Dear Mr Roley

[Limeydog]

Dear Mr Roley,

Can I take this opportunity to tell you how disappointed i am at your responce to the posting from Satt. I believe that you are an experienced martial artist (20 years + of study) yet the way you are talking to new members is disgraceful. You are giving us all a bad name. So what if Satt is new to the martial arts? That does not give you the right to bully him, why don't you lead by example and help mold the young mind of a beginner martial artist. Your actions do not make me believe that you are in any teaching position. I can appreciate that you live and train in Japan, that in iteself is respectable, your thoughts, words and deeds however are not. I think it is time to climb down from your ivory tower and practice what you preach. I think you owe Satt an apology. If Satt is not around in the next five years I think it may have to do with the actions of certain martial elders who should know better than the actions of a relative beginner in the martial arts. This letter is not meant as a personal attack to you but as a martial artist and teacher I really don't appreciate bullies.

Regards
Patrick Pace

 

[Limeydog]

Wow I have just found out that Mr Roley is a moderator for Martial Talk. that is very disappointing. To me that is an abuse of power to shoot down a new member/beginner in martial arts. I presume I shall be suspended for speaking my mind or ex communicated...

Later

 

[GAB]

Dear Mr Roley,

Can I take this opportunity to tell you how disappointed i am at your responce to the posting from Satt. I believe that you are an experienced martial artist (20 years + of study) yet the way you are talking to new members is disgraceful. You are giving us all a bad name. So what if Satt is new to the martial arts? That does not give you the right to bully him, why don't you lead by example and help mold the young mind of a beginner martial artist. Your actions do not make me believe that you are in any teaching position. I can appreciate that you live and train in Japan, that in iteself is respectable, your thoughts, words and deeds however are not. I think it is time to climb down from your ivory tower and practice what you preach. I think you owe Satt an apology. If Satt is not around in the next five years I think it may have to do with the actions of certain martial elders who should know better than the actions of a relative beginner in the martial arts. This letter is not meant as a personal attack to you but as a martial artist and teacher I really don't appreciate bullies.

Regards
Patrick Pace

I was thinking this very thing when I read his post.
I thought to myself don't go there Gary you have been warned and warned, so I waited, thank you.
Regards, Gary

 

[gmunoz]

Dear Mr Roley,

Can I take this opportunity to tell you how disappointed i am at your responce to the posting from Satt. I believe that you are an experienced martial artist (20 years + of study) yet the way you are talking to new members is disgraceful. You are giving us all a bad name. So what if Satt is new to the martial arts? That does not give you the right to bully him, why don't you lead by example and help mold the young mind of a beginner martial artist. Your actions do not make me believe that you are in any teaching position. I can appreciate that you live and train in Japan, that in iteself is respectable, your thoughts, words and deeds however are not. I think it is time to climb down from your ivory tower and practice what you preach. I think you owe Satt an apology. If Satt is not around in the next five years I think it may have to do with the actions of certain martial elders who should know better than the actions of a relative beginner in the martial arts. This letter is not meant as a personal attack to you but as a martial artist and teacher I really don't appreciate bullies.

Regards
Patrick Pace

I must say that I completely agree... This is an open forum, however that response was in bad taste - especially from a mod. Shame on you...

 

[Cruentus]

O.K... I am speaking as Paul Janulis the longstanding member rather then a mod for the moment because I am a very new Moderator, and I don't Moderate the ninjitsu forum. So, please don't take this as an official statement...

You all may have valid concerns, however, I don't feel it is appropriate to have a public discussion about any MT member, staff or otherwise, in a negative manner like this.

This could have all been handled through the report to mod feature, and PM's to admins. if necissary. IMHO, I think that future concerns of this nature should be handled this way. That being said, your concerns have/will be heard, and will be dealt with accordingly by the appropriate staff member.

As to Don being a Mod, he is fairly new at it just like me. We are still learning the ropes, and mistakes may be made. So, I ask that you please be patient with me and any new staff member.

That said, I am asking that you please discontinue posting on this thread until the correct staff member can handle this accordingly...

Thank you,

Paul

 

[gmunoz]

Thank you Paul. I went ahead and reported the post. Again, thank you.

 

[still learning]

Hello, We must learn about the good and the bad stuffs (the comments). So others do not make the same mistakes? Thanks....Aloha

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

I challenge Satt to prove Don wrong.

 

[Satt]

I challenge Satt to prove Don wrong.

That's actually a good call Nimravus. I appreciate the love guys, but please don't get yourself booted at my expense. I need someone to talk to you know. LOL. I allready said I am done with that section anyway. I am not worried about it. Don had some pretty good points and I took the good and ignored the rest. I have been dabbling in different martial arts for several years. I am just trying to pick one and go with it full force. Don't worry, I will be around in five years. I am not gonna just quit because of a little constructive critisism.

 

[Grey Eyed Bandit]

A few days ago at Honbu there was a guy whom by accident wore gi pants with the Genbukan logotype on it...wonder what would happen if someone did the same with a TSD outfit?

 

[Don Roley]

Don had some pretty good points and I took the good and ignored the rest.

Don't ignore the rest. I am pleased with the private message you sent me, but I will stand ready to kick you in the pants whenever you need it. The best learning experiences I have had have not been pleasent.

Sometimes you need a friend to lend a shoulder to cry on. Sometimes you need a friend to tell you that you are acting like a jerk and to shape up before others pick up on the fact. You have gotten some damn good advice on this forum, but always managed to find an excuse to ignore it and do what you wanted to. It would help my reputation as a nice guy if I went along with this, but would that really help you in the long run?

You want to ask questions? Fine. Don't be afraid if the answers are not what you wanted. I care too much about honesty to give you anything other than what I think is in your best interest.

 

[Satt]

Well, what I meant by ignore the rest was just that I took in the advice, but ignored the bad feelings. Yes, I am a sensitive man. LOL.

 

[RRouuselot]

Dear Mr Roley,

1) Can I take this opportunity to tell you how disappointed i am at your responce to the posting from Satt. I believe that you are an experienced martial artist (20 years + of study) yet the way you are talking to new members is disgraceful.

2) You are giving us all a bad name. So what if Satt is new to the martial arts?

3) That does not give you the right to bully him,

4) why don't you lead by example and help mold the young mind of a beginner martial artist.

5) Your actions do not make me believe that you are in any teaching position.

6) I can appreciate that you live and train in Japan, that in iteself is respectable, your thoughts, words and deeds however are not.

7) I think it is time to climb down from your ivory tower and practice what you preach.

8) I think you owe Satt an apology. If Satt is not around in the next five years I think it may have to do with the actions of certain martial elders who should know better than the actions of a relative beginner in the martial arts.

9) This letter is not meant as a personal attack to you but as a martial artist and teacher I really don't appreciate bullies.

Regards
Patrick Pace

1)I’m not.

2)Really?? How so?

3)If he is really in it for the long haul he’ll suck it up and get over it.

4)How? By wiping his backside for him and holding his hand until the guy can pass a shodan test in a real dojo?

5)I think they do. Hell I kicked my best friend of 20 years out of my dojo…..he got over and trains in something else now. Sometimes being in the postion of a "sensei" is not always an cheerful one and sometimes you have to do stuff the doesnt make everyone feel all warm and fuzzy. This is something you can't learn by video instruction.......:wink2:

6)Really? Why? Lot’s of people do it…..in fact anybody can do it.

7)I think it’s time people start teaching the not just the easy lessons to young people but also the hard ones………otherwise they will grow up to be a generation of whiners that need to have everything spoon fed to them.
It's called building character.

8)I think you owe Don one.

9)Bull! If you had any different intent you would have sent it by email or PM

 

[RRouuselot]

Wow I have just found out that Mr Roley is a moderator for Martial Talk. that is very disappointing. To me that is an abuse of power to shoot down a new member/beginner in martial arts. I presume I shall be suspended for speaking my mind or ex communicated...

Later

No, no personal attack intended at all.:bs:

 

[RRouuselot]

I must say that I completely agree... This is an open forum, however that response was in bad taste - especially from a mod. Shame on you...

Are you saying that from something you learned while on suspension from MT for being rude or did it just come to you????

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Gentlemen....enough, ok?

I fully realize that to a number of folks my comments are about as effrective as a UN traffic cop, but...enough.


1 - Don is a moderator here for our Traditional ninjutsu forum. Not the Ninjutsu general, not the TKD, and not the SKH. His comments were as 1 member to another.

2 - He responded based on what he saw, and what he thought would help. The approach was a bit more direct and blunt than most of us are used to. Welcome to the wonderful world of "Culture Shock". I honestly believe that 90% of American martial artists would fail (prosibly myself included) if confronted with traditional training. But hell, boot camp isn't for everyone either.

3 - The 2 individuals (Don and SATT) seem to have resolved things. SATT seemed to understand what Don was saying, and was able to filter out the "bothersome wording choices" in the message.

4 - Suspensions..... no, not for this one. I see this as a clarification, not an attack, and Don has asked that it remain open so that he can get feedback as well. However since it has nothing to do with SKH, we will move it to the Ninjutsu-general area (which is not under Dons moderation either, for those keeping score)

5 - Abuse of Power - Umm, no. Don stated his opinion. Being a mod doesn't stop anyone from being able to do that, and it also doesn't make what is said 'official policy' either.

Don lives in Japan, trains Japanese style, in a traditional Japanese art. Other than an actual Japanese, he (and the other folks in similar situations) are the closest you will get to actual intel. I've found too often that the information found in tour books and websites to be limited, or impractical due to various mistranslations. The intel I get from guys like Don and Robert is pretty consistant, so I deem it as reliable. You don't have to like the messenger, but open the minds to the message.

 

[Shizen Shigoku]

I really didn't want to get into this as I don't like to discuss other people, but I have to agree with RRouuselot. Stop whining. I think Mr. Roley comes off a bit harsh sometimes - I've read a lot of his postings on various martial arts related fora - however, my respect for his honesty and his good intentions override any personal feelings for his word choices.

If we were in a sewing circle, and discussing topics on a quilting forum, I'd understand how some might be offended by the no nonsense attitude, but guess what? This is a martial arts forum! I suspect that most of the people posting here are or are aspiring to be martial artists / fighters / warriors. If you get upset over a few honest words, then you certainly don't have the fighting spirit necessary to survive a dangerous situation.

If you don't like what someone has to say, you have the right to let them know, but I recommend that you first look inside yourself and find out what it is about you (your ego) that took offense.

Satt admitted he is a sensitive man. There is nothing wrong with that. I too am quite sensitive. One can be sensitive and still be a strong warrior. Sometimes you just have to suck it up, stop whining, and display your personal power by not reacting to every little stab you feel. What do you think would happen in a combat situation if you showed discomfort, anger, or fear? Think the enemy will be sympathetic and appologize - not likely. This is not to say that you should think of people that rub you the wrong way on this forum as enemies, but in any uncomfotable situation, it's best to "never let them see you sweat."

Don, keep up the good work. I have learned so much from you. Don't ever change! :asian:

 

[Limeydog]

Thanks Shizen,

You have just helped put alot of things into perspective.

Regards
Patrick

 

[Limeydog]

I'm not suspended...I spoke my mind, standing up for what I believed in much like Mr Roley. You and other people don't have to agree with that, respect it would be nice as everyone has a difference of opinion thats what makes this forum what it is...I understand where Mr Roley now comes from, I just thought it could have been handled with a little bit more care...I guess the same could have been said about my post. I spoke my mind about what I thought and felt. I respect alot of people on this forum, even if I don't personally agree with what they do or say. As for being called a crybaby...oh well opinions vary but I can live with it.

I look forward to further posts good or bad

Regards

 

[MJS]

I spoke my mind, standing up for what I believed in much like Mr Roley. You and other people don't have to agree with that, respect it would be nice as everyone has a difference of opinion thats what makes this forum what it is

Well said! I think that no matter what the discussion, no matter which forum, etc. there will always be disagreements. If the disagreements seem to be getting heated, there are a number of options that you can take.

1- Report the post to a mod.

2- There is an ignore feature on everyones profile. If you don't want to read or hear from someone, its there to use.

3- Email or PM the person.

Its very hard to always make sure that what is being typed is going to be totally understood by everyone reading it. Rather than always jumping the gun, stop and think about whats being said, and try to find a better way to discuss it calmly rather than turning to a flame!

Mike