According to this report, Boxing, BJJ, and Karate are the top three martial arts in the United States

Hanzou

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If this report is accurate, it aligns pretty well with my anecdotal experience. There's tons of boxing gyms out there, and it's pretty easy to find a boxing group at most gyms. The number of BJJ gyms have simply exploded in the last 15 years. I guess the BJJ fad is still going strong after all these years. Since there's so many Karate styles out there, I'm not surprised to see Karate be at the #3 spot.

Very surprised to see how low MMA is. I figured it would be higher. Not surprised to see how low Judo is, but I wonder if its steep decline is because of Bjj.

Anyway, I thought this was interesting.
 

elder999

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Very surprised to see how low MMA is. I figured it would be higher. Not surprised to see how low Judo is, but I wonder if its steep decline is because of Bjj.

Anyway, I thought this was interesting.
In depth, the article itself addresses various reasons why the data used can be misleading.

I'd also venture to say that there's been no "steep decline" in judo, and that pre-pandemic, anyway, the schools and places that taught it were largely the same as they'd been since the 50's and 60's: look at most judo schools and groups, and they've been around that long.....
 

dvcochran

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I do think that is a very weak approach to scraping the data.
For one, if the data was anywhere near accurate there would not be so many ties.
Secondly, there are a Ton of schools that simply use the "proper name' plus 'martial arts' moniker. Per the article, it appears these gyms were dropped from the scrape. There are more than enough schools like this to considerably skew the data.

All the 'misleading disclaimers' are valid IMHO.

School project maybe?
 
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Hanzou

Hanzou

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In depth, the article itself addresses various reasons why the data used can be misleading.

Hence why I said IF this report is accurate. :)
I'd also venture to say that there's been no "steep decline" in judo, and that pre-pandemic, anyway, the schools and places that taught it were largely the same as they'd been since the 50's and 60's: look at most judo schools and groups, and they've been around that long.....

Judoka have said otherwise;




 

isshinryuronin

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Very surprised to see how low MMA is. I figured it would be higher.
While MMA may be a popular sport on TV, this does not translate to popularity in participation. It's a lot harder to do than to watch. Even for the non-professionally minded, it is a tough, intense and often painful sport. The many skills involved require dedication to achieve. Few every-day people are interested in such an undertaking for a sport to enjoy as a pastime or hobby. Other MA offer a less rigorous regimen as well as several non-combat benefits so appeals to a wider audience.
'd also venture to say that there's been no "steep decline" in judo, and that pre-pandemic, anyway, the schools and places that taught it were largely the same as they'd been since the 50's and 60's: look at most judo schools and groups, and they've been around that long.....
I disagree, in part. There were never that many judo schools, it being pretty much unfamiliar to the West in the 50's to mid 60's. As it just did become better known, karate/kung fu took over and supplanted it. One, TV and movies popularized these arts, and two, they were more exciting and "fun" to do.

This is why I chose karate, rather than the judo I first considered. Just a few months after I started karate, the judo school around the corner went away. It became a karate school - Joe Lewis (then Chuck Norris) took it over.

While judo may have gone over a recent resurgence, thanks to Rousey and MMA, a lot of judo is taught as part of it, out of MMA gyms, so stand-alone judo schools are still few. Those that might want a grappling sport I think more look to BJJ these days.
 

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So TaeKwonDo is no longer the most practised martial art in the world, or was this a myth? If it's not even top 3 in the US...
 
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Hanzou

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While judo may have gone over a recent resurgence, thanks to Rousey and MMA, a lot of judo is taught as part of it, out of MMA gyms, so stand-alone judo schools are still few. Those that might want a grappling sport I think more look to BJJ these days.

This could definitely be the case considering how open to wrestlers BJJ is over Judo. Wrestlers are welcomed with open arms in the former, while told not to do their bread and butter in the latter.
 

elder999

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To clarify. The report said that their data came from a percentage of Yelp reviews. I replied that the dojo that were opened in the 50's and 60's are largely still around pre-pandemic, and I'll stand by that. That they never really had as many students as karate dojo, or TKD dojang, or kwoons is a given, almost, and for the reasons given by the BJJ guy in the video Hanzou posted.

Judo is hard. Especially compared to BJJ, what with the falling and throws....不

I mean, let's face it, most BJJ essentially just does judo ne-waza.

And getting back to the data provided, I will maintain that pre-pandemic, the old dojos were all still around

The dojo where U.S. Olympian judoka and bronze medal winner, Allen Coage, and my childhood nemesis, Mike Swain trained, Cranford Judo and Karate Center, is still open and has been since 1962.


And I could go on.....

The real "decline" in judo all stems from Olympic judo, and the ridiculous IJF rules....
 

isshinryuronin

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Cranford Judo and Karate Center, is still open and has been since 1962.
That is certainly an achievement! But are most current students in their 60's & 70's, or has there been continual influx of new students in recent years? Also, what do you think the draw is, as opposed to the students choosing other arts?
 
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Hanzou

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I mean, let's face it, most BJJ essentially just does judo ne-waza.

Well actually it doesnt. Bjj utilizes more simple takedowns, and their groundwork is far more complex than Judos.

The Judoka in the video I posted made a very salient point; Youre spending years in Judo and youre still struggling to throw someone even at advanced grade. Meanwhile in Bjj, you learn super easy takedowns and multiple ways to submit someone, so youre seeing positive results far more quickly.

You see this when Judoka enter Bjj tournaments; The Bjj player just guard pulls and sweeps them, completely negating their entire stand up game.
 

isshinryuronin

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I was surprised that it said there were so many boxing gyms. I've never been anywhere where there were a lot of boxing gyms, not even back in the day.
You just didn't hang out in the right neighborhoods. Not too sure nowadays, but "back in the day" boxing was big in the Hispanic areas in Los Angeles' Valley such as Pacoima and Van Nuys, producing champions such as Bobby Chacon and earlier, Art Aragon.

Not too many young guys have the stuff to do "real" boxing (rather than "hit the bag" exercise class). Those that do likely gravitate to MMA. Boxing is not the possible road out of poverty it once was for the hungry young studs. I think the hunger and drive to dedicate themselves is not as strong as it used to be (not to say that's bad - it may be an indicator that things are getting better and there is less desperation to "fight their way out."

A lot of boxing used to be done at the YMCA and Boy's Club, and a number of colleges had boxing teams as well. Hard to find that now, thanks to the kinder and more sensitive public institutions.
 

yak sao

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I noticed they have kung fu as a category and also Chinese martial arts, which is, in essence, kung fu. (Also, Tai chi is kung fu/ CMA, but for sake of discussion we'll leave that in its own category.)
Should these numbers get added together for a more accurate score?
 

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You just didn't hang out in the right neighborhoods. Not too sure nowadays, but "back in the day" boxing was big in the Hispanic areas in Los Angeles' Valley such as Pacoima and Van Nuys, producing champions such as Bobby Chacon and earlier, Art Aragon.

Not too many young guys have the stuff to do "real" boxing (rather than "hit the bag" exercise class). Those that do likely gravitate to MMA. Boxing is not the possible road out of poverty it once was for the hungry young studs. I think the hunger and drive to dedicate themselves is not as strong as it used to be (not to say that's bad - it may be an indicator that things are getting better and there is less desperation to "fight their way out."

A lot of boxing used to be done at the YMCA and Boy's Club, and a number of colleges had boxing teams as well. Hard to find that now, thanks to the kinder and more sensitive public institutions.
Yes, I led a very sheltered life, driven to school in a Silver Cloud by Rutherford, my personal valet. When we wished to box we hired people to do so for us and rooted them on as we supped.

It was jolly good. :)
 

Steve

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Perhaps. None of the results are really mind blowing, or go against common perception.
I'm actually pretty surprised. I think scraping from Yelp could be misleading. If I were going to guess, I would think TKD would be at the top. Just by sheer numbers. In my area, we have four things in just about every strip mall: a pho restaurant, a teriyaki restaurant, a Starbucks, and a TKD school. They are everywhere.

Wrestling is very popular in America, and is an intramural sport for kids all the way through high school. In my area, Judo is also a very popular school sport. I would guess if it's just sheer numbers of participants, wrestling could also be a viable number one, but because it's primarily a martial art that kids learn in school, kids aren't yelping their high school wrestling coaches. "5 stars for Coach Calvin. Great coach and he makes algebra fun, too."
 

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This doesn't surprise me at all. All three are great martial arts/martial sports when you have a good gym to train in and there seems to me more legit gyms in these styles due to frequent sparring/rolling.
 

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Well actually it doesnt. Bjj utilizes more simple takedowns, and their groundwork is far more complex than Judos.

The Judoka in the video I posted made a very salient point; Youre spending years in Judo and youre still struggling to throw someone even at advanced grade. Meanwhile in Bjj, you learn super easy takedowns and multiple ways to submit someone, so youre seeing positive results far more quickly.

You see this when Judoka enter Bjj tournaments; The Bjj player just guard pulls and sweeps them, completely negating their entire stand up game.
Interesting video.

I agree that Judo is difficult and takes a lot of training to become proficient. However, I disagree that randori is only for MMA fighters, those wanting to compete or "elite" athletes. There needs to be a certain level of skill/training before the student participates in randori for safety reasons though.

Below is a video of Travis Stevens explaining some of the differences between Judo and BJJ.
 
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Hanzou

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Interesting video.

I agree that Judo is difficult and takes a lot of training to become proficient. However, I disagree that randori is only for MMA fighters, those wanting to compete or "elite" athletes. There needs to be a certain level of skill/training before the student participates in randori for safety reasons though.

Below is a video of Travis Stevens explaining some of the differences between Judo and BJJ.

Yes, I do disagree with that aspect of the video.

In the case of the video you posted, I disagree with Stevens and believe that wrestling is a FAR better cross-trainer than Judo for Bjj if you're looking for a complimentary stand up grappling system. Wrestling doesn't have nearly the level of restrictions that Judo has, and it merges with BJJ pretty seamlessly.
 

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Yes, I do disagree with that aspect of the video.

In the case of the video you posted, I disagree with Stevens and believe that wrestling is a FAR better cross-trainer than Judo for Bjj if you're looking for a complimentary stand up grappling system. Wrestling doesn't have nearly the level of restrictions that Judo has, and it merges with BJJ pretty seamlessly.
From the twenty five second mark on, standup grappling at it's finest.

 

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