Can we compare our jump turning kicks?

[Runs With Fire]

Trying to better my areal kicks, I had asked a taekwondo friend of mine to help me out with jump turning kicks. I realized that his and mine were two totally different executions. His jump turning round looked like what I would call a windmill kick with a round kick delivery where you are completing a 360 degree turn and kicking into the direction of rotation. I was taught ,for all of my jump turning kicks, to start with a turning almost as if doing a standard turning kick then launch myself up bringing both feet off the ground and knees toward my chest , complete a 180 degree turn , and peform a round kick at the zenith of hang time.
That being said I am interested in a description of your jump turning kicks for comparison's sake. I will try and ad a video of my kicks later this weekend.

 

[Human Makiwara]

The kicks you described are two different techniques. One delivers a quick straight line body shot and the other a hooking/looping head kick. Each are excellent ways to score points. Both require great speed to execute.

In sparring/kumite I try to work either of them with an opponent that is circling toward the side I'll be coming around on. They end up walking right into it.

These kicks are easily telegraphed unless you are VERY fast. Skilled partners won't let you get them off very often.

 

[Runs With Fire]

I guess I am interested in terminology and techniques in various groups. what would be a jump turning kick to you?

The kicks you described are two different techniques. One delivers a quick straight line body shot and the other a hooking/looping head kick. Each are excellent ways to score points. Both require great speed to execute.

In sparring/kumite I try to work either of them with an opponent that is circling toward the side I'll be coming around on. They end up walking right into it.

These kicks are easily telegraphed unless you are VERY fast. Skilled partners won't let you get them off very often.

 

[Runs With Fire]

The kicks you described are two different techniques. One delivers a quick straight line body shot and the other a hooking/looping head kick. Each are excellent ways to score points. Both require great speed to execute.

In sparring/kumite I try to work either of them with an opponent that is circling toward the side I'll be coming around on. They end up walking right into it.

These kicks are easily telegraphed unless you are VERY fast. Skilled partners won't let you get them off very often.

Is sparring equivalent with kumite? I am not familiar with the word kumite.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Just a suggestion, but the way I do my jump turning kicks, is to simply jump up, after what ever foot maneuver, and tuck your legs directly beneath you.

 

[kuniggety]

Is sparring equivalent with kumite? I am not familiar with the word kumite.

The literal translation is set/group/company of hands. It is the Japanese term used for sparring.

For the topic at hand, I was taught they're only to be used as "finishing" moves. Unless the person is drunk or already beaten down, they telegraph themselves and are slow to pull off despite looking flashy. In defense of it: Back in the day I would step back, but nowadays as more of a trained grappler I would step in.

 

[Human Makiwara]

Sparring is called kumite in our gym.

 

[Buka]

RWF, are you comfortable with your hang time?

It's not neccessary to equate hang time with distance, or athleticism. In fact, I believe that's a drawback/mistake that most young, athletic kickers assume.

Hang time is only important for training - or perhaps better put, important for training yourself in the nuances of jump kicks. But only if you actually want to land them against an opponent. If the kick is just for show, it really doesn't matter.

I have a suggestion for a drill that might help.

 

[Runs With Fire]

They certainly do have limited use outside of class. Myself, I have always been a fan of stepping in against most anything airborne and flailly, just as long as I thought I was quicker than the kick. My biggest reason to work on these lately is that I have quite neglected all jumping, flying, flipping, spinning kicks for a few years due to inherent back problems. My back is getting stronger and my second dan test is January sixteenth, so I want to be operating at peak performance.

 

[Runs With Fire]

RWF, are you comfortable with your hang time?

It's not neccessary to equate hang time with distance, or athleticism. In fact, I believe that's a drawback/mistake that most young, athletic kickers assume.

Hang time is only important for training - or perhaps better put, important for training yourself in the nuances of jump kicks. But only if you actually want to land them against an opponent. If the kick is just for show, it really doesn't matter.

I have a suggestion for a drill that might help.

I agree wholeheartedly. I am trying to develop the nuance, a finesse for them. In tournaments, the only kicks I have ever used are basics: front kick, side kick, and round kick. Oh and a stationary jumping round kick from the back leg. That was my only tko.
I would have added video clips by now if it weren't for compatability issues between my old camera and new computer.

 

[Koshiki]

Just a suggestion, but the way I do my jump turning kicks, is to simply jump up, after what ever foot maneuver, and tuck your legs directly beneath you.

Yeah. The spinning jump kicks my style does, consist of a variety of footwork, basically anything that turns you around, and then a pump with the non-kicking leg and tuck, and a jump and kick with the other, then feet back on the ground ASAP. The non-kicking leg should be back on the ground before the kicking leg. The spin is separate from the jump. Obviously, the two get blended together, but it's more or less spin, then do a jump kick. You are not in the air while spinning.

Yes, you can do them with more hang time, and they look better, but for practicality, if we can talk about practical jump spinning kicks, airborne time should be minimized as much as possible.

Personally, they're fun, but I can't recall ever having used one with another person. Jump front kick, side kick, round kick, knee strikes, sure, they're great to aggressively close a gap in a long-distance sparring context. Jump spinning kicks, to me, seem like they're sort of an execution technique, you know, you've already won and the other guy is leaned over, gasping, hands on his knees, not moving and trying not to pass out. So you, you know, smash everything you've got into the side of his head, because you're a bad guy.

I still remember the exact day and location I first learned a turning jump kick. The guy teaching me walked me through it, had me practice it in parts, explained some mechanics, and had me practice a few times. At which point he said, "Wow, you're picking that up really fast. Now never do that to anyone. You'll take their head off." And walked away. He was a fan of dramatic teaching. And also not a fan of showy techniques.

Anyway, that's how we do (for whatever reason) spinning jump kicks. Personally, I find out-in crescents to be extremely powerful

 

[Runs With Fire]

Here is the video of my jump turning side kick. I threw in a few jump turning round kicks as well.
Basically it is a twisting jump then turn and kick all in the air. Now, the jump turning round, that one is tricky.