com/comments/2004/09/inflation_data_.html

Favorable inflation numbers should be giving President Bush a boost in his re-election campaign. But while official figures show inflation remaining in check, consumers are being pinched by higher prices and that could affect votes in November. At the Sam's Club warehouse store here, Jim Long now buys food in bulk and complains he can no longer afford steak.


Recently, everyday expenses seem to belie government statistics. The Labor Department's July inflation report found prices rose 3% over the previous 12 months, down a bit from 3.3% in June and still low by historical standards.

Because food and energy prices can be volatile, economists often look at a gauge that excludes those categories to measure underlying inflation trends. The index, which includes prices for goods such as housing, furniture and cars, has increased at an annual rate of 1.8% in the past year.


​

The Federal Reserve in July pronounced "underlying inflation" to be "relatively low" and said that some of the recent rise in prices "seems to reflect transitory factors."


For consumers who have been paying about $2 a gallon for gasoline, $5 or more a pound for steak and $3 for a gallon of milk, inflation seems to be a lot higher than the government numbers indicate.
...
"The problem is, the everyday citizen still doesn't feel like there's a recovery. They judge it by the price of a quart of milk, a loaf of bread or a gallon of gasoline," says Robert Denton, a professor of political communication at Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University in Blacksburg, Va.

Lower-income voters say they are worried about increased commodity prices, although consumers overall think inflation will remain at an annual rate of about 3% over the next 12 months, according to the University of Michigan consumer survey. Consumers also believe housing prices are too high, and there is widespread concern among older Americans about rising out-of-pocket health-care costs, says Richard Curtin, director of the university's consumer surveys.

But prices are only part of what is driving consumer unease. Some feel a pinch because their wages have risen less than prices. In July, average weekly earnings of production and nonsupervisory workers in the U.S., adjusted for inflation, were down 0.7% from a year earlier.

That is little comfort to consumers who seem to pay more attention to higher prices for food and gasoline. Prices of meat and poultry are 9.2% higher than a year ago, dairy products are up 14%, and gasoline has jumped 26%, according to the Labor Department.​

​

 

[Phoenix44]

Well, let's see...in the past year I lost my job, and found a new one that pays less. I lost my health insurance, and had to pay for COBRA. My gas and electric went up. My local taxes went up. My school taxes went up, since the federal government left some children behind.

And that's just me. As for the rest of the country, let's see...poverty has increased. We lost nearly 2 million jobs, very few of which have re-appeared. An additional 5 million people lost their health insurance. And the number of people in poverty has increased.

Yeah, I'd question the concept of an economic recovery.

 

[Makalakumu]

Yeah, I'd question the concept of an economic recovery.

Then you would be a "Girly Man".

Man, I hate this misogynist tripe. It implies that complainers just can't cut it, that they are girly because girls are weak. I can't believe that in this day and age things like this are eaten up and applauded.

I feel a berserk rage coming on...byebye :flame:

upnorthkyosa :jedi1:

 

[Spud]

Again, nothing but sound bites coming out of the conventions. Girlie Economics will be part of American Vernacular for some time, but few will remember what the context was or how the economy was performing at the time.

I can't remember anything about Newt's Contract With America, but the phrase caught. Few will remember Howard Dean except for the I have a scream footage. Anybody remember anything about Michael Dukakis other than the stupid tank photo?

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Man, I hate this misogynist tripe. It implies that complainers just can't cut it, that they are girly because girls are weak. I can't believe that in this day and age things like this are eaten up and applauded.

THANK YOU. Man, that got me so ticked off, watching the RNC last night.... and his stupid "Terminator" "I'll be back" reference... especially since he was talking about a wounded soldier... it just seemed to fluff and trivialize the issues *even more*.

 

[loki09789]

THANK YOU. Man, that got me so ticked off, watching the RNC last night.... and his stupid "Terminator" "I'll be back" reference... especially since he was talking about a wounded soldier... it just seemed to fluff and trivialize the issues *even more*.

Like it or not but "Arnoldisms" were a HUGE part of what created a modern definition of 'tough' not just 'manly' in America through his movies and fitness celebrity. Arnold has been very Euro/old school about his gender sensitivity for EVER. I love the fact that his obviously Democratic wife kept pulling down the "4 MORE YEARS" sign that their child kept raising to cheer old Arnold on during the speech.

I agree that these types of sound bites are cliche/trivializing to a degree, but maybe the attempt isn't to dupe the audience of already converted supporters but to 'play' to them a bit. Heck the Bush girls were up there talking about their mother being able to "Shake it like a Polaroid Picture" when she wanted to be all hip hoppy. I think the general speech tone that the Convention strategists are trying to use is one of 'campiness' and not taking themselve so seriously while they try to talk about serious topics.... is it working? It seems to be working from the floor reaction (though the older members didn't like the Bush girls' comments sometimes by the facial reactions).

Either convention is a pep rally. There isn't going to be much reasonable presentation, fairness or equal and balanced presentation of the issues. THere will be pump up speeches and rah rah talks....the nature of a pep rally.

 

[Cryozombie]

Either convention is a pep rally. There isn't going to be much reasonable presentation, fairness or equal and balanced presentation of the issues. THere will be pump up speeches and rah rah talks....the nature of a pep rally.

Exactly... I didnt see a lot of "Yay for the Republicans!" and "Hooray for what Bush has done for America" durring the DNC...

Ive said it before, and I will say it again... If you look for Evil, chances are you will Find Evil...

 

[Gary Crawford]

Anrold really hit it out of the park!

 

[michaeledward]

Anrold really hit it out of the park!

I thought the Governor gave a very good speech. When talking about the draw of the United States and the ability to succeed as an immigrant, his personal story and passion was very persuasive.

I think when he called to rally around President Bush, he was less effective.

"The president didn't go into Iraq because the polls told him it was popular. As a matter of fact, the polls said just the opposite. But leadership isn't about polls. It's about making decisions you think are right and then standing behind those decisions. That's why America is safer with George W. Bush."
​

This statement is a bit disingenuous, as the Administration did everything in its power, some of which were dishonest, to get the American polls to show support for the invasion.

I also didn't understand the 'I'll be back' reference from the disabled serviceman. Could the serviceperson mean that he wanted to get back to his mates in the service, rather than back to fighting in Iraq?

And that Arnold is pro-choice and supports gay-rights is very much at odds with the Republican Party Platform. Odd that he got a prime time spot.

But yes ... Oh, So Much Better than Jenna, Barbara & Laura. But he is no Barack O'Bama.

 

[Xequat]

Both sides inflate the numbers to fit what they're trying to say. Unemployment is actuall very good, at 5.5% (Clinton's best was 5.4, I believe). Seems good for Bush, right? Well, the overall income is down, though. So, yes, there is a very good number of people employed, but they make less money overall.

The inflation rate is excellent. This one says that prices are up 3%, but according to the New York Times, the governemt figure is 1.9%. Either way, the examples given in the cited article here are exceptions. Steak prices are up because of that jackass Dr. Atkins, and poultry prices are also up because of demand. It's not like everything had gone up by that large a percentage, just certain, specific things. Gas prices are the only thing that might in any way be affected by government, but you'll still have supply and demand, and that's a law of economics that no President can change. It's largely up to OPEC, not Bush or Kerry, to lower fuel prices. What the President can do is not change prices, but search for alternative fuel sources, which Bush has been doing, and Kerry will also do. They're both pretty equal on that issue, I think.

 

[kelly keltner]

I thought the Governor gave a very good speech. When talking about the draw of the United States and the ability to succeed as an immigrant, his personal story and passion was very persuasive.

I think when he called to rally around President Bush, he was less effective.

"The president didn't go into Iraq because the polls told him it was popular. As a matter of fact, the polls said just the opposite. But leadership isn't about polls. It's about making decisions you think are right and then standing behind those decisions. That's why America is safer with George W. Bush."
​

This statement is a bit disingenuous, as the Administration did everything in its power, some of which were dishonest, to get the American polls to show support for the invasion.

I also didn't understand the 'I'll be back' reference from the disabled serviceman. Could the serviceperson mean that he wanted to get back to his mates in the service, rather than back to fighting in Iraq?

And that Arnold is pro-choice and supports gay-rights is very much at odds with the Republican Party Platform. Odd that he got a prime time spot.

But yes ... Oh, So Much Better than Jenna, Barbara & Laura. But he is no Barack O'Bama.

I dont know. Those Bush women are kinda hot. Ha Ha HA lol
kell

 

[Spud]

Anrold really hit it out of the park!

[font=&quot]I couldn’t hear his speech over the pizza parlor noise. But Arnold’s choice for the yellow tie and white shirt was appalling. I certainly expected better. [/font]

 

[Makalakumu]

Either convention is a pep rally. There isn't going to be much reasonable presentation, fairness or equal and balanced presentation of the issues. THere will be pump up speeches and rah rah talks....the nature of a pep rally.

I take the conventions more seriously because they present the emotions they want to use to fire up their base. I think that the feelings expressed during the convention are more genuine then you think. Humans are emotional creatures. Our group mechanics and who we follow are based, to a large degree, upon them.

upnorthkyosa

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Steak prices are up because of that jackass Dr. Atkins, and poultry prices are also up because of demand.

Um, no. Those are controlled by agribusiness, for the most part.

 

[Xequat]

And how does agribusiness set their prices? They determine, like every other business in the history of sales, the most that people are willing to pay for a product, then they charge that much. I think I see what you're saying, but the sales of eggs and meat, etc. happen to coincide with the acceptance of the Atkins diet, which stresses low carbs and high protein. Since tons more people buy eggs and meat which have fewer carbohydrates and more protein, the prices have risen. It's a law of economics...supply and demand.

 

[shesulsa]

Atkins had some to do with it, but the biggest players are the business owners themselves. What happened with the beef and dairy industries is the same thing that happened to the power and petroleum industries - they cut the supply so they could demand more dollars and get it.

Electric companies closed down some of their plants and transfer stations - not because they were losing money, not because they were in any danger of it, not because they weren't turning a hefty profit, but because they got greedy. The petroleum industry has done this twice and gotten away with it too. When MAD COW became prevalent, some cattle farmers reduced their headcount drastically. If you can't increase demand, reduce supply so you can hike your rates.

These industries keep getting away with things like this and I think I know where this is going. Anyone else here remember how the USSR used to have toilet paper lines? $30.00 per roll. Yee Haw - break out the rags and bleach!

 

[Feisty Mouse]

Um... what she-sulsa said!

:lurk:

 

[loki09789]

I take the conventions more seriously because they present the emotions they want to use to fire up their base. I think that the feelings expressed during the convention are more genuine then you think. Humans are emotional creatures. Our group mechanics and who we follow are based, to a large degree, upon them.

upnorthkyosa

Never said that the "Pep Rally" was in any way trivial or lacked significant impact, it sets the tone, emotional/philosophical and intellectual/rationale that each party will move on to the next phases on these elections with in hand as they campaign.

Are the feelings genuine? You betcha they are. My point was not that these events are trivial but that they are designed to be PROMOTIONAL not fair representations. They are meant to create positive feelings and such.

You don't walk into Church/Temple (making a philosophical analogy here NOT A RELIGION VS POLITICS tangent!) during a sacred Celebration or Holy rememberance (such as Easter or Hanakah - sorry for the mispelling going phonetic here) and make a fair and historically accurate representation of the event, you focus on the positiveness and significance it has in supporting/affirming your the principles and values of YOUR GROUP. Same same with the conventions, they are philosophical (though political not religious) gatherings to excite people about what is good and positive about their group/philosophy and history.

I am reading some serious generalizations going on here from some postings/posters as well and I don't know if it is to make a point or if it is actual belief. THere are such things as Conservative Democrats and Liberal Republicans BTW... and I am sure that intraparty rivalries are just as ugly at times as interparty rivalries because of orthodoxical and philosophical differences.

I stand on my point that consensus that accomplishes common goals is the way to be healthy. The process is as it is because it was partially intended to be clunky and cumbersome so that no one person/party/branch could usurp power in swift strokes.... TRUE sociopolitical change doesn't happen in one term or even one generation. POLICIES will be changed, but the living expression takes time. Too many times "special interest types" (please read the extremists not the general protest/activists who lobby and support their chosen cause) are so short sighted and narrowly focused on "their cause" that they don't consider the wholistic impact of shifting the tables to favor their cause over other issues OR the consequences of forcing immediate policy changes by what ever tactics (legal, professional or otherwise) will have in the long run.

People criticize the Homeland security issues and how they were implemented too quickly and without fore thought, do we want the same problems with other well intentioned but poorly administrated issues because of sometimes illegally protested issue because the "special interest group" bullies a politician into doing what they want?

 

[loki09789]

I got neg rep points for my last post with the Religious analogy in it with a question about why does "everything have to be Religion" BUT the author/source chose not to include his/her ID so I will answer it here.

I was using religion simply as a parallel philosophy that has group meetings and seasonal events with an agenda/purpose. Politics, religion and family cultures are really the most commonly found 'living philosophical' organizations you will find today so I simply wanted to illustrate that within Religion, seasonal or special gatherings are for the purpose of something, usually a rememberance or celebration of some kind. That type of agenda does not lend itself to a 'fair or historical representation of the situation.' People don't celebrate Christmas as Christians for the purpose of representing archeological/anthropological evidence that it never happened for an objective representation....

In that same philosophical mentallity, people don't hold Political conventions so that they can fairly and equitably present the issues/platforms or candidates. They are there to rally around thier leaders/candidates/issues .... as a celebration and to motivate them.

I hope that explains how I was using the topic of religion to who ever decided to be critical but anonymous.

 

[kenpo tiger]

The Governator was a great choice for whipping up the enthusiasm and spirit Paul referred to in his posts. I agree that that is primarily what these gatherings are useful for and why they are done.

I will admit to having left town this past week to give the GOP some room to spend some $$, but apparently that didn't happen to the extent expected or hoped for.

I thought Arnie's speech was interesting in that he was allowed to represent a segment of society most (wealthy) Republicans don't want to be associated with - immigrants. He is the epitome of the American Dream come true - a movie star, governor of one of the largest states in America, and married to a Kennedy who is/was a tv personality. (c'mon - those are the MOST dominant genes I've seen in a long time.)

Are the Republicans accepting 'girlie man' mentality? Is that why Dubya was sounding so much like a Democrat during the beginning and middle of his acceptance speech last night? KT