Why does MMA count as an own martial art now ?

[drop bear]

My point is that if you only play in a certain sand box you will have a "limited perspective"! That perspective could be detrimental in a personal protection situation on the street where you might need a different skill set!

What kind of environment of trading are we talking about though?

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

If those "options" are of the same quality as the grappling and other antics being showcased by Hatsumi, I'll pass. I'm sure that there's vastly superior alternatives available.

That would show just how little you have been able to observe or understand. However, if you are not interested that is cool. I have no problem with it at all. Yet, since you have not actually experienced anything in Budo Taijutsu then I think you should not be dismissive or condescending of it. You really have no frame of reference!

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

What kind of environment of trading are we talking about though?

Just training on the mats. I am a firm believer that any martial practitioner should get out of their "sand box" and experience other forms of training with different instructors. Cross training is at the core with what I do!

 

[drop bear]

That would show just how little you have been able to observe or understand. However, if you are not interested that is cool. I have no problem with it at all. Yet, since you have not actually experienced anything in Budo Taijutsu then I think you should not be dismissive or condescending of it. You really have no frame of reference!

Who's fault is that? Why would you waste time in a martial art that isn't verified anywhere?

I mean you look for good training. You dont do every bit of bad training that exists until you have isolated what works. Nobody has time for that.

 

[drop bear]

Just training on the mats. I am a firm believer that any martial practitioner should get out of their "sand box" and experience other forms of training with different instructors. Cross training is at the core with what I do!

Well yeah. But you do try and find quality guys. And train with them.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

No, if you have never trained in another system then to bag on it based on "no experience" is just being ignorant.

 

[drop bear]

No, if you have never trained in another system then to bag on it based on "no experience" is just being ignorant.

Really?

OK so you come and train drop bear fu for a class and you decide it is rubbish. Or you do compliant drills or fixed scenarios and so still have no clue whether the stuff works or it dosent.

You can't trash on a martial art after a day?

Bjj. You will know. Because a black belt will either towel you up or you will towel him up.

So how long do you give dbf with my promises of secret techniques at higher levels?

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Drop Bear the point is I wouldn't trash your martial art not after one day or seeing a video of it. I may be able to make a determination that it isn't quite for me but.... I would still respect you for what you are doing!

 

[drop bear]

Drop Bear the point is I wouldn't trash your martial art not after one day or seeing a video of it. I may be able to make a determination that it isn't quite for me but.... I would still respect you for what you are doing!

Why?

If I am peddaling garbage I should be told. Hell someone might actually fight me one day. And you haven't done me any favors by letting me believe my rubbish works.

You are being my Ronda rousey striking coach. "Yeah you can bang with holley"

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

It is kind've like someone bashing Hatsumi Sensei because they see a clip of him doing some thing that they do not like. Frankly, he is 99.9 percent better than the vast majority of martial practitioner's out there. He is also a senior to almost all of us in the Martial Sciences. His life long commitment to training and teaching has achieved him awards from around the world including FBI, DEA, Japanese Government, etc. We should all respect what he does and understand that a video clip that we might view could be a glimpse of a moment in time when he is experimenting. (like BJJ people do not experiment) To bash him, never having experienced what he does in person is frankly ignorant. Yet, we live in times when bashing people is the accepted norm. Which is sad!

 

[Hanzou]

That would show just how little you have been able to observe or understand. However, if you are not interested that is cool. I have no problem with it at all. Yet, since you have not actually experienced anything in Budo Taijutsu then I think you should not be dismissive or condescending of it. You really have no frame of reference!

Who says I have never experienced anything from Ninjutsu? You assume that since I have a different opinion about a style that I've never practiced it or experienced it? Rather arrogant don't you think?

As for observing and understanding, I observe a system that gives black belts and Dan grades like candy, and the system's originator who can't perform basic level escapes, and performs "funny" antics. That, along with my personal experience with the system leads me to my current opinion.

My frame of reference is my experience in grappling. I know garbage when I see it, and Hatsumi was performing garbage in that video I posted. Stephen Hayes also performed nonsense in another video that I posted awhile ago. What does it say when two of the highest ranked ninja in the world can't perform basic grappling?

Now, I never said don't cross train. I said that someone who practices Bjj wouldn't gain much from practicing Ninjutsu, and they should honestly look elsewhere. That said, to each their own. Some people enjoy believing that they're 16th century samurai and ninja.......

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Yet, I know BJJ blackbelts that train in Budo Taijutsu Hanzou. Obviously, their opinion differs with yours! Or maybe they just have a more informed opinion!

 

[Hanzou]

Yet, I know BJJ blackbelts that train in Budo Taijutsu Hanzou. Obviously, their opinion differs with yours! Or maybe they just have a more informed opinion!

And I know former Ninjutsu black belts and instructors who now train in Bjj and MMA and say that BT is a waste of time and a money grab.

Now what?

 

[drop bear]

It is kind've like someone bashing Hatsumi Sensei because they see a clip of him doing some thing that they do not like. Frankly, he is 99.9 percent better than the vast majority of martial practitioner's out there. He is also a senior to almost all of us in the Martial Sciences. His life long commitment to training and teaching has achieved him awards from around the world including FBI, DEA, Japanese Government, etc. We should all respect what he does and understand that a video clip that we might view could be a glimpse of a moment in time when he is experimenting. (like BJJ people do not experiment) To bash him, never having experienced what he does in person is frankly ignorant. Yet, we live in times when bashing people is the accepted norm. Which is sad!

And we come back to this point where we we can see some good ninjitsu?

We can't put protective bubbles around these people. That should not be the accepted norm either.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Listen Hanzou, I understand that you feel, think the BJJ is the great. I personally feel that BJJ is one of the best martial systems out there myself and hence why I train in it. Having said the above your personal shots on other systems on this board is distasteful to many people here. I feel you should just understand this which may also help you understand why many people just tune you out. I have very little time to devote here and getting into debates with you is really pointless to me. My point of coming into this thread was to make the point that people should "cross train" and be amenable to new experiences in the Martial Sciences. If you feel different then this, I frankly do not know what to say!

Now, I am off to watch my basketball team play so I am out for awhile. Enjoy the thread but remember "art bashing" is not allowed and people are treading close here!

 

[Steve]

I agree that sweeping generalizations should be avoided. But we do seem to be in a bit of a pickle when it comes to some assertions around here about some fundamental truths. For example, we are asked to accept on faith that there are entire styles better suited for self defense training than others, based entirely on "trust me, son, because bluntly, I'm very smart and write really long posts." doesn't set a very high bar for positive discourse.

 

[Hanzou]

Listen Hanzou, I understand that you feel, think the BJJ is the great. I personally feel that BJJ is one of the best martial systems out there myself and hence why I train in it. Having said the above your personal shots on other systems on this board is distasteful to many people here. I feel you should just understand this which may also help you understand why many people just tune you out. I have very little time to devote here and getting into debates with you is really pointless to me. My point of coming into this thread was to make the point that people should "cross train" and be amenable to new experiences in the Martial Sciences. If you feel different then this, I frankly do not know what to say!

Where did I say that cross training in of itself was a bad idea? I simply said that going from a style like Bjj to a system like BT may not be the best investment since the two diverge on a variety of points.

Now, I am off to watch my basketball team play so I am out for awhile. Enjoy the thread but remember "art bashing" is not allowed and people are treading close here!

Would that include our dear friend Chris Parker who stated that Bjj isn't really a self defense system, and stating such is tantamount to fantasy?

 

[elder999]

Would that include our dear friend Chris Parker who stated that Bjj isn't really a self defense system, and stating such is tantamount to fantasy?

NO.

 

[Steve]

NO.

No what, elder? I got a kick out of the video. The guy literally asked the same question four times to finally get Royce to answer the way he wanted. He may as well have said, "Royce, can you say something bad about your uncle and the IBJJF?"

 

[Hanzou]

NO.

Uh, he said that Bjj is a system designed for self defense and street fighting several times in that interview.