Consistent Knockout Neck Chop

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Talk' started by josephus, Feb 2, 2018.

  1. josephus

    josephus White Belt

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    So I got curious if karate chops were real. Upon doing research I found several videos that have neck chop knockouts.

    Im fairly confident that most of these videos are real. However I also found a video by a guy called "Dillman".

    I initially believed the video, as he did a simple chop. However I later found a video of him teaching a student to form a "Chi ball."

    My confidence in the neck chop is now somewhat shaken.

    However I remain somewhat confident that chops CAN knock you out, as I find it implausible the non-Dillman videos are tainted by his woo.

    To argue because Dillman is a dillhole therefore no chops knock out people would be a example of the genetic fallacy.

    So if I found me a karate master and let him chop my neck would I go down fairly consistently?
     
  2. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    well this sounds like a good plan. go find out for yourself. let us know how things turn out for you.
    what part of the world are you in? im sure we can all make some recommendations for suitable karate masters that would be more than happy to chop you in the neck.
     
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  3. Buka

    Buka Grandmaster

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    Welcome to MartialTalk, Josephus.

    A karate Chop, Shuto, Knife hand, etc etc, is a real Martial technique. And like just about any technique, it can conceivably knock a person out.

    If you found a "Karate Master" and let him chop your neck, my bet is he would politely decline the invitation.
     
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  4. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    I don’t need more proof.
     
  5. WaterGal

    WaterGal Master Black Belt

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    It's a real technique. I think a guy teaching fake techniques probably has to teach some number of real techniques too if he's going to convince anyone that his BS has merit. Like, if a gulliable person sees him knock out someone with real move, then they might believe that he can do the other thing too.
     
  6. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    Personally, I think that George Dillman, Ashida Kim, Frank Dux, Chosun Ninja and others of that ilk are somewhere between the completely unbalanced and total con artists.
    That being so, it doesn't mean that nothing they teach is useful. Knife hand strikes to the neck are a real and effective technique. They can knock you out. They can kill you. They can do nothing useful whatsoever.
    There are just too many variables to give any other answer.
    Personally, I know a couple places in the neck that will knock you out with reasonable reliability. The thing is, striking them requires a high degree of precision, and you're not going to get that without years of practice. And they're not easy to hit. So if you're counting on this strike ending a fight, you're likely to be disappointed.
     
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  7. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Reminds me of a great saying...

    Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
     
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  8. Dirty Dog

    Dirty Dog MT Senior Moderator Staff Member

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    Unless it's a 24hr clock. Then it's only right once a day.
     
  9. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    One of my cousins KO'd a kid at school when he was 8. No training, he just "judo chopped" the other kid who was wrestling/fighting his friend like he had seen on TV. Apparently KOd him and scared him half to death because he thought he had killed the kid.

    In one of my two real fights as an adult I TKOd the guy with a forearm to the neck.

    In light contact sparring I TKOd a classmate with a kick to the neck (was aiming at the head).

    I wouldn't count on it, it is a naturally protected target, but if you can hit it, it certainly has a track record.
     
  10. Tames D

    Tames D RECKLESS

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    And they say you can't learn martial arts from video :D
     
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  11. jobo

    jobo Senior Master

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    a chop will deliver substantial force, its bone against target after all,

    the karate chop in movies has magical knock out properties than I'm far from convinced will result in instant and prolonged unconsciousness in real life, just as( just about) every right cross in a movie has the oppoinent spark out.

    if someone presents their neck for a chop, it would be rude not to oblige, however don't be surprised if the only result is your oppoinent getting more annoyed
     
  12. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    Or digital. Then it's never right.
     
  13. gpseymour

    gpseymour Sr. Grandmaster

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    I like this train of thought, Jobo. I hate to be rude.
     
  14. Balrog

    Balrog Master of Arts

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    Hard impact to the brachial plexus origin pressure point is a highly effective stunning move, and can cause the person to black out for a short period of time.
     
  15. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    or......you could practice getting enough power in your strikes where you just hear things go crunch when you hit him in the neck. then you wouldnt have to worry about all of this never center stuff.
     
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  16. JR 137

    JR 137 Senior Master

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    Or practice them until you hear crunch no matter where you hit them. And practice getting hit until your crunching doesn’t bother you anymore or it doesn’t crunch you anymore. Think Kyokushin and Uechi Ryu, among others.
     
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  17. drop bear

    drop bear Sr. Grandmaster

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    Behind the ear is a fairly well recognized KO point.
     
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  18. hoshin1600

    hoshin1600 Senior Master

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    In full disclosure. This is something my uechi-ryu teacher used to say when he was asked about pressure points. He would say he doesn't bother with pressure points because he just wants to hit you so fricken hard he will hear your chest crunch. Meaning he is breaking bones. He also talks a lot about .."that sound a chicken leg makes when you twist it apart".. it's humorous to me because he is the strongest karate practioner I have ever seen and you get the feeling he is speaking the truth and not just being funny or exaggerating.
     
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  19. lklawson

    lklawson Senior Master

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    It's nothing more that the Carotid Sinus Syncope. It's well known and spans cultures. It used to be taught in bare knuckle boxing though there was a belief it could kill you. I've seen instruction for it in western boxing going back to 1747. It disappears from boxing references by 1890.

    Massage of the carotid sinus used to be an early treatment for high blood pressure before effective medications.

    Reflex syncope - Wikipedia


    It's cool and all but not magic.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  20. Mountie

    Mountie Yellow Belt

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    Using the brachial plexus origin can be very effective if done properly, plus it has the added benefit of not breaking bones if your goal is to win without injuring the other person. It's not difficult to use, but technique is still required. You've got to target and hit it properly. You still won't always knock them out, but it should at least make them lightheaded so you can follow up with something else.

    We use it a lot in my JJJ style, but then we know we don't train striking enough to break bone or knock people out the old fashioned way. So we aim to disoriented long enough to take them down.

    Look up PPCT, brachial plexus origin, and watch this video. Note how, even though he's not smashing hard, he goes through and leaves the pressure on for a fraction of a second.



     

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