How would you deal with multiple attackers who are bigger?
- Thread starter Tony
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jacktnicol
Yellow Belt
I was always told to run just because not every body runs at the same speed then you can take them out one by one when the timing is right(assuming that as martial artists we can display this amount of endurance)
Jack
Jack
lll000000lll
Green Belt
i would try to get my back up against a wall or a corner limiting my attackers from getting at my back. (definitely would make it easier)
but ultimately they would be coming at you all at once so speed and accuracy are your best weapons.
i would use:
finger jabs
knees and kicks to the testicles
and strikes to the throat.
i might even try to break a jaw or two
but finger jabs and well targeted strikes because these strikes are to soft, sensitive areas of the body that don't require a lot of force to effect the attacker.
and taking out the eye or dropping a guy to there knees with a swift shot to the pants can turn the odds around in your favor.
so it does benefit ones training to always include speed and target training utilizing finger jabs and shots to the testicles. as well as remembering the throat and ears are great places to hit.
but ultimately they would be coming at you all at once so speed and accuracy are your best weapons.
i would use:
finger jabs
knees and kicks to the testicles
and strikes to the throat.
i might even try to break a jaw or two
but finger jabs and well targeted strikes because these strikes are to soft, sensitive areas of the body that don't require a lot of force to effect the attacker.
and taking out the eye or dropping a guy to there knees with a swift shot to the pants can turn the odds around in your favor.
so it does benefit ones training to always include speed and target training utilizing finger jabs and shots to the testicles. as well as remembering the throat and ears are great places to hit.
lll000000lll said:
This may not be the best course of action to take, as it is also limiting your movement as well.
Mike
lll000000lll
Green Belt
MJS said:
personally i know i would do better with my back up against the wall or a corner. i cant say for anyone else. but as long as i could see everyone i know where the threats would be and when.
If the legs give the beast will fall. That is just how it goes. The worst thing you can do is to not 100% commit to the technique you are doing.
For instance: If you are going to stomp kick someone in the knee cap then do it to break and shatter, not just to deter.
For instance: If you are going to stomp kick someone in the knee cap then do it to break and shatter, not just to deter.
lll000000lll said:
Perhaps I'm just reading wrong here. If we look at boxing and even some MMA matches, the idea of getting the person into a corner is to limit movement. Speaking for myself, I'd think that moving, working for position, possibly using one opponent as a shield against the others, etc., would be a good option.
Could you explain how you use the theory that you're giving above? In any case, as long as you feel that it would work for you, then it something that you have that you can add to your bag of tools.
Mike
MJS said:Perhaps I'm just reading wrong here. If we look at boxing and even some MMA matches, the idea of getting the person into a corner is to limit movement. Speaking for myself, I'd think that moving, working for position, possibly using one opponent as a shield against the others, etc., would be a good option.
Could you explain how you use the theory that you're giving above? In any case, as long as you feel that it would work for you, then it something that you have that you can add to your bag of tools.
Mike
I think the theory goes if you are free to move your attackers are free to circle you. A corner cuts down the avenues of attack but limits escape. A door way would be better because you only have to fight one or two at a time and you have an avenue of escape.
Multiple attackers is a nightmare to deal with, fitness counts.
Another view point is to act crazy, punch yourself in the head a couple of times, say things like "yeah oh yeah bring on blood" "blood frenzy" or growl like an animal. GET some, groin eyes throat. Black out and go with it, scratch claw bite elbow punch kick knee, if my health is on the line it isn't going for free. Ok maybe a ref might stop my fight but at the same time I won't get mugged for a plastic trophy either.
Having said all this i run three times a week and cycle for fitness, i want to create space and get the heck outta dodge.
:btg:Engage mind control body
:CTF: then make tracks
Em MacIntosh
3rd Black Belt
I have a theory.
If you do a little tussle and engineer it so as to go to the ground, tuck and take a few boots, you might be better off. Sometimes the more damage you can take, the more damage you can get. The biggest problem is that you don't know what mind set they're in. Do they want your wallet, jacket or shoes? Is he jealous 'cause you looked at his girlfreind? Did you spill his drink? (on him?), or is he trying to look tough in front of someone (or group)? Unless they want to beat you for a good time or to jack you up, it's probably one guy who has a problem and brought his freinds along. I know from experience some guys are just "tuff guys" and want to be "big men" and you can't talk your way out. Maybe they just want dominance. You have to judge the situation so quickly and so carefully that there's a good chance you might judge wrong. Sometimes you can roll with a punch, take a boot to the ribs and go down and take a couple more. That's pretty optimistic though. Then you have to consider your level of pride/ego. It's easy for me to consider taking a beating, wait for them to leave, get up, dust myself off and go to a bathroom and get some tissues for the bleeding. It's easy for me because I'm not very proud and I've been lucky with my ability to pretend I'm really hurt when I'm not. This has gotten people to leave me alone and not need to go to the hospital, however, it depends on how mean and sadistic they are. Some people don't stop. Stay outta trouble!!!
If you do a little tussle and engineer it so as to go to the ground, tuck and take a few boots, you might be better off. Sometimes the more damage you can take, the more damage you can get. The biggest problem is that you don't know what mind set they're in. Do they want your wallet, jacket or shoes? Is he jealous 'cause you looked at his girlfreind? Did you spill his drink? (on him?), or is he trying to look tough in front of someone (or group)? Unless they want to beat you for a good time or to jack you up, it's probably one guy who has a problem and brought his freinds along. I know from experience some guys are just "tuff guys" and want to be "big men" and you can't talk your way out. Maybe they just want dominance. You have to judge the situation so quickly and so carefully that there's a good chance you might judge wrong. Sometimes you can roll with a punch, take a boot to the ribs and go down and take a couple more. That's pretty optimistic though. Then you have to consider your level of pride/ego. It's easy for me to consider taking a beating, wait for them to leave, get up, dust myself off and go to a bathroom and get some tissues for the bleeding. It's easy for me because I'm not very proud and I've been lucky with my ability to pretend I'm really hurt when I'm not. This has gotten people to leave me alone and not need to go to the hospital, however, it depends on how mean and sadistic they are. Some people don't stop. Stay outta trouble!!!
tradrockrat
2nd Black Belt
I respect your thinking and goals behind this, but never - ever - in million years will I voluntarily go to the ground in a multiple attacker scenario, nor would I ever advocate it. I'm not trying to start a "my way is better" argument, but I absolutely believe that one must assume the worst in any violent encounter - simply put I believe that if I go down, I am staying down forever. The concept of allowing multiple attackers to administer a beating to me is utterly unacceptable because it is impossible to be sure that they won't just stomp my head until its splits open. JMHO.
LawDog
Master Black Belt
*If there are no other options available to you then do what your training has taught you do, there is nothing else that you can do.
*If you do have options available to you, other than fighting, use the one that can be best applied to your situation.
There are way to many variables for anyone to give a correct answer for these type of situations.
:knight:
*If you do have options available to you, other than fighting, use the one that can be best applied to your situation.
There are way to many variables for anyone to give a correct answer for these type of situations.
:knight:
A colleague of mine from another forum had this to say about multiple attackers.
http://templekungforum.14.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=68&start=25&sid=9c3375da8a3a26131b5a37b35b730e7d
Current Student posted 12 basic tips on dealing with multiples.
Here they are in a manner that I can remember them easier.
1. Before the attack (as well as during and after)
A. Environmental awareness
B. Diffuse your vision
2. Basic tactics
A. Funneling
B. Biggest threat first
3. Where to be
A. Avoid going to the ground
B. Keep your escape route open
4. What to do (and when)
A. Finish off your attacker quickly and completely
B. Know when to start fighting
5. Spirit required
A. Be ferocious
B. Never quit
6. Specific to multiples
A. Using opponents as shields
B. Using opponents as rams
That is 2 Bs and 2 Ws and 2 Ss
Or perhaps another way to think of them:
Dealing with multiples is never a breeze,
Instead, its a BWEESE
http://templekungforum.14.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=68&start=25&sid=9c3375da8a3a26131b5a37b35b730e7d
Current Student posted 12 basic tips on dealing with multiples.
Here they are in a manner that I can remember them easier.
1. Before the attack (as well as during and after)
A. Environmental awareness
B. Diffuse your vision
2. Basic tactics
A. Funneling
B. Biggest threat first
3. Where to be
A. Avoid going to the ground
B. Keep your escape route open
4. What to do (and when)
A. Finish off your attacker quickly and completely
B. Know when to start fighting
5. Spirit required
A. Be ferocious
B. Never quit
6. Specific to multiples
A. Using opponents as shields
B. Using opponents as rams
That is 2 Bs and 2 Ws and 2 Ss
Or perhaps another way to think of them:
Dealing with multiples is never a breeze,
Instead, its a BWEESE
kidswarrior
Senior Master
Have read this whole thread, and can't find a better post than this. All the advice (running the gamut from 'run' to 'carry multiple weapons'), 'what if' or 'if...then' scenarios, platitudes, and 'my sensei says' quotes don't yield half the value of a good anecdote--which this one is. No posturing, list of priorities to follow, sage advice, or macho BS. Just one guy's story of an evening-stroll-turned-ugly, and a few implied lessons he garnered from it.
This episode shows the reality that fighting is ugly, unpredictable, dangerous to everyone involved, and best avoided if possible--not because saying so makes a good aphorism, but because of this story (and others like it).
- Strong side draw
- Crush grip
- Front sight
- Center of mass
- Squeeze
- Follow through
- Drop gun
- Draw knife
- Keep moving
- Kill the leader
- Don't stop killing them until they are all down or have left
- Remember that the Allfather loves valor. Those who die in battle go to Valhalla.
addendum:
Only drop gun if they're on you and the slide is locked back. And if you're so inclined keep the gun in hand and beat a few of them into pulp with it.
Multiple bigger stronger attackers? That's a deadly force situation if I've ever heard of one.
Only drop gun if they're on you and the slide is locked back. And if you're so inclined keep the gun in hand and beat a few of them into pulp with it.
Multiple bigger stronger attackers? That's a deadly force situation if I've ever heard of one.
Bill Bednarick
Green Belt
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So why even bother to train?
Here read this. WARNING IT'S NOT A PRETTY STORY! http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/local_news/article/0,1406,KNS_347_5277265,00.html
Sometimes the ultimate expression of dominance is take your life. What happens before that may just be foreplay.
Em MacIntosh
3rd Black Belt
I wholeheartedly agree. I've just found some of the fights I've been in I've avoided being hurt by pretending I was hurt worse than really was. I would never advocate this for anyone else or recomend it, but in practice it's worked before for me. Judgement of character is paramount for this, and you have to be able to determine what they are trying to accomplish. I have another suggestion, salt and sand in the pockets. I carry an umbrella now "just in case" it "rains" (legal club) and love to study the martial arts aplications of improvised weapons. In this day and age it's nice to know how to swing a chair, use a couple of bottles or whatever is available. A good pair of running shoes is the best equipment. (I think)
Bill Bednarick
Green Belt
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Judgment of character?
Where was this judgment prior to the assault? You didn't see they were of an assaultive character type?
I say assault because fights have referees.
Not me brother... It's run or fight. I'm not letting anyone have a free boot party. Too easy for things to get out of hand and you get hurt or killed.
Em MacIntosh
3rd Black Belt
Touchee.
Not sure what to say about that except I've been lucky. I guess anyone I've got into it with had some kind of concience or fear of consequence on their mind and went easy on me. Also, a point you made is that if I've chosen that rout and judged wrong, I've lost any sort of advantage I had. I thought I'd throw it in there as it's worked for me before. Even a lucky guy's luck will run out though and it only takes one time. As for why I bother to train, I enjoy it, it keeps me fit and as far as self defense is concerned, it's better than nothing. I do prefer the gun rout but don't plan on carrying one any time soon.
Not sure what to say about that except I've been lucky. I guess anyone I've got into it with had some kind of concience or fear of consequence on their mind and went easy on me. Also, a point you made is that if I've chosen that rout and judged wrong, I've lost any sort of advantage I had. I thought I'd throw it in there as it's worked for me before. Even a lucky guy's luck will run out though and it only takes one time. As for why I bother to train, I enjoy it, it keeps me fit and as far as self defense is concerned, it's better than nothing. I do prefer the gun rout but don't plan on carrying one any time soon.
