That's a lot of forms

Discussion in 'Tae-Kwon-Do' started by skribs, Apr 29, 2019.

  1. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    So...I have 9 new forms for my next test.

    My school does the Kibon (basic) and Palgwe (advanced) forms. We also do the KKW required black belt forms, and alternate versions of those (usually with some minor differences in the beginning and end, and some extra stuff added in the middle).

    Our belt system means that we typically have 1-2 new forms per test. A few tests have no new form (but other stuff added to compensate).

    Well, my Master has decided Taegeuks are going to be a thing now. We're not getting rid of the Palgwes or Kibons, and there will still only be a maximum of 2 new belts per form. We're also staggering the release so its not a shock to our higher ranking students.

    However, as an instructor, I don't get the luxury of a staggered release. So in addition to the alternate Taebaek, I have to learn all 8 of the Taegeuks for my next test. I also need to pay closer attention because "Tae___k" is not enough to hear.

    That's 9 forms total.
     
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  2. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    - You want to grow tall. You don't want to grow fat.
    - Going through the elementary school 5 times won't get you a PhD degree.

    You have to be able to tell which form is beginner level, intermediate level, and advance level. IMO, one form in each level should be enough.

    Some systems define those levels as:

    1. Beginner level - offense skill.
    2. Intermediate level - defense skill.
    3. Advance level - combo skill.

    Some systems define those levels as:

    1. Beginner level - speed training.
    2. Intermediate level - body unification power training.
    3. Advance level - integration training.
     
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2019
  3. Rat

    Rat Brown Belt

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    That is a lot of forms. :p

    You must not have enough instructors laid out in a sufficient way to stagger it so one only has to learn say 2 at a time. Always a pest when you change the cirrculem.
     
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  4. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    Your systems have a completely different philosophy than Taekwondo does.
     
  5. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    Is there a reason he is adding this series?
     
  6. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    Have you started taking classes yet?
     
  7. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    They're the official Kukkiwon forms, which superseded the forms we use quite a while ago. We just like the Palgwe forms better, is why we haven't used them until now.
     
  8. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    What do you like better about Palgwe? I am familiar with the fact that there are several series, but don’t know anything about them.
     
  9. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Are your ranks not considered valid by the kukkiwon until he adds those?
     
  10. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    The Palgwe forms typically use deeper stances, and (at least in the versions we do at my school) have a steeper learning progression, where the first few are easier and the last few are harder than their Teageuk equivalents. My Master likes the Palgwe forms especially because of the deeper stances, and his experience with Hapkido and Tuk Kong says that being used to deeper stances is better.

    It's not that I don't like the Taegeuk forms. I just like the Palgwes better. And if we're only doing one set of forms, I agree with my Master that I'd rather do the Palgwes. I don't mind doing both sets, however.

    I have a certificate from KKW, which should be valid. I'm not going to pretend to know the details or the politics beyond that. I also don't know if the change is political in nature, or if it's so that we can be prepared with the Teageuks if a student moves and has to go to a new school, or for "World Class" forms competitions in tournaments.

    My stake in it is that I was told we're doing it, so I'm learning it. That's as much as I need to know.
     
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  11. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I wasn't complaining bout the decision btw or considering what stake you had in it, or any of that. I wasmore curious if, if you aren't certified, once you learn the forms if that would change anything. Since you are already certified, the points moot anyway.
     
  12. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    I'm just letting you know that we've reached the extent of my knowledge on the politics of the subject. I don't know if would affect my ability to get my 4th Dan. My Master may also be looking into my future when I go and take the Master's course, what they'll think if I don't know the Taegeuks.

    It may also be that while it hasn't affected us so far, it might affect future black belts.
     
  13. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    I assume TKD has similar philosophy. For example,

    1. Beginner level - side kick, ...
    2. Intermediate level - flying side kick, ...
    3. Advance level - side kick, spin back fist combo, ...

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Jaeimseu

    Jaeimseu 2nd Black Belt

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    It would be interesting since they only train the Taegeuk and yudanja poomsae at the Kukkiwon Master course. I’d guess you’d have a hard time completing the course without that knowledge.

    I doubt it will affect your dan rank unless your master says so. Kukkiwon has up until now trusted certified masters’ recommendations for dan promotions. I suppose that could change, but it would be a hassle, I think.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  15. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    It's not broken up into only "beginner, intermediate, and advanced." For example, we have:
    • Roundhouse kick
    • Jumping roundhouse kick (pop jump)
    • Jumping roundhouse kick (bicycle jump)
    • Step and roundhouse kick
    • Slide and roundhouse kick (kind of like bicycle, but lower to ground)
    • Switch feet and kick
    • Speed roundhouse kick (halfway between slide and switch feet)
    • Double roundhouse kick (roundhouse into bicycle jumping roundhouse kick)
    • Step-turn roundhouse kick
    • Tornado kick (turn and bicycle jumping roundhouse kick)
    And that's just the practical ones moving forward. There's also things like Pop 360 roundhouse, 540 roundhouse, and other variations I didn't list.

    We're also talking about forms, not techniques. These are memorized patterns that are 20+ techniques long.
     
  16. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    When you do martial arts you are not just learning a skill but committing to changing yourself.

    So it is not just about learning new forms. But developing into a person who can learn new forms.

    And do MMA.
     
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  17. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    That's a lot of forms, but Skribs, you got this. You love Martial Arts, you really do. You love Tae-Kwon-Do, you teach Tae-Kwon-Do and you have great resources in Tae-Kwon-Do, not just in your school, but right here on the forum you hang out on. You got this, brother.

    Heck, ten years from now you'll have eight more years of knowing these forms under your belt. You got this.
     
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  18. dvcochran

    dvcochran Senior Master

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    Welcome to the party. We have all the forms you listed plus 5 Pyong Ahn forms and an assortment of older MKD BB forms. There are so many things traditionally wrong with the Taeguek forms I am not very interested in them but do know them for matters of teaching them.
     
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  19. dvcochran

    dvcochran Senior Master

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    If a person wants to compete in sanctioned USTKD tournaments they have to know and perform Taeguek forms. I don't have a problem with uniformity in this respect. It is an attempt to bring all TKD under one banner. And to make the judging more uniform and consistent. However, there is so much valuable technique and application that would be lost if all TKD were to standardized it would be tragic.
    The Taegueks are forms for children, intended to be easy to learn, but there are some many moves that just do not make any sense. Having already known the Palgew's, you will pick up on these moves as you learn them.
     
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  20. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    What moves in the Taegeuk poomsae would you say make no sense?
     
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