Extremely Frustrated

[IcemanSK]

I laughed when I read what Xue said, but then it reminded me of something. When I was kickboxing I'd get really nervous when sparring. The ring is basically a stage: THAT idea never helped.

My trainer used to tell me something I thought was strange, but now I understand it. He used to say to me, "your problem is that you're smart. You get in the ring & you start thinking instead of fighting. You're thinkin' of doing x,y, & z. Don't think, just fight. Like the movie "Bull Durham: Don't think, just pitch." I had to learn to relax (a lot), stop thinking & just fight.

Pam, maybe that's an issue for you, too. Especially if your former training said, "if A happens, do B." Try to relax. After all, it's fun:boing1:.

 

[Steel Tiger]

Kasey is exactly right. You wouldn't be testing if somebody didn't think you were ready.

Being nervous about a test is fine, but worried about it will undo all your good work. I think you need to step back from it for a while and just relax. From what you have said you've got the knowledge so I suggest you just train it without any thought of why you are training it.

My teacher's school is at a university so I have seen many people who are trained to analyse and examine things in detail doing martial arts. Their greatest hurdle was their mental training. They pulled everything apart and were overwhelmed by the techniques. Detailed analysis is the death of technique. But I think you know that already. I also think you know the techniques and have done them before, but the test has made you start to analyse them on too fine a level. That is why I say you need to step back and just train.

What is it they say about plans? The first casualty in combat, isn't it? You've done all the stuff, its in your head, and its getting into your arms and legs. A plan is actually going to limit how you can respond. It will focus your mind, but not in a good way. One aspect of the test is to evaluate your breadth of learning and a plan of operation is going to restrict that demonstration. I tell my students to apply the concept of Wu Wei - doing without doing. Go in with a really broad plan like "I'm going to be aggressive" or "I'm going to counterattack" and the rest will come.

The only other thing I can say is good luck.

 

[Jade Tigress]

You guys are amazing. Thank you so much for the great advice. Xue asked why I train. Well, it's to be able to defend, which is why this is so frustrating for me. It's my main goal and my biggest weakness.

I hear over and over again, "don't think, just do". I don't know how to do that! I like ST's suggestion of an overall plan to "be aggressive" etc. instead of breaking it down into detail.

You all have such great tips on overcoming this, and I want to overcome it so badly. I have to train, train, train, and not give up.

So, you think it's a bad idea to formulate 2 or 3 techniques I plan on using per attack? I'm afraid if I don't have a plan, that when I defend/counter, instead of using a trained technique, I'll do something stupid like kick the guy in the shin and run away, lol! (that's a joke, but you get the idea).

I think Iceman pegged it, I'm just waaaaaay too smart for this. *rolls eyes*

 

[jks9199]

You guys are amazing. Thank you so much for the great advice. Xue asked why I train. Well, it's to be able to defend, which is why this is so frustrating for me. It's my main goal and my biggest weakness.

I hear over and over again, "don't think, just do". I don't know how to do that! I like ST's suggestion of an overall plan to "be aggressive" etc. instead of breaking it down into detail.

You all have such great tips on overcoming this, and I want to overcome it so badly. I have to train, train, train, and not give up.

So, you think it's a bad idea to formulate 2 or 3 techniques I plan on using per attack? I'm afraid if I don't have a plan, that when I defend/counter, instead of using a trained technique, I'll do something stupid like kick the guy in the shin and run away, lol! (that's a joke, but you get the idea).

I think Iceman pegged it, I'm just waaaaaay too smart for this. *rolls eyes*

One problem I see a lot (and have had myself) is thinking too much, and playing the "is that really movement" game.

You know, when you're sparring someone, and you see them move, and you go "was that a kick?" just before a foot lands in your face, or you ponder "was that step forward setting up a jab" just before the fist lands in your face...

It's real simple... and really hard to do. MOVEMENT IS MOVEMENT. If you see movement, MOVE. Do something, and you'll be further along even if it's not perfect or ideal than if you stood there trying to decide if it was movement, and if so, what you needed to do. Some people talk about the OODA Loop; Observe, Orient, Decide, Act. It's referring to that thought process... and it tells you why action is faster than reaction. You're getting locked in the first three stages... simplify them. MOVEMENT means it's time to move. Pick one direction, and decide ahead of time that as soon as you see movement, you're going to step on that line. Cover, then defend. Once you get this to work... (as easy as it sounds, and as easy as it is after the fact, getting there is hard), you'll wonder why you ever had trouble!

 

[Em MacIntosh]

Managing pressure and knowing how much works for you and how much is detrimental is quintessential knowledge if you're hesitant. You could have pnemonia, a broken toe and it could be slippery outside but when that rottweiler's chasing you you'll clear that six foot fence! Me, I like pressure. When it comes to martial arts, the more the better. It helps me concentrate and trance out at the same time. Sometimes you could use a slight adjustment to your mechanics too.
"Yes, I can feel your anger. It gives you focus, makes you stronger!"

 

[Clapping_tiger]

Crap. I just found out I'm testing the 3rd week of January. I am not prepared. I have one instructor who teaches on Monday's and one who teaches on Wednesday's. I was talking to them about this. Both came to the conclusion that I am over thinking things. And I am. They give me great suggestions to overcome it, you all have given me great suggestions to overcome it. But....I can't! :vu:

As if testing isn't nerve-racking enough, now I have to worry about this portion of the test, and performing well in front of one of the head instructors with a video camera rolling. I'm doomed.

I am trying to visualize, I have all the techniques necessary to do well, I have great instructors and training partners. There's no excuse dammit. If I wasn't so damn stubborn I'd just give up. But that's not me. My goal is to become proficient in this style. I WILL DO IT DAMMIT!!! ... but I'm worried about testing. I'd feel better if someone else were having the same problem, but this is a problem for only me. *sigh*

In my previous style, we had an *if A is thrown, you do B*, and I could get that. But in reality, that is not how fights occur. You don't know what's coming and you have to be prepared to use the various techniques you have on the spur of the moment. What if someone throws A, you do B, and they can counter it? Then what? That is not realistic training to me. Easier yes, but not really preparing you for any scenerio.

I'm trying to go through my notes and choose 2 or 3 techniques for each possible attack so I have some sort of "plan". Yeah, I'll still be thinking rather than reacting, but, it's a start.

Wish me luck, I need it.

It almost sounds to me like your hurdle isn't physical, but mental. As long as you keep saying you can't do it, you won't. Being spontaneous is a cornerstone to the way I like to train and the way I teach. It may be too late for you for this next test, but maybe something to work on, is just defending the attack. If you don't do a full technique, but defend the attack and use what you already know, then you succeeded. As you keep working this spontaneous defense, you will find your brain freezes less as you get used to it, and your muscle memory will kick in and next thing you know you are defending with the proper technique. I think, and from my experience (because we have all been there), that you are focusing too hard and getting X technique down to defend against the right attack. First just focus on stopping the attack, then fine tune after you get that down. With all that said, good luck on your test. I am sure they wouldn't be testing you if they didn't feel you were ready. Just belive in that, and you should do fine.

 

[Jade Tigress]

Yeah, it's definitely a mind and spontaneity thing for me. I'm reviewing all the material I have written down and am going to go in with the "aggressive" mindset. I have GOT to do this. I have to get it. I keep hoping muscle memory will *kick in*, but it's not there yet. Dammit.

 

[tellner]

JT, you are worrying about this way too much. You're fighting yourself at darned near full strength. Chill. Relax. Smoke a bowl or whatever your equivalent is. Don't worry about the test. Focus on enjoying what you're doing instead of making it a big, frightening thing that you have to conquer. It's a marathon, not a sprint.

 

[Jade Tigress]

JT, you are worrying about this way too much. You're fighting yourself at darned near full strength. Chill. Relax. Smoke a bowl or whatever your equivalent is. Don't worry about the test. Focus on enjoying what you're doing instead of making it a big, frightening thing that you have to conquer. It's a marathon, not a sprint.

Thanks. You made me laugh with the bowl thing too. Ok, I will chill. I stress over it so much because it's important to me. But you're right, it's a marathon, not a sprint. And as Xue said, I'm not going to get beaten or thrown out of class if I don't do well. I'm my own worst enemy sometimes. I'm chillin dude. :supcool:

 

[Brian R. VanCise]

Thanks. You made me laugh with the bowl thing too. Ok, I will chill. I stress over it so much because it's important to me. But you're right, it's a marathon, not a sprint. And as Xue said, I'm not going to get beaten or thrown out of class if I don't do well. I'm my own worst enemy sometimes. I'm chillin dude. :supcool:

Hey Jade I have to agree with Tellner and Xue just relax and enjoy!

 

[Xue Sheng]

Yeaham going to go in with the "aggressive" mindset. I have GOT to do this. I have to get it.

STOP IT.... Now relax and take it easy... breathe, calm down and don't worry about it... it will come.

 

[morph4me]

How did it go? Did you relax and let it flow?

 

[Jade Tigress]

Haven't tested yet. Delayed with the trade show and stuff. But it WILL be soon. It was mentioned again at class on Monday. I'm not looking forward to it for this aspect alone. My techniques, while improved, leave much to be desired. I have completed the required papers though. I'm
*ready* to test...but not ready to test. I HATE TESTING. lol And the worst part is the video camera rolliing, making me more self-conscious than ever. I have to stop "thinking" and just "do". Except I can't, not yet anyway. *sigh*
Well, it's coming, so I'll test, embarrass myself, and hopefully pass by the skin of my teeth.

 

[morph4me]

If it makes you feel better when I look at the video from one of my tests I still think that my instructor was in a very generous mood. The pressure is part of the test, and once you start you'll end up relaxing and just doing it.

 

[kidswarrior]

Well, it's coming, so I'll test, embarrass myself, and hopefully pass by the skin of my teeth.

Let me presume to tell you how it'll probably really go. (Stop! Don't do this to your monitor :knight2:--I won't feel it ). But feel free to tell me I'm full of it... come to think of it, you have before

Now using your template: You'll test, be embarrassed (though no one else will know why or possibly even notice), and sail through, all the while beating yourself up for not being perfect.

Now, as my authority for busting into your private space with this audacious prediction, I quote one of the foremost CMAist of our time...well, of our board, for sure

STOP IT.... Now relax and take it easy... breathe, calm down and don't worry about it...

 

[Steel Tiger]

I have to say that the delays are not helpful when you are nervy about testing. But that being said, it sounds to me like you are being quite hard on yourself. These tests aren't about perfection, they're about knowledge. Reasonable teachers (I'm assuming your teacher is reasonable) want to see that you have learnt and understood the techniques, not ape them perfectly.

I've said it before, you have the knowledge and techniques, it is your frustration (not helped by delays) and dislike of testing that are making you doubt yourself. I am quite confident that come the day you will perform as well as you can and pass the test.

Consider this from the one and only Fred Astaire

The higher up you go, the more mistakes you are allowed. Right at the top, if you make enough of them, its considered to be your style.

 

[Sanchin-J]

Hmm.. Well, I can only speak for myself really on the matter, but in order to explain I might have to get a big "wordy." I'm a fairly peaceful person by nature, I don't like violence and would rather talk my way out of situations, you could say I don't have that killer instinct almost, except for when my temper flares or things result in me being struck.

The way we train in my art however seems to work for me and the others who study, it isn't so much about sparring or trying to change your mentality to face situations as much as it is training in the movements until they become near to a natural reaction in self defense. As an example, a few years ago I was working as a security guard in one of the local hospitals in my area and had just stepped out on the triage floor when I saw two men running into the hospital. Alarmed, I took up a spot near the door and intercepted them and it turns out, the larger of the two was after the smaller guy and they had been fist fighting for several blocks. The larger of the two men shouted at me and swung and it was like a switch, things just happened. The security cameras caught the whole thing and later I got a chance to sit down and review it. He came in to strike me, I struck his incoming arm, snapped up a rising elbow to his chin and knocked him clean off his feet, once he was on the floor I turned him over and subdued him while calling for backup. The other kid stood there shocked and was quickly taken into custody by my backup until the city police arrived and took them both to jail.

To this day, I honestly can't remember the actual physical confrontation from a first hand perspective, the only thing keeping it clear in my head was seeing it on the tape after it was all over. The training was there, it was in my subconscious, active and was called upon without having to think about it at all. We train in our movements and use a lot of combinations of basic fundamentals, but beyond that we focus on being comfortable with our own variations to the techniques and I think that's probably what develops the subconscious ability to defend yourself. You don't necessarily have to think at that moment, but let your body do what it was conditioned to do.

Anyhow, I don't know if this helps at all, but from my experience, the best way to condition your body and to nurture your reactions during those situations is to practice advanced forms and katas, and to allow yourself to deviate during practice by introducing new conditions in the confrontation you may be facing.

 

[Jade Tigress]

Let me presume to tell you how it'll probably really go. (Stop! Don't do this to your monitor :knight2:--I won't feel it ). But feel free to tell me I'm full of it... come to think of it, you have before

Now using your template: You'll test, be embarrassed (though no one else will know why or possibly even notice), and sail through, all the while beating yourself up for not being perfect.

Now, as my authority for busting into your private space with this audacious prediction, I quote one of the foremost CMAist of our time...well, of our board, for sure

Mark, your post made me smile. Thanks.

I have to say that the delays are not helpful when you are nervy about testing. But that being said, it sounds to me like you are being quite hard on yourself. These tests aren't about perfection, they're about knowledge. Reasonable teachers (I'm assuming your teacher is reasonable) want to see that you have learnt and understood the techniques, not ape them perfectly.

I've said it before, you have the knowledge and techniques, it is your frustration (not helped by delays) and dislike of testing that are making you doubt yourself. I am quite confident that come the day you will perform as well as you can and pass the test.

Actually, I've been thankful for the delay. lol I am much harder on myself than my instructors are. I know that. It's probably because training is important to me. I don't demand perfection from myself, but damn near close!

The training was there, it was in my subconscious, active and was called upon without having to think about it at all. We train in our movements and use a lot of combinations of basic fundamentals, but beyond that we focus on being comfortable with our own variations to the techniques and I think that's probably what develops the subconscious ability to defend yourself. You don't necessarily have to think at that moment, but let your body do what it was conditioned to do.

Anyhow, I don't know if this helps at all, but from my experience, the best way to condition your body and to nurture your reactions during those situations is to practice advanced forms and katas, and to allow yourself to deviate during practice by introducing new conditions in the confrontation you may be facing.

This is what I'm waiting for. It just takes a long time for muscle memory to kick in. My frustration comes because it's not in muscle memory yet so I have to think about my actions. And when that happens, I delay and falter.

Great story BTW.

I can't thank you all enough for your great advice and encouragement. :asian:

 

[morph4me]

This is what I'm waiting for. It just takes a long time for muscle memory to kick in. My frustration comes because it's not in muscle memory yet so I have to think about my actions. And when that happens, I delay and falter.

The paradox of the martial arts the more you think about it and the harder you try, the harder it is to do it, when you stop thinking and trying to get it perfect, it happens all by itself. As for me, according to the Fred Astair quote in Steel Tiger's post, I have style :uhyeah:

 

[bluekey88]

TONS of great advice on this thread...it really would make a great sticky.

I'd like to take a different tack. I don't think it'll help with the upcoming test, but it may help with the problem in general.

I have some questions for you. It may seem a tad harsh, but it really is not mean to be.

What is it that you are scared of? What is the worst that can happen?

The reason I ask is that I'm getting a lot of anxiety vibe off of your posts. Even the earlier ones prior to the test. I'm wondering if there isn't a fair bit of anxiety around doing these SD techs spontaneouosly. Thus the need to plan and prepare and the lock-up when actually put into position to do so. Basically, I'm saying what everyone else is saying, but from a different perspective.

Here's my take. Long ago and far away I was once in music school. I'm a decent musician and I had a fair bit of promise. Every semester as part of my grade I had to sit for a juried performance. I had to play a few pieces that I'd prepared over the course of the semester for a panel of my professors as well as perform for the entire school.

Inevitably i would get the worst panic attack. Literally get tunnel vision, my leg would shake so bad I almost couldn't operate the piano pedals. My mind would go blank. It was awful.

Now, It doesn't sound as if what you expereince is to that extreme a degree, but it certainly sounds like it's in the neighborhood.

Here's my advice (FWIW). Have you tried something like progressive relaxation? Basically, think about the worst case scenario (perhaps testing) and rate how tense and anxious this makes you feel. Then think of a related but totally non anxiety producing scanario. Thwe worst case is 10, the least case is 0. Then come up with some sort of "relaxation scenario" Sitting on the beach, sleeping in on a Saturday morning...whatever works for you. Also learn how to otally relax your body and let go of tension. A common technique is to lie down with your eyes closed thinking of your relexation place and starting from your toes and working your way up. Tense your muscles and then elt them go...paying close attention to how the let go sensation feels. Very shortly you should be able to evoke this sensation of total body relaxation at will. You can even pick up tapes and CD's where someone walks you through this.

Anyway, once you can relax yourself, start with scenarios 1 (least) and think about it...when you start getting anxious...just use your relaxation technique. Don't move on until you can think about a scecario without getting any anxiety. Work your way up through increasinlgy more difficult scenarious until you can self-relax when confronted your worst-case scenario.

The next level is to try to use this in the actual scenario.

In this case, you are going to teach yourself to systematically relax and let go.

It works great for me and a number of my clients over the years. Now it may not take the anxiety away. I still get nervous if I have to perfrom...but I can handle that energy now and channel it. I'm in control rather than the fear.

Then again...I could be totally off about the root cause of the problem here. Just tought I'd throw that out for you.

Good luck and keep training.

Peace,
Erik