if you could make your own universal MA what arts would you inc.

[suicide]

and why ?

 

[Bill Mattocks]

I would not want to presume to create yet another martial art style.

However, with a year of training as an Isshin-Ryu karateka, I realize that I need to know some things that I'm not learning in karate. Namely, how to fall and roll correctly; I'm very bad and uncoordinated at it. And the few sweeps, tucks, and throws we execute, I am also quite bad at. So I would like to add some traditional judo to my training regimen. But that's just for me, I would not want to create some new style from it.

 

[still learning]

Hello, For those who train in many styles? ....mostly likely will start and form there own Martila arts styles base on there backgrounds

We will always see new MA starting and claiming something new and different....

Endless combintions and endless NEW styles....

Yet....Nothing changes much...?

Aloha,

 

[suicide]

if i jumped in the delorean and went back in time say 500 - 600 years back and brung back a MA instructor from those times and showed em whats going on right now including mma wonder what he would say ?

 

[ATC]

if i jumped in the delorean and went back in time say 500 - 600 years back and brung back a MA instructor from those times and showed em whats going on right now including mma wonder what he would say ?

I'd bet he'd say...WOW!!!! they are good.

I think Martial Arts of today are better than MA of yester years. We are bigger, stronger, faster and everything else that can be better. Also the arts have evolved for the better. More science is used to make everything more percise and efficent.

Yes a kick is a kick and punch is a punch but today we can deliver that kick and punch much faster and harder then back then.

 

[David43515]

Why in the world would anyone want to create a universal martial art? One of the main things that makes arts effective is thier differences. When the other guy doesn`t know what to expect, he can`t defend against it as well.

We all have different capabilities, tastes, and training goals. Good luck coming up with something that pleases the Self Defense crowd, Sports/competetion crowd, the exercise/ fitness crowd, the performance/ competetion crowd, the weapons crowd, and the pacifist crowd.

Even on something as nearly universal as pizza, people argue about crust, sauce, cheese, and toppings. Then you get the people who don`t even like pizza. Just sit back and enjoy the differences.

 

[Jenna]

I apologise for being divergent and but I think I would question the motivation behind the creation of a universal art. I guess the reason we have such a gamut of martial styles and substyles is because we are all very different and have markedly differing needs and wants from our arts.

I think when we begin with MA we find an art that best approximates our needs and requirements. Some people would their art for lacking in certain skills. Some find alternatives and some combine other arts. And but I think it is quite wonderful to see a person gradually take their art, which is a "near fit" and totally shape that art around themselves [by their own empirical testing, by adapting and tweaking to fill out all the perceived gaps]. I think to me that is the "creation" that turns practitioners into true martial ARTISTS.

What I mean is that any homogenised "universal" art would necessarily contain more irrelevant concepts to more people [by virtue of its lowered common denominators] and thus I think it might take any practitioner longer to whittle the extraneous and fit that art to themselves.

Again apologies that did not answer the question directly..

...mostly likely will start and form there own Martila arts styles base on there backgrounds

Martila arts? I should like to try that!

 

[Bruno@MT]

if i jumped in the delorean and went back in time say 500 - 600 years back and brung back a MA instructor from those times and showed em whats going on right now including mma wonder what he would say ?

He would probably say: why on earth aren't they using weapons? Why are they not trying to kill each other? What is the point of this?

I'd bet he'd say...WOW!!!! they are good.

I think Martial Arts of today are better than MA of yester years. We are bigger, stronger, faster and everything else that can be better. Also the arts have evolved for the better. More science is used to make everything more percise and efficent.

Yes a kick is a kick and punch is a punch but today we can deliver that kick and punch much faster and harder then back then.

I don't think so. We may be bigger, we may be stronger, but we are also softer. Fighting used to be about killing the other guy in battle, using whatever weapon of choice. Bare hands was something you didn't use until you had nothing left. MMA doesn't make sense from that point of view. If you are grapling, then the first one to stab the other one or pokes out an eye wins. Rolling around for 15 minutes, trying to get that arm or leg locked...

Duels were done frequently, and for the purpose of proving you were better than the other. They may have agreed to not use lethal force, or at least not intentionally, but death was common, and those who survived did so by staying alive. People like Musashi left a pile of bodies and cripples in his wake. I think he would care very little for 'sportsmanship' or rules. If someone issued a dojo challenge, there would be blood, damage, and possibly dead bodies.

Another example: old school sakki tests were performed with a live blade, and people actually died if they failed the test. Natural selection at its finest. Do you think they would be awed by us modern day people using a shinai? Personally, I think they would laugh at us and call us posers.

I read a biography of Fujita Seiko (the last koga ninja) which has some description of what training was like. Some of the texts I have read about Takamatsu sensei, Manaka sensei, Tanemura sensei and Hatsumi sensei paint a similar picture. Very, very few people today train as rigorous.

In an MMA fight by the rules, I think you are right that modern day MMA fighters would have the advantage. If you abandon the rules and assumptions(no weapons, no cheap shots, etc) and say 'whoever walks out of this cage alive wins' then I feel the result would be different.

 

[elder999]

and why ?

It'd probably be a combination of Kyokushin karate, western boxing and wrestling, judo, Miyama ryu jujutsu, Yoshinkan aikido ,some kind of Filipino knife/stick fighting,firearms, a few other things, and maybe some wing chun and BJJ to round it all out, with occasional training sessions in a MMA gym for "pressure testing."
.....hey, wait a minute...:lol:

I would not want to presume to create yet another martial art style..

QFT.

I've been training for 38 years now in some arts, less in others, much less in a couple more. Why in the world would I start a "universal" art?
I don't even know what that means, so....

 

[Bruno@MT]

The quote came from this article. I am not going to quote the rest because this is not am MMA vs TMA debate. However, this particular bit is right on:

Don’t get hung up in training in the ultimate martial art. You will be chasing assumptions forever. Instead pick an art that makes assumptions in line with what you value or desire and then train with a level of dedication equal to what you expect to get from your martial art. If you’re a police officer this will probably be a very different from a college professor.

 

[celtic_crippler]

Each individual creates their own "universal" MA each time they learn something new and expand their realm of knowledge beyond their base study.

I've long held that martial arts are uniquely an individual thing. No two people in any given style will agree 100% on every topic nor will they execute any given maneuver exactly alike.

Of course, each individual usually feels that their way is the best. It is, for them anyway. What we tend to forget, and it's probably due to ego, is that because something is the best for me that does not always mean it's best for you as well.

If there were simply one sure-fire method do you not think there would already be a single, universal martial art?

And if you brought someone to the present from over 500 years ago they'd likely think you a god and and for that reason alone would likely think that whatever you were doing martial-wise must be the best. LOL

 

[elder999]

Each individual creates their own "universal" MA each time they learn something new and expand their realm of knowledge beyond their base study.

To expand on this a little, I certainly can't teach a 100 lb. 5' tall woman "the Jeff Cuffee method," and to teach it to someone under the age of 15 might very well be criminal, if not illegal. To borrow an analogy from Ed Parker, Sr., all I can do is supply the cloth for them to tailor their own suit, with the caveat, of course, that I'm still tailoring my own.

 

[ATC]

He would probably say: why on earth aren't they using weapons? Why are they not trying to kill each other? What is the point of this?

I could see this from the weapons and war stand point.

I don't think so. We may be bigger, we may be stronger, but we are also softer. Fighting used to be about killing the other guy in battle, using whatever weapon of choice.

I do not think we are softer at all. If you are talking weapons and war vs. sport and fun then you are compareing apples and bricks. The pure one on one aspect with no weapons as of today we will win. We will also win if weapons are used as there weapon of choice back then is obsolete. Again everthing evolves and nunchucks, swords, thowing stars and so on are obsolete. Now you just pick your target off from a few feet to hundreds of miles if need be. The killing art is dead it's self due to evolution.

Another example: old school sakki tests were performed with a live blade, and people actually died if they failed the test. Natural selection at its finest.

This is stupidity at its best I call it. You would kill off half your own army in the name of practice. No natural selection here, just plain stupid. Think about it this way. We let are armed forces of today use live rounds and bombs againts each other in boot camp, we would not have much of a force. Again evolution has done away with this not needed practice.

It seems that your point is that barbarism is better than advancement. If something is better you don't discard it you keep it. But all the ways of the old have been discarded for better options. They used and did what they had to back then. But we have now found better and smarter ways. You don't have to be tough to get killed in the name of practice, just stupid.

 

[suicide]

im not trying to create a universal martial art ! im asking if you could create your own personal uni. MA what would be included ?

 

[Bruno@MT]

I do not think we are softer at all. If you are talking weapons and war vs. sport and fun then you are compareing apples and bricks. The pure one on one aspect with no weapons as of today we will win. We will also win if weapons are used as there weapon of choice back then is obsolete. Again everthing evolves and nunchucks, swords, thowing stars and so on are obsolete. Now you just pick your target off from a few feet to hundreds of miles if need be. The killing art is dead it's self due to evolution.

Of course, but that idea would be completely foreign to them. They would judge it in their context.

This is stupidity at its best I call it. You would kill off half your own army in the name of practice. No natural selection here, just plain stupid. Think about it this way. We let are armed forces of today use live rounds and bombs againts each other in boot camp, we would not have much of a force. Again evolution has done away with this not needed practice.

I was talking about the people who did martial arts to master it, not the regular armed forces. From what I understood, their training was pretty basic, and centered around being useable in a strategic way. E.g. I have more bowmen, but you have people with spears, so I play a distance game. Otoh, if your spearmen can come close enough, my bowmen will snuff it. Etc. They were soldiers, not trained MAists. While swordmanship was praised as an art and respected, swords were really only a last resort weapon.

Soldiers then were not professional MAists by thestandards of those days, any more than soldiers today are MAists in the hand to hand combat sense. On average of course.

I was comparing the MMA fighters with the top dogs of their age (Musashi et al). They dueled to prove they were the best, and their system worked.

It seems that your point is that barbarism is better than advancement. If something is better you don't discard it you keep it. But all the ways of the old have been discarded for better options. They used and did what they had to back then. But we have now found better and smarter ways. You don't have to be tough to get killed in the name of practice, just stupid.

No, I was saying that they have different goals and assumptions. For professional MAist of those days it was a killing art. For MMAists now, it is a sport with rules and assumptions.

They are completely different things. Comparison between MMA and TMA will always result in disagreement, because one cannot be judged in the context of the other. Saying that TMAists of those days would be awed by MMAists is incorrect, for the same reason that I think MMAists would be awed by the TMAists of those days.

And that has nothing to do with self defense, but everything with context.

 

[celtic_crippler]

im not trying to create a universal martial art ! im asking if you could create your own personal uni. MA what would be included ?

Everything.

 

[suicide]

good answer :wavey:

 

[Haze]

Universal Martial Art has all ready been done by the one and only,,,,,
,Mr. Chuck Norris with his creation of "Chun Kuk Do"

"Chun Kuk Do" is loosely translated as "Universal Way" - more literal translation from the Korean is "the way of 1000 lands".

Leave it to Chuck to figure it all out

 

[pmosiun1]

and why ?

Boxing, with some low line savate style kicking, a bit of jiu jitsu technique, such as getting up or escape from a mount.

 

[Em MacIntosh]

I consider JKD to be the universal "martial art". It's just a name, please don't fuss over it.