Gyokko Ryu technique Ren'yo

Bujin said:
If Uke were to grab because he lost his balance it would be the easiest thing in the world to follow up with a throw or some other type of balance take down. Why on earth would Tori let him get his balance?
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Uh, who said tori has to let him get his balance?

There are a lot of different ways to do this. Some of them are official henka, and some are the natural offshoot of the principles you find in the kata. I don't like to talk about things like this on the internet because it really can't be transmitted by words, or even video IMO.

Brian, if you get to Japan like you expect, ask me to introduce you to Kizaru. He can run you through this kata from top to bottom. He loves Dunkin Donuts French Vanilla coffee and would probably be pleased to help you if asked. He is very knowledgable about the subject matter.
 
Don Roley said:
Uh, who said tori has to let him get his balance?

There are a lot of different ways to do this. Some of them are official henka, and some are the natural offshoot of the principles you find in the kata. I don't like to talk about things like this on the internet because it really can't be transmitted by words, or even video IMO.

Brian, if you get to Japan like you expect, ask me to introduce you to Kizaru. He can run you through this kata from top to bottom. He loves Dunkin Donuts French Vanilla coffee and would probably be pleased to help you if asked. He is very knowledgable about the subject matter.
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Hey Don,

I have met Rich before. He showed Bart and I around Noda when we were trying to look for a Kamidana. You are absolutely right that he is very knowledgeable on this kata.



Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Don,

What is your favorite part about Renyo! Or better phrased which aspect of it do you like. For me I like the multiple attack's and then that the uke is trying to grab during his attacks. I also enjoy of course the footwork that gets you off the line and outside of his attack. (That I can appreciate alot)

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
What is your favorite part about Renyo! Or better phrased which aspect of it do you like.
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I like how Renyo is a bridge between the distances of Koku and Danshu.

Koku, as you know, starts at "striking" distance, dealing with punches and kicks. Danshu starts at a "grappling" distance where the opponent still has the distance to strike. The ura shuto in Danshu has the same purpose as the ura shuto in Renyo, keeping the opponent at a distance where its more difficult to counterattack with the free hand. As everyone here I'm sure is familiar with, the first three kata in the Joryaku no Maki are Koku, Renyo and Danshu. I see Renyo as beginning at striking distance, then closing the gap to a grappling distance. If you tried fitting in a koshi nage instead of kicking during the omote gyaku, you could even close the distance a step closer...

So that's what I like about it; how it bridges the gap between Koku, Danshu and the opponent...
 
Kizaru said:
I like how Renyo is a bridge between the distances of Koku and Danshu.

Koku, as you know, starts at "striking" distance, dealing with punches and kicks. Danshu starts at a "grappling" distance where the opponent still has the distance to strike. The ura shuto in Danshu has the same purpose as the ura shuto in Renyo, keeping the opponent at a distance where its more difficult to counterattack with the free hand. As everyone here I'm sure is familiar with, the first three kata in the Joryaku no Maki are Koku, Renyo and Danshu. I see Renyo as beginning at striking distance, then closing the gap to a grappling distance. If you tried fitting in a koshi nage instead of kicking during the omote gyaku, you could even close the distance a step closer...

So that's what I like about it; how it bridges the gap between Koku, Danshu and the opponent...
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I like that!

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Bujin said:
If Uke were to grab because he lost his balance it would be the easiest thing in the world to follow up with a throw or some other type of balance take down. Why on earth would Tori let him get his balance?
Best Regards /

Bujin
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Just to clarify, I also mean stabilize as in "Grab you to stop you from moving around and avoid his attacks"
 
Back to the strategy aspect of the kata. If you're trying to do the kata as written, then the angle of your initial movement inside uke's punch becomes key. You want to be just outside the range of uke's left hand, so his best option becomes the right (front leg) kick.
 
Kreth said:
Back to the strategy aspect of the kata. If you're trying to do the kata as written, then the angle of your initial movement inside uke's punch becomes key. You want to be just outside the range of uke's left hand, so his best option becomes the right (front leg) kick.
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So he/she just flows into that kick and you can then take advantage of them by moving off line and kicking their outstretched leg. It is a sound and very good strategy.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
So he/she just flows into that kick and you can then take advantage of them by moving off line and kicking their outstretched leg. It is a sound and very good strategy.
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I wasn't think of it so much as a strategy, as a way to do the kata correctly. If my angle on the first movement is off, uke can just throw the left and doesn't need to kick. If I'm too close to his lead foot, then he may use a different attack, or even move back. This kind of thing is what I get from breaking down kata on my own. "Why do I move here, and not here?" "Why am I using this strike?"
 
Kreth said:
I wasn't think of it so much as a strategy, as a way to do the kata correctly. If my angle on the first movement is off, uke can just throw the left and doesn't need to kick. If I'm too close to his lead foot, then he may use a different attack, or even move back. This kind of thing is what I get from breaking down kata on my own. "Why do I move here, and not here?" "Why am I using this strike?"
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Okay, that is good. I am usually trying to get that position just right as well. So I can definately understand that.

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
Okay, that is good. I am usually trying to get that position just right as well. So I can definately understand that.
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I've always liked Renyo. It seems like you're just out of uke's reach, and after each attack, you're saying "Oooooooo, that *almost* got me. C'mon, try again." :p
 
Although it sounds familiar, I am trying to visualize the kata as described, I am sure I have done it, I am weak on names and some of the various terminologies, but if I felt it, I could tell you if it is familiar or not. Honestly though, because it is so hard to convey in words and it has a feeling with it, I would rather us get together on the mat and do the kata and play with the various henka. Of course, I know it isn't possible, but.... I will be at the Bujinkan Buyu Camp East next month.... ;)
 
Bigshadow said:
Although it sounds familiar, I am trying to visualize the kata as described, I am sure I have done it, I am weak on names and some of the various terminologies, but if I felt it, I could tell you if it is familiar or not. Honestly though, because it is so hard to convey in words and it has a feeling with it, I would rather us get together on the mat and do the kata and play with the various henka. Of course, I know it isn't possible, but.... I will be at the Bujinkan Buyu Camp East next month.... ;)
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Hey Dave,

That is a great way to know if you are familiar with a technique is by doing it on the mats. :) I am sure that you have practiced Renyo before and will remember the movements when practicing it again in your dojo. I to am horrible with names and terminology too. (it is not my strong suit) While I cannot make the Bujinkan Buyu East Camp next month, I am sure that you will have a great time. Someday we will have to get all of the MartialTalk Budo Taijutsu guy's together for training. Who knows maybe it will be sooner rather than later. :ultracool

Brian R. VanCise
www.instinctiveresponsetraining.com
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
Someday we will have to get all of the MartialTalk Budo Taijutsu guy's together for training. Who knows maybe it will be sooner rather than later. :ultracool
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Yeah, that would be cool! :ultracool
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
Someday we will have to get all of the MartialTalk Budo Taijutsu guy's together for training.
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Well, if you would like Jeffrey S. Velten™ to attend, please contact my agent.



:uhyeah:
 
Kreth said:
Well, if you would like Jeffrey S. Velten™ to attend, please contact my agent.



:uhyeah:
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Okay Mr. Velten, I will contact your agent. If I am correct his name if Jeff, right?
icon10.gif
 
Brian R. VanCise said:
Okay Mr. Velten, I will contact your agent. If I am correct his name if Jeff, right?
icon10.gif
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Yes, that's m--er, him.
 
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