Basics, Basics, Basics

[Goldendragon7]

Probably the most important part of Kenpo (or any martial art for that matter) is the basics and their development. After all, those of us with strong American Kenpo backgrounds that were close to Ed Parker (not just attended seminars occasionally) or that have trained with his top students, know that this is paramount.

The Kenpo system that Ed Parker left us with is unparalleled if one really knows the in's and out's of it. There is rime and reason to everything. His life's work is outlined in his Infinite Insights series. Although not all is clear, hints are there if one knows how and where to look.

Although there are 3 divisions or our Art, Basics are prevalent in all the areas. The better acquainted you get with these basics the greater your skill will be as you progress. Many of the problems or issues that arise in training usually are traced back to either non existent or inadequate basics development. Proper understanding and delivery of torque (rotation) of the arms and body is a huge factor, stabilization of base, timing of the various parts of the body to achieve unified body harmony etc.

Many do not realize that the forms, sets and self defense techniques are just drills designed to develop these areas to their max. Sure there are many other factors that we learn from these tools as well, such as coordination (which incidentally is one of the most basic and fundamental necessities in the early stages of training), physical exercise, awareness, speed, multi striking, cross & same-side limb coordination, and much much more. However, without the emphasis on the basic development of body mechanics, you will never achieve your maximum potential. How can you deliver a strong punch or kick if you are off balance or your body is not coordinated to execute the physical actions needed? To block a punch, kick or any type of attack (I am not even talking about the ability to intercept or react to an attack stimulus, which is an area entirely unto itself) takes much practice on many factors and conditioning (mental as well as physical) to become skilled.

The different areas of our system were developed and organized to achieve just the results many of us desire. Yet, I see so often many getting into a specified area of a training drill (such as: is it supposed to be a backfist or a sword hand strike here) in which the realistic answer could be either.

Don't Major in Minor things. Look to what is really necessary to be a great martial artist. That answer is BASICS.

If I gather 25 different Kenpo Instructors together, and we watch 3 students doing a variety of different Kenpo movements, I can guarantee that no matter what specific technique or variation of the same is executed, no matter what "version" of that form or set is, we all will agree on the execution of great basics.

Body rotation
Balance
Foot and hand formations
Realm of actions (outer rim)
Coordination
Awareness (eye contact and positions)
Foundation development
Summation of force
Directional Harmony
others...


your thoughts...........

:asian:

 

[Simon Curran]

Thank you sir,

great stuff,
I just got the Infinfite Insights books, and am busy reading #1, all the while Mr Parker's writing stresses basics, development of basics, and application of basics, but to see the basics listed as such puts things into context, stuff I have obviously always worked on but never realised...
If that makes any sense...

 

[Goldendragon7]

Thank you sir, great stuff, I just got the Infinite Insights books, and am busy reading #1, all the while Mr. Parker's writing stresses basics, development of basics, and application of basics, but to see the basics listed as such puts things into context, stuff I have obviously always worked on but never realized...

Well the truth is..... you can know all the mental knowledge (curriculum, principles, sequential orders, forms, sets, freestyle drills, sayings, pledges, analogies, breakdowns, patterns etc. etc.....) you want, but if you can not move in a coordinated and efficient manner physically..... it won't matter. If you can't rotate into your blocks and strikes, then all the delayed swords will be useless. Just LOGIC and fact.

Now you know what the salutation means...... physical (iron worker) AND mental (watch maker) or some say Warrior and Scholar.


:asian:

 

[Simon Curran]

Once again thanks sir, the "ping" light just went on again...

 

[Seabrook]

Dennis,

I couldn't agree more with you.

My questions for you are this:

(1) What is your take on the quality of basics of American Kenpoists today as as opposed to when you were going through the ranks?

I see a LOT of variability in the quality of basics in AK black belts, but I would be interested in your overall assessment.

(2) Are basics classes (i.e. bag work, pad training, sparring drills) being underutilized, on average, in AK schools today? If so, do you think this has to do with the over-analytical approach that some instructors take when teaching students self-defense techniques? Or perhaps are instructors too concerned about their students learning all of the required material for testing purposes, rather than being concerned in their overall basic fundamentals?


Jamie Seabrook
www.seabrook.gotkenpo.com

 

[Goldendragon7]

Dennis, I couldn't agree more with you. My questions for you are this:

(1) What is your take on the quality of basics of American Kenpoists today as opposed to when you were going through the ranks?

I see a LOT of variability in the quality of basics in AK black belts, but I would be interested in your overall assessment.

Jamie Seabrook

The quality of basics of American Kenpo today is exactly the same as it was when I came up thru the ranks. Depending upon the quality and emphasis of the material taught and trained by the individual instructor will depend on the quality of the basics. There were great instructors back then, and there are great instructors today. Keep in mind, the amount of "mental" knowledge 35 to 40 years ago was 75% less than today, so the main emphasis was on what was prevalent during that time ....... the physical execution of basics.

The difference that I notice is the lack of actually teaching and more importantly the training of those basics today. My original instructors (Lonny Coots, Gary Swan, & Steve LaBounty, ) were train-a-tholics they paid close attention to details and physical execution with loads of drills. We developed strong students back then and there is no difference today except more understanding of said material with added mental knowledge.

The general climate of the world today however, has IMHO became somewhat soft, there is soooo much material now (pledges, sayings, principles, forms, sets, principles, system architecture Kenpo tools defined and much more information in books that have been published by Ed Parker) that few want to really learn the system and physically train hard. Most spend time with too much of the mental aspects and not enough physical drilling. Lots of red stripes with little or no back up to support the ranks in either knowledge, teaching ability, or demonstrateable skill has seemingly become the goal.

(2) Are basics classes (i.e. bag work, pad training, sparring drills) being underutilized, on average, in AK schools today?

If so, do you think this has to do with the over-analytical approach that some instructors take when teaching students self-defense techniques?

Or perhaps are instructors too concerned about their students learning all of the required material for testing purposes, rather than being concerned in their overall basic fundamentals?
Jamie Seabrook

As I stated prior Yes I believe that many of the physical training drills ARE being underutilized or emphasized, but again it depends on the instructor, I know of a few instructors that still put out killer students (although not necessarily well known globally) I would definitely want them in my corner.

Yes, some do over analyze but that has always been the case. There are some very well known Kenpoists from the '60's that learned how do develop technique variations and made their living by teaching hundreds of similar movements, thus creating a huge system that is dominant with redundancy (IMHO). I mean why keep learning (and spending years continually memorizing) several hundred variations for belt ranks when you can learn the "keys" and let the student (at 3rd Black and higher) use these keys and develop new arrangements for themselves. Constantly memorizing sequences all his life and never be able to concentrate on the fundamental keys till he is old and grey defies logic.

Many instructors are concerned with keeping the studios doors open. That equates to allowing the general public to dictate progress by having to promote people to ranks they don't necessarily deserve.

I maintain, that if the instructor is better versed in his system and sales ability, he can teach and develop an attitude with his students that show them the way to quality and reality with what he is teaching and not just the issue of what their friends at another studio have achieved (you know...... the .... "Joe my friend at the other club in town received his black belt in 2 years" kind of stuff).

Having depth of knowledge on our system is paramount but then teaching and drilling that depth in all the aspects are equally important!

You learn to become more knowledgeable, you train to become more proficient, you teach to gain more understanding. Then, you learn to forget, you forget to become instinctive.

"Basics are the Heart of the Art"

:asian:

 

[Seabrook]

I mean why keep learning (and spending years continually memorizing) several hundred variations for belt ranks when you can learn the "keys" and let the student (at 3rd Black and higher) use these keys and develop new arrangements for themselves. Constantly memorizing sequences all his life and never be able to concentrate on the fundamental keys till he is old and grey defies logic.

:asian:

Thanks for the input Dennis. One more question if I may.

I have several students who have all of the AK techniques memorized, along with all of the forms and sets - and are darn good at them. But what about those adult students who just can't for the life of them remember all of the names of techniques, and have trouble remembering so many techniques?

In many respects, I see the advantages of the 16 technique system over the 24, although there's many people I know that think the 16 technique system is by comparison garbage. But even with the 16 system, I have a few students in their fifties that are really struggling with the memorization process. What do you typically do with these students?

Cheers,

Jamie Seabrook
www.seabrook.gotkenpo.com

 

[Goldendragon7]

Thanks for the input. One more question if I may.
What about those adult students ( I have a few students in their fifties that are really struggling with the memorization process) who just can't for the life of them remember all of the names of techniques, and have trouble remembering so many techniques?
Jamie Seabrook

Heyyyyyyyy watch it on the fifties thing............. :whip: I resemble that remark......:ultracool jk (be kind to us old folks) take your dose of patience pills when dealing with this group.....

I have had relatively little problem with this. The solution is for the older students is simply.... practice - practice - pracitce. Most older students don't take or have the time that kids do since they have jobs, bills, obligations etc., etc., so many don't put in the time that they should/need to be familiar with the material.

Many instructors make this worse by teaching to much material to the students before it is absorbed properly and thus compounding the problem. Training (synonymous with repetition) is the answer. I have adjusted my teaching methods to accomplish this in many ways.... I review constantly with students which has 2 benefits..... 1) it reviews and imbeds the material.... 2) serves as great physical conditioning at the same time... thus killing 2 birds with 1 stone, but it has to be done consistently, lesson after lesson.... group or private.

Pete and re-pete were in a boat...... Pete fell out who was left? You answer.... ____________ then I say Pete and re-pete were in a boat...... Pete fell out who was left? lol

In many respects, I see the advantages of the 16 technique system over the 24, although there's many people I know that think the 16 technique system is by comparison garbage.
Jamie Seabrook

Well, I have used ALL the different curriculums...... from the 600 to the 32 to the 24 and now I have been using the 16 technique system for nearly 18 years and I find tons of benefits. As to the opposition to the 16..... well, each to his own. The 16 "arrangement" is the same as the 24 in content just spread out a bit (which really helps with the problem you are having) so I don't understand the "garbage" part myself (guess I'm just a little more educated on the subject :uhyeah since I was involved with it when Mr. Parker was organizing it (just as he did when he adjusted and developed the early "open" curriculum of hundreds into the 32 set in the '60's, then turned the 32 set into the 24 set about 10 years prior).

So, you tell me why some criticize what Mr. Parker did....... to me if they criticize one series ..... they must have to feel the same about the rest... hmmmmm unless they are in a comfort zone and like what they were taught and used to..... hmmmmm I wonder. LOL

At any rate.... IMHO the bottom line is.... it doesn't matter if you use the 32, 24, or the 16..... they are all Ed Parker's works and the main issues are the principles and Kenpo Tools that drive any of these different curriculums regardless of the arrangements. Look at the Primary Points to the art and not the minuscule irrelevant arrangements. Learning is learning no matter what the arrangement. Learn the Art and don't spend time wondering about arrangements. Logic me thinks. LOL

:asian:

 

[Seabrook]

Cool. Thanks Dennis. I agree with your analogies of the 32, 24, and 16 technique system.

Jamie Seabrook

www.seabrook.gotkenpo.com

 

[Touch Of Death]

I think the most underappreciated basic you mentioned is the outer rim theory. There is another thread in the Hopkido section asking when and where parries start and what maneuvers you would use to acheive them, and my answer would be that blocks and parries arent what you do, but what happens when your opponent strikes and you use the outer rim theory. It can also be a deciding factor in what tech you perform against a given attack. Just a question for y'all to chew on... Is the egg right side up or upside down? why?
Sean

 

[michaeledward]

I wish we did a bit more training on basics in my studio. It would seem to make much more sense as a warm up than the calisthenics we perform. Early on in my training, we were reviewing material before a test, and the instructor started calling out basics with which I was completely unfamiliar.

Well, not completely unfamiliar, I had seen the basics listed on the left side of the belt journal, but we never reviewed them. There is just not enough of this training ... I am a bit more concious of the basics today.

Concerning how 'hard' we train .... I want to train hard enough to push myself, but not so hard that I punish myself. As the body ages, being able to get up for work in the morning is, perhaps, a bit more important than proving how tough (or is it stupid) I am. I want an honest work-out of body and brain.

I have been training for a bit over four years now. When I leave the studio, I almost always feel better than when I arrived at the studio. Why wouldn't I continue

Mike

 

[Goldendragon7]

I think the most underappreciated basic you mentioned is the outer rim theory. Sean

Well, if you overreach or don't reach far enough you could find yourself in a jam. LOL..... I don't know if it is underappreciated but it certainly is an essential part of our range awareness and usefulness.

:asian:

 

[Goldendragon7]

It would seem to make much more sense as a warm up than the calisthenics we perform.
Early in my training, we were reviewing material before a test, and the instructor started calling out basics with which I was completely unfamiliar. I am a bit more conscious of the basics today.
Mike

I love to start class with either running in place for a couple of minutes or jumping rope. A few classic calisthenics are not bad but I don't do tons of them (only about 5-10 minutes) when I can achieve the same or better success with our Kenpo Basics.

Doing power punching and running through several of the hand movements (blocks, parries, punches, strikes, finger techniques etc. etc.) and within different stances, can be very physically demanding not to mention developmentally great.

:ultracool

 

[Touch Of Death]

Well, if you overreach or don't reach far enough you could find yourself in a jam. LOL..... I don't know if it is underappreciated but it certainly is an essential part of our range awareness and usefulness.

:asian:

What I meant was that even with the theory, people block when they don't have to, and that blocks become parries (or make no contact what so ever) at the angle change. Over reach is only part of the lesson.

 

[Simon Curran]

The thing is, I think, that a lot of instructorswill work basics, just not categorize them as such, that has been my experience at least, since my instructor always has us warming up with stance training / bag work / blocking / kicking set etc...

Just my observation.:asian:

 

[Rich Parsons]

DC,

Not a Kenpo Practitioner, but a question if you would not mind?

Could you see or imagine the basics changing over time for the same person?
Meaning could you see what a person beleives or thinks are the basics, get new basics etc, ..., as they train and learn more?

Thank you

 

[Goldendragon7]

The thing is, I think, that a lot of instructorswill work basics, just not categorize them as such, that has been my experience at least, since my instructor always has us warming up with stance training / bag work / blocking / kicking set etc...

Just my observation.:asian:

Well, that is possible for sure!

:asian:

 

[Goldendragon7]

DC,

Not a Kenpo Practitioner, but a question if you would not mind?

Could you see or imagine the basics changing over time for the same person?
Meaning could you see what a person believes or thinks are the basics, get new basics etc, ..., as they train and learn more?

Thank you

Don't mind at all for you Brother Parsons!!

I don't think the Basics would change over time however, I think the way in which we view or define them could. Basics are just that..... BASIC but the way in which we utilize them or view them from different perspectives as we mature could very well enhance our application and definition or usage of said basics.

Great thought!!! You 'da Man!! (or are you just trying to keep me on my toes........ LOL)

:asian:

 

[michaeledward]

A bit of cross-pollination here ... As Kenpotalk was coming on line - I had posted all of those items listed as 'BASICS' in my schools curriculum for reference and discussion on that board.

Others took up the cause and started adding their own 'BASICS' when referring to items that the school that I study at does not include as a 'BASIC', such as 'Warm-Ups'.

So, I guess this begs the question ... what is the definition of a BASIC? And sorry, GoldenDragon7, but you can't use the term to define itself ... (e.g."Basics are just that ... BASIC").

I am certain I do not have an accurate definition, and I hate to assume that we are all talking about the same thing when we use the word. So ... how about this ... or perhaps there is a more specific definition around.

Basic (bA - sik) - adj. - and individual move or position which constitutes a fundamental point or action.
​

Another definition I have :

Simplified moves that comprise the fundamentals of Kenpo. They are divided into stances, maneuvers, blocks, strikes, specialized moves and methods.
​

Does anyone have a more clear, or more official definition?

 

[Goldendragon7]

I am certain I do not have an accurate definition, and I hate to assume that we are all talking about the same thing when we use the word.

So ... What is the definition of a BASIC?

How about this ... or perhaps there is a more specific definition around.

Basic (bA - sik) - adj. - and individual move or position which constitutes a fundamental point or action.
​

Another definition I have :

Simplified moves that comprise the fundamentals of Kenpo. They are divided into stances, maneuvers, blocks, strikes, specialized moves and methods.
​

Does anyone have a more clear, or more official definition?

The following are what I use as basics ....... but not just the learning of the move itself but how it is delivered or executed, the formation of it, and/or the application.

Stances
Blocks
Parries
Punches
Strikes
Finger Techniques
Kicks
Foot Maneuvers
Body Maneuvers

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