Usefullness of sparring

Discussion in 'Beginners Corner' started by watching, Mar 24, 2018.

  1. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    And every now and then, the scenario training should bring up a bit of reality. Multiple-attacker training (the way I do it) often is done very soft - it's about building a habit of movement that helps regain some control. But if I only ever do that, people tend to get a feeling of superhuman ability dealing with multiples. So every now and then, I open up the rules a bit (keeping safeguards in place), to let people lose more often. Over time, they learn to win a bit more often even under that set of rules - and they learn not to give up when they start to feel overwhelmed (which most folks seem to do early in their training).
     
  2. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    It wasn’t different, really. Teacher set the start point - rear bear hug - and said go. Defender did what I described, unscripted. Attacker gave up rather than keep going like an attacker would’ve in the heat of the moment.

    And I never really got into Street Fighter. Tekken holds my interest far more

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  3. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Movies and books often include that as part of training. And nobody ever actually gets hurt, and nobody calls the cops on them. Sometimes I wish I lived in movie-world, at least for training time.
     
  4. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    I saw a 20/20 or Nightline or similar episode a while back where there were teachers sending people to attack students from a women’s self defense course. The students knew it was coming and agreed; they just didn’t know when and where. And the attackers wore those red man suits.

    They filmed one guy hiding in a student’s garage and attacked her as she got out of the car. The woman was successful. Gee, I wonder why? How did the camera crew and the attacker get in there without her previously knowing? He came up behind her, but I’d imagine the squishiness of the red man suit probably subconsciously told her she’s it’s not real.

    Staged for tv? Absolutely. She probably wouldn’t have done as well if she genuinely didn’t know it was coming. I mean, who let the camera, lights and sound crew in? But the principle is better than simulating it in the dojo if the student genuinely didn’t know when nor where.

    Edit: Then again, maybe her husband or someone else let them in unbeknownst to her. Doubt it; TV isn’t the most honest thing out there.
     
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  5. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Senior Master

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    Ah yep Tekken too... always chose Hwoarang or Jin Kazama, some of their combinations were really cool, I even practiced one of Jin's five-hit combos on the bag a bit (I think it was oi tsuki, left jodan mawashi, gyaku tsuki, oi tsuki, right gedan mawashi)
     
  6. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    yep. some more than others. While this is a black belt test, the chances that a gang of tkd students are going to attack you in the streets is very small. For self-defense this should have contained some of the things that one would expect to see in the streets, like punches lol.


    lol that would a butt kicking because only the attacker would know that it's training. The victim would think it was real and do things they may not have normally done in a scenario.

    Sort of like how pranks go bad, where one guy jumps out to scare another and gets punched in the face.

    but like you stated there is always limitations. There's no getting around that.
     
  7. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    It's a difficult thing to do while remaining safe.
     
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  8. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    I read about a “gang” of judo players attacking a guy, sort of...

    There was a time when stealing people’s cars once they got done getting gas was fashionable. So a guy tried to steal a passenger van (one of those big ones full of seats), and timed it so he jumped in once the guy took the gas pump out of the tank filler. Unfortunately, he didn’t realize it was full of a bunch of black belt judo players on their way to a competition.

    Reportedly, they didn’t have much trouble subduing the guy. Jacking a van full of about 12 black belt judo players isn’t the best idea. Especially unarmed.
     
  9. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    That’s kind of the point, though; doing things and being in situations you wouldn’t be in in the dojo.

    Yeah, recipe for disaster. I could see the 6 o’colck news reporting about a local SD instructor accidentally getting shot because he jumped one of his students unexpectedly as part of the training.

    And it screams of the movie Fight Club to me... “His name is Robert Paulson.”
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2018
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  10. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I remember that story, too. Still one of my favorite to view in my head (since I don't think there was any video).
     
  11. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I always picture Clouseau and Kato.
     
  12. JowGaWolf

    JowGaWolf Grandmaster

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    I think I know the story that you are talking about. I had a good laugh about that, especially with how did the group end up looking like targets lol. Or was this guy just bad at picking targets.
     
  13. gpseymour

    gpseymour MT Moderator Staff Member

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    What? You don't think a vanload of athletic 20-somethings seems like a good target for a lone carjacker??

    EDIT: As I recall, it was a college Judo club.
     
  14. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    Rule number 1 should be make sure no one’s in the car. Because then you possibly get kidnapping or someone you don’t want in the car.

    Edit: actually, rule number one is no police cars. Rule number 2 is no one in the car. Both shouldn’t need to be rules, but I’m sure the level of intelligence of these guys makes it necessary.
     
  15. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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    I think you’re right about it being a college judo team.
     
  16. JR 137

    JR 137 Grandmaster

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  17. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Poor mans Sagat right there.

    We will run five or six guys one after the other. So even if you get one easy out, or even if it is easy when you start. It just gets consistently harder.

    You also get jumped more surprisingly as the minutes wear down. Because you just loose focus.
     
  18. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    We had a rebel sports store that used to be the same with shoplifters.

    We would just pick them up in the car park after they were done.
     
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  19. jobo

    jobo Grandmaster

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    Yes indeed, but no one attacks with a bear hug, well not unless they are built like a bear and just want to restrain you, far more likely is a flyIng knee in the back, a good punch in the ear, or my all time favourite, a stamp to the back of the knee, giving you the choice of smashing head first in to the floor or some serious knee damage, they won't run scenarios for them as there is no defen ce,so they just do bear hugs
     
  20. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    I attack with a bear hug. Most of the defences don't work against it.



    And turtle in a ground and pound position.123
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2018

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