Tournament time..... :)

Discussion in 'The Competitive Edge' started by _Simon_, Apr 8, 2018.

  1. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    My three favorite things that prove Lundgren’s a badass...

    1. He won the European Kyokushin open as a green belt. He had to borrow his friend’s brown belt and pretend he was a brown belt to compete.

    2. A few people broke into his house and tied up his wife and kids in a robbery attempt. When they saw him in family pictures on the wall and realized it was his house they were robbing, they fled.

    3. During filming or rehearsals for Rocky IV, Stallone wanted Lundgren to actually hit him. Lundgren hit him in the chest and put him in ICU for a few days. I think it was swelling around his heart.

    Yeah, he’s as legit as they come. He’s not a Hollywood guy who went karate; he’s a Kyokushin guy who wound up getting into acting.

    Edit: For those that don’t know much about the Kyokushin open tournaments, there’s no rank nor weight classes. So he was beating guys at 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc. dan ranks. Green belt is around 4th kyu. This was a while before he was “Ivan Drago,” so that fear and awe of Drago didn’t play any part in it. He was just another guy, albeit a jacked and badass guy :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2018
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  2. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Wow, I did not know any of those 3 things!! Truly a badass he was and is...! :eek:

    I think he's still training in Kyokushin, not 100% sure, but these look like semi-recent photos below...

    And here is a quote from him hehe:

    "Dolph tries to sum up what martial arts have meant to him: “Karate has been so important to me, it is almost impossible to imagine myself and my life without it. Every time I’ve strayed away from the martial arts, I’ve somehow lost part of myself.”
    “It was through martial arts that I confronted my insecurities, gained inner strength, broke through my own self-fabricated barriers and came into my own as a man. Karate and physical training has definitely become part of my life forever.”
    “More importantly, I believe the martial arts made me — and still makes me –a better person.”"[​IMG][​IMG]
     
  3. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    And speaking of karate and beaches... my old branch had their yearly branch camp, and every single one I'd been to, the beach training on the last day was ALWAYS cancelled due to bad weather, and the one year I didn't go, this year, they had beach training. Uuuuuugh haha I love it so much and haven't done it in ages.. and also got a bit emotional seeing the photos, missing the dojo and especially missing the camps...

    Here's a pic from the camp which is seriously one of my favourite pics...[​IMG]
     
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  4. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    I’ve read he’s kind of on and off with his formal training due to his schedule, but he still finds ways to train practically every day.

    He’s currently in Shinkyokushin, which is Kenji Midori’s Kyokushin group.

    Awesome beach training pic! We have our’s every around every 1st Sunday in August or the last Sunday of July (can’t remember which). Our summer and your summer are opposite :)

    This year’s beach training was a big event, as we celebrated our dojo’s 30th anniversary. We had a lot of out of town guests, including Kaicho and Hanshi Charles Martin. Those two didn’t train with us, but they made it in time for the after-training BBQ. We put on a small demo, and several of us broke 3 boards each as part of it. We wanted to keep it short and simple, so everyone only broke 3 rather than doing anything crazy. Breaking 3 boards seemed really easy, until I had Kaicho and Hanshi Charles sitting literally less than 10 feet in front of me watching me. It took an extra second or two to focus and block them out of my mind.

    We have ours at a lake because we’re about 3 hours away from the nearest ocean beach. Here’s a pic from one a few years back. I’m getting punched in the stomach, but it’s all good...
    72061361-38A3-4145-8E0C-BDB2DFC47B6F.jpeg

    Edit: We do our beach training the week before Honbu does theirs. I haven’t been able to go to theirs, but a few people from our dojo go. They’re in the ocean. And there’s obviously quite a lot more people.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2018
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  5. Buka

    Buka Grandmaster

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    I'd love to meet Dolph Lundgren, I'm a big fan. Dude has a masters degree in Chemical Engineering, too. That always blew my mind.

    Simon, I've been to many beach workouts over the years, took a lot of pictures. But that's one seriously cool photo.
     
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  6. Michele123

    Michele123 Green Belt

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    LOVE the beach photo!

    In my old style, since we were an ocean town, our summer classes were always held on the sandy beach. It was much more comfortable than the gym which had no AC!

    I miss those workouts a lot.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  7. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Ah yep the logo looked like Shinkyokushin.

    Awesome, love it. There's something really cleansing having a hard session in water, without getting too wishy-washy (pun very much intended! XD).

    Yep that would've been daunting breaking directly in front of Kaicho and Hanshi Charles! But so cool that they rock up though!
     
  8. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Didn't know that about Dolph either! A man of many secrets/not-so-secrets haha.

    Yeah it's such a powerful photo... and in the front row are a 7th Dan (Branch Chief), 5th Dan and 4th Dan in Kyokushin (amongst many 2nd and 1st Dans), which is quite a special thing!
     
  9. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    That would have been incredible Michele.. what fun that would be to make it a constant thing!
     
  10. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    ... okay this coming week or the next I'm gonna go do a beach training session haha. It's now the middle of spring, so starting to warm up, but all this talk has inspired me. And solo, which I've done before. I'm thinking just a strong kihon session, some moving basics and kumite combinations and footwork, and finish with kata (of course Sanchin and Tensho kata at LEAST waist high in water).

    Have been meaning to for awhile.... just me and the great expanse of the ocean...

    Also a good symbol for the start of a new chapter (throughout pretty much alot of aspects of my life at the moment...).
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2018
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  11. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    I’m surprised you didn’t train with him at one point or another :)

    He trained at the Hollywood Kyokushin dojo back in the 80s. One of the guys at my dojo trained there while he was in the Army. He trained along side Lundgren a handful of times, but never had the honor of sparring with him. He claims it’s a mixed blessing - on one hand he’d have been able to say he sparred with him, on the other hand, he’d have probably been man-handled by Ivan Drago. Kyokushin isn’t exactly tip-tap point fighting.

    Edit: I think he said they weren’t allowed to spar at the Hollywood dojo due to clauses in the lease and insurance, so they had to rent another space once or twice a week to hold sparring sessions. Don’t hold me to that though.
     
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  12. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Lundgren’s reportedly near genius level IQ. He was in some sort of chemical engineering program at MIT as well, but didn’t finish. I think that’s right about when was becoming famous. If you don’t know MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology), it’s the second most difficult school overall in the world to get into, and the most difficult science/technology school to get into.
     
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  13. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Wow.... I have SUCH respect for that.. when someone insanely genetically gifted, talented or intelligent, yet they choose to go down a totally different path, one that they love and are meant to be doing. (Unless he wanted to get into chemical engineering and his parents pushed him into martial arts and acting XD ).
     
  14. ShotoNoob

    ShotoNoob Master Black Belt

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    That kata looked pretty darn precise to me. See you're on the details for the future. Practice will strengthen your movements.
     
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  15. ShotoNoob

    ShotoNoob Master Black Belt

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    Your opponent, that right he came over the top with, here's the whole reason for pressure testing. Nice job on the competitor's part when you were both jammed up.

    Your good technical form thought really shows in your kicks. Carried the day.


    We have the larger, aggressive type as the opponent. Again, the whole benefit of pressure testing. He was as successful bulldozing you as he was because of the inherent nature of point fighting. Difficult to stop someone that out-sized in their tracks without going to 'excessive' contact.

    How do you propose to address the flinching, constraints of the competition forum aside? The aggressive opponent is always around. They tend to fall back on it, like your man.

    Excellent presentation BTW. Your extensive kata work shows.
     
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  16. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Thank you so much, yeah it felt good :). I know some definite things I need to work on with that, but first time performing Pinan Go in tournament and also it being probably one of the newest katas I've learned, was stoked with how I went, and being very familiar with Pinan 1-4 really helped establish an understanding of 5.
     
  17. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Ah cheers! Yeah I probably worked on kicks the most out of everything. But having faced this fellow earlier in the year I had more of an idea of how to approach it.


    Yeah I honestly didn't expect that approach from him. I've seen him fight before, and have fought him before, and he was always very rooted, waiting for the opponent to enter in and he was keen on counter-attacking. So when he was down in points I could sense his frustration, and he just barrelled in.

    It really threw me, and as I'm currently in between styles at the moment (having only done minimal sparring this year) I was quite out of practice. Had to really just trust myself and rely on my training and where I was currently in skill level and movement. Was flinching out of complete surprise and expecting his other strategy. But I really want to address the flinching anyway. In all my years of Kyokushin sparring I learned to not flinch (there was PLENTY of pressure testing haha), although there aren't as many shots to the head so perhaps didn't get a great opportunity.

    So not sure how I can address it currently hehe. Go up to someone in the street and ask them to take a swing? XD When I settle on a new style and commit to it will see how we go.

    Thank you so much, really appreciate that :)
     
  18. ShotoNoob

    ShotoNoob Master Black Belt

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    Wanted to get in a short bit on the 'unexpected.' One of the benefits competitors have in MMA, and here where you saw a repeat competitor, is game planning based on past behaviors. In a spontaneous self defense situation, we don't have the same luxury. Moreover, people or competitors can be highly unpredictable, variable in their actions.

    You realized his frustration caused him to alter his behavior. Happens. The desire to come out on top brings about or even forces a change. Highlights the disadvantage of specifically game planning an opponent.

    Tournaments can be criticized as unrealistic or not valuable because they are constrained by rules, or limit physical contact. Withing those constraints, however, they bring to the fore of how to outfight the opponent, whatever he/she does or decides to do. The rules provide an environment where we are free to learn that, without grave consequences.

    Would there be certain sections of your katas which perhaps might tactically address the aggressive attacker?

    Incidentally the photos you posted of your school, portrayed a great outfit.
     
  19. _Simon_

    _Simon_ Master of Arts

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    Very well said. Whilst there are rules and limitations, it's still a great avenue to work on other skillsets, and also deal with the spontaneity of the opponent. And given I'm relatively new to tournament competing, I'm realising that I can't necessarily assume a fighter will stick to that habitual way of fighting. I just thought it was a legit strategy of watching the fighters very closely in all their other fights, seeing patterns, and thinking of ways I could work with/around that. I probably will still do that, but will need to work on being a bit more flexible. Which is hard to do in the explosive heat of battle! Haha

    Hmm in terms of katas addressing it I'm not too sure, it may very well have to be a sparring drill thing to address it. That is unless I do partner-work with kata. But getting someone to purposely be really aggressive and barrel into me time and time again, and me working 'on the fly' to handle it would help. But do you mean mentally? I could certainly perform Tsuki No kata with that attitude hehe, which is symbolically about punching through barriers and being assertive.


    And yeah it's a really strong karate branch, I do miss the guys :).

    I appreciate your comments by the way, it's really getting me to reflect about ways to improve in tournaments and in my karate in general.
     
  20. ShotoNoob

    ShotoNoob Master Black Belt

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    Simon, you certainly were thinking all kind of thoughts regarding your kumite experience. There was quite a bit to respond to. Allow me to pick one point.

    The symbolic punching through barriers and on being assertive as lessons from the kata. How did you learn or come to understand that lesson?

    On the mental element, take a look at this condensed JKA tournament video. I'm not advocating Shotokan or JKA styles per se, I like referring to JKA and Shotokan because they always put it out there so to speak. See the video.
    JKA World Championships University of Limerick
    3,077 views

    [​IMG]
    I Love Limerick
    Published on Aug 21, 2017
    I'll pick out certain time stamps where I think important karate dynamics on one display. Tell me what you see.

    Time = 0:09. Two female black-belt competitors vigorously collide. Hard to tell whose strike lands 1st. The Swiss though is really in there with power. How would she fare against an aggressive opponent?
    Time =0:17 The striking opponent on the left has rocketed his punch into the opponent's face much like your black-belt did. The defender, how does he fare on that punch zooming in? The defender's hands? Is there work to do there?
    Time = 0:19-0:20. Team female kata by those darn Japanese. How many motions do they perform within a second? Compared to tournament fighting, how precise are the techniques? Are they just marching like mindless robots, or is their a very high level of intent & self control over their physical moment? Would this prepare one for an aggressor / or just looking pretty?

    Time = 0:23. That's you kicking the opponent in next year's tourney. His form is strong, accurate and precise. Again would he be effective against the barrel-inner...?
    Time = 0:30. Striking competitor makes lunge in forward stance against side defending opponent. Is this structure represented in kata?
    Time = 0:30. Split second later (same second) black-belt female competitors collide. Look at the intensity of the expression on their faces. Are they committed spiritually or just taking it easy? What kind of energy do they convey in their demeanor? What happened we'll never know 'cause it all took place within a split second. Notice how both re-chamber quickly. Any significance to that?
    Time = 0:34-0:35. The kata "flip." Is this just some flashy performance art or does the kata competitor display command & control over his body & strength?

    Time = 0:37. A fav. Japanese female competitor rushing in (aggressively) with alternating speed punches. Swiss female impressively gives ground, but fights back with counters for every inch. How's that for a defensive model? How does Swiss competitor maintain her composure so well? Other's flinch. She's on it; how to deal with aggression? How do you feel about the Swiss female's answer. Who do you think wins that exchange & why?
    Time = 0:39-0:40. There's than darn performance art again. What is the mental demeanor of these contestants. How about No.'s 3 & 4, what do these guys signify?
    Time = 0:43. There's that ole reverse punch right on the attackers noggin.' What's that say about an aggressor coming in, maybe with a level change for a take down? How's the defender behaving? Pretty intense if you ask me.

    Time = 0:46-0:47. My fav. Aggressor comes in with kizami zuki, spot on, But. Gets smacked with defender's reverse punch counter really good before aggressor's follow on punch can connect and it's power diffused. Lesson there. Boxer's jabbing I say beware.
    Time = 0:49. There's those darn Japanese kata females again. What's the significance of the techniques(me?)? Are the technique important to dealing with the bulldozer or is it her assertive mind & body strength?
    Time = 0:56. White Female kumite competitor drills that reverse punch in there, then eases back... before Red Female competitor can get it really going. How'd White Female competitor train that;? drills, sparring, kata, kihon? Which? How?
    Time = 1:00-1:01. Two male kumite competitors face off, hesitating, then go together with similar reverse punch. What else could have been done instead of sprinting for the striking finish line on GO!

    These tournaments represent the finest the organization can muster. Some excel, some come in 2nd, some fall. Together, they set a standard and give purpose to our training objectives.

    Aggressive opponents aren't really a problem, that's what I got, even though they're all over. It's the opponent - period - that's the problem. All in less than 1 minute.

    P.S. Two more.
    Time = 0:10. Bigger, heavier, female kumite aggressor is right in face of smaller defender. What happens?
    Time = 0:13. Female kumite aggressor flies in with reverse punch, strikes too soon - hits air. What lesson here for aggressor & defender both?
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2018

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