Lajust system

[Manny]

I am not a competitor so this thing about the crapy electronic equipment does not afecte me, but if I had a child who loved to compet and need it the electronic hogus (two one red and another blue) and two pair of e-socks this would cost me twice as mucha as you guys because of the customs taxes.

I'm going to go a little further, in my dojang all the kids that go training are in some point worth people, their parents have good salaries however paying as much as 1200 us dollars per hogu I think that is beyond the expectation of any TKD parent.

I think in my country there will be very few TKD competitors that will have the e-gear and most of them will be olimpic atlethes sponsored by my goverment but we are talking of a few ELITE fighters, the rest of the people will continue using the regular gear.

The only tournaments I know e-gear was used was in Tijuana a couple of weeks before in the international junior championships and maybe in the Ligfa of TKD last yera when Steven lopez was KYOD, all the rest of the competitions no matter natioanl,state or regional are using the regular stuff.

Manny

 

[mango.man]

In the USA all national events will use the gear going forward. USAT will provide for the rest of this year. Further WTF international events such as the recently concluded German Open. The really fun part is going to be that when you go to an event like the currently in progress Dutch Open, even if you own the LaJust crappy stuff, you get to buy "Daedo Socks" and perhaps next year, buy Daedo e-hogus to go with your LaJust crappy set of hogus. Not sure how much the Daedo stuff costs, but I hear it is at least slightly better than the crappy lajust stuff.

My guess is that most parents wont hand over the money. Some will. Others, the schools will purchase several sets of the gear to take for all of their team that goes to events that need the gear. Of course those that do this, will make up the cost by charging more per student per month or perhaps start charging a fee for "Team Members" if they don't already. So still the parents will have to pay, but it will be an easier pill to swallow if they are doing so at say $10 per month increased training fee.

 

[d1jinx]

You know.... this just pisses me off.

Sure when more people buy, the price will drop. But not everyone can afford to buy. OR WANT TO.

So those kids who are ACTUALLY better but dont have the funds to travel and now wont have the funds to buy that junk wont get the opurtunity.

And the rich kids wil continue to have the advantage and opportunity unlike the rest of the world.

 

[mango.man]

Bottom line is, if you want to play the game at a world class level, you gotta be willing to write a world class check.

Anybody that thinks for a moment that Michelle Kwan's parents spent $30 bucks on a pair of ice skates or Mary Lou Retton's parents spent $10 on a leotard and otherwise they had no expenses is seriously kidding themselves. Sticking with the Michelle Kwan angle I seem to recall reading that her parents once had 3 mortgages on their house and eventually ended up moving in with a brother or uncle or something so that they could fund her $100,000+ per year skating career.

Probably showing my age with those examples, but I can pretty much promise you that the parent of just about every Olympian in the past 30 years has spent 10's if not 100's of thousands of dollars each year on costs associated with their kids sport. This doesn't mean that TKD needs to succumb to that level of insanity, but it really seems quite inevitable.

I am sure that there are a lot of skaters and gymnasts out there that are better than Michelle and Mary Lou were in their prime, but they will never get their shot because their parents can't afford the cost it will take to get them to that level of recognition.

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

I can imagine a lot of parents saying wait a second here..... I need to spend how much for them to compete? Maybe I and my kid's will do some thing else. Like soccer where it costs $30 to $50 for a season.

 

[terryl965]

mango.man we all understand making certain scacifices for the betterment of said child but forgive me here Mary Lou did not have an uneven bar that was warped and Michele skates where not dull. The point is the cost would be justified if the dam thing worked like it is suppose to. My bigeest complaint is the equipment is not up to pair to be using it yet and it may never be.

Money is just that money it can be made and it will be spent but to be pouring money into the bottom of a pit is silly, I will and always will do what needs to be done for my childern, just like coming to Vegas for that little get together a price tag cannot be put on that but it can on bad equipment.

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

Bottom line is, if you want to play the game at a world class level, you gotta be willing to write a world class check.

Anybody that thinks for a moment that Michelle Kwan's parents spent $30 bucks on a pair of ice skates or Mary Lou Retton's parents spent $10 on a leotard and otherwise they had no expenses is seriously kidding themselves. Sticking with the Michelle Kwan angle I seem to recall reading that her parents once had 3 mortgages on their house and eventually ended up moving in with a brother or uncle or something so that they could fund her $100,000+ per year skating career.

Probably showing my age with those examples,

Probably showing my age in acknowledging that I remember when they were in the olympics.

Given that only about four people will make it to the olympics every four years, I am not sure that holding up Michelle Kwan is the best analogy. Also, Michelle Kwan's 500.00 skates will make her perform better and likely will keep her feet from getting worn out or injured. Considering that skates are essentially a shoe with a blade, they have all of the requirements of a good athletic shoe and all of the requirements of a good blade.

But your hogu will not make you perform better. Your 500 dollar hogu will not prevent injury any better than my 100 dollar reversible hogu.

Given that taekwondo is essentially boxing with one's feet, I seriously question the need for electronic gear. They do not use electronic gloves in boxing, which certainly could make a stronger case for the need. Fencing requires it because of the speed of the tips, which is much, much faster than a punch or a kick (fastest moving object in sports after the bullet fired from a riffle).

I'm not a competitor, so none of this really impacts me. But it does seem that electronic scoring simply adds cost and complexity to the sport without enhancing it in any way.

but I can pretty much promise you that the parent of just about every Olympian in the past 30 years has spent 10's if not 100's of thousands of dollars each year on costs associated with their kids sport. This doesn't mean that TKD needs to succumb to that level of insanity, but it really seems quite inevitable.

Sadly, you are probably correct.


Daniel

 

[StudentCarl]

I can imagine a lot of parents saying wait a second here..... I need to spend how much for them to compete? Maybe I and my kid's will do some thing else. Like soccer where it costs $30 to $50 for a season.

Only for your neighborhood rec. league with volunteer parent coaches. We've been the high-level soccer route. The equipment isn't so bad, but the instructional costs are. You're going to run into this in any activity at the higher levels, IMO.

Carl

 

[taekwondodo]

mango.man we all understand making certain scacifices for the betterment of said child but forgive me here Mary Lou did not have an uneven bar that was warped and Michele skates where not dull. The point is the cost would be justified if the dam thing worked like it is suppose to. My bigeest complaint is the equipment is not up to pair to be using it yet and it may never be.

Money is just that money it can be made and it will be spent but to be pouring money into the bottom of a pit is silly, I will and always will do what needs to be done for my childern, just like coming to Vegas for that little get together a price tag cannot be put on that but it can on bad equipment.

Ummmm..Master Terry,
The equipements works. Granted that the Hogu once in awhile losts its connection with the receiver, so the Hogu has to be re-registered again. It take an operator to understand the equipments and how the software works and adjust accordingly.

I had the same problem when I start using it a month or so ago. But with many time using it, it runs pretty smoothly. I own a set ( 2 hogu and a receiver) and my Master has 3 sets and we do not have many problems that we had to say "Its a piece of junk".

 

[Gorilla]

Only for your neighborhood rec. league with volunteer parent coaches. We've been the high-level soccer route. The equipment isn't so bad, but the instructional costs are. You're going to run into this in any activity at the higher levels, IMO.

Carl

My Daughter is an ODP soccer player and has played club for years it is just as expensive maybe more than TKD. Total budget for my kids(2) athletics is 20k per year. If I have to buy EBP some travel will have to be eliminated. Probably 5 trips to Cali per year will go away.

 

[terryl965]

Ummmm..Master Terry,
The equipements works. Granted that the Hogu once in awhile losts its connection with the receiver, so the Hogu has to be re-registered again. It take an operator to understand the equipments and how the software works and adjust accordingly.

I had the same problem when I start using it a month or so ago. But with many time using it, it runs pretty smoothly. I own a set ( 2 hogu and a receiver) and my Master has 3 sets and we do not have many problems that we had to say "Its a piece of junk".

Look I am not here to start anything but the equipment has alot of problems, every single USAT event has had it problems with it and I know your Master very well. Since you do not want to say his name I shall not either but even he has said there is problems with it as well. When competition takes longer and equipment failures happens quite often than there is problems, even Lajust says they need to make chamges to make the equipment better.

I do not know why you are sticking up fot the equipment, but you have every right to do that. I have been in the TKD world for ober forty years and sen alot of changes over that timeframe and believe me it needs alot of work to get to the top, but then again it is what it is and we have to make adjustments to play the game.

In closin I will ask once more to be address as Terry not Master Terry if you insist on callinf me Master something my last mane is Stoker so Master Stoker would be better than Master Terry. Sorry but I am not formal about a rank unless it is being used wrong.

P.S. no hard fellings about anything and what is so wonderful we can dis-agree and still have that common bound between us TKD....:asian:

 

[terryl965]

Ummmm..Master Terry,
The equipements works. Granted that the Hogu once in awhile losts its connection with the receiver, so the Hogu has to be re-registered again. It take an operator to understand the equipments and how the software works and adjust accordingly.

I had the same problem when I start using it a month or so ago. But with many time using it, it runs pretty smoothly. I own a set ( 2 hogu and a receiver) and my Master has 3 sets and we do not have many problems that we had to say "Its a piece of junk".

And by the way one more thing why is it you address everything to me and not the other people that thinke the equipment is bad? I mean nothing is said the ATC or mango.man about there comments? I must be loved so much that only my words are read aloud.... Sorry just had to point that out for you since it does seem you are directing everything said to me and me only..

 

[Daniel Sullivan]

You're just more popular than the rest of us, Terry.

Daniel

 

[terryl965]

Oh and for the record I am glad you can offord to buy them, you see I need to buy four sets of them since I have a wife and three son's that compete so the cost is a little much for a school teacher pay but maybe my Taco Bell part time job can help me offord to keep my familt competing of course this is total scarcasm.

Come on laigh people this is the flight of e-hogu's and the death of fair play.

 

[terryl965]

You're just more popular than the rest of us, Terry.

Daniel

Man to be loved is just a curse I tell ya!

 

[d1jinx]

mango.man we all understand making certain scacifices for the betterment of said child but forgive me here Mary Lou did not have an uneven bar that was warped and Michele skates where not dull. The point is the cost would be justified if the dam thing worked like it is suppose to. My bigeest complaint is the equipment is not up to pair to be using it yet and it may never be.

Money is just that money it can be made and it will be spent but to be pouring money into the bottom of a pit is silly, I will and always will do what needs to be done for my childern, just like coming to Vegas for that little get together a price tag cannot be put on that but it can on bad equipment.

Agreed. When and IF you get to that level, sure, spend the money to continue advancing.... but to go to ANY sanctioned events?????? I see the number of competitors dropping drastically.

If I had a student who was on tract and at that level, I would not let that stop him/her, but the others who aren't? Are they supposed to not compete anymore?

 

[mango.man]

And by the way one more thing why is it you address everything to me and not the other people that thinke the equipment is bad? I mean nothing is said the ATC or mango.man about there comments? I must be loved so much that only my words are read aloud.... Sorry just had to point that out for you since it does seem you are directing everything said to me and me only..

I don't say it's bad. I say it's crappy. Not sure if there is a difference there or not.

 

[d1jinx]

I don't say it's bad. I say it's crappy. Not sure if there is a difference there or not.

Just dont get it wet.

 

[terryl965]

I don't say it's bad. I say it's crappy. Not sure if there is a difference there or not.

you are right crappy is so much better than bad. I mean I need to know what is the difference.

 

[ATC]

Ummmm..Master Terry,
The equipements works. Granted that the Hogu once in awhile losts its connection with the receiver, so the Hogu has to be re-registered again. It take an operator to understand the equipments and how the software works and adjust accordingly.

I had the same problem when I start using it a month or so ago. But with many time using it, it runs pretty smoothly. I own a set ( 2 hogu and a receiver) and my Master has 3 sets and we do not have many problems that we had to say "Its a piece of junk".

Well I have to disagree about the system working. They just figured out that cell phone interfere with the system. Many of the resets you speak about are now being suggested that it was due to a cell phone. That is a BIG problem.

Half of the hogus have already been beat to death and just don't work anymore. Anyone that knows anything about electronics knows that after some harsh use, they simply ware out. Check any game console controller you have had to replace many times. They are built for the use you are giving them but they still need to be replaces quite often.