Changing Dojo or Teacher

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by steelnshadow, Feb 14, 2011.

  1. steelnshadow

    steelnshadow White Belt

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    Hi All,

    Although I am sure that this topic has been discussed before so please forgive me if its a repost.

    I would like to know if there are any official procedures, any rules regarding keeping your grade or anything of the sort? Is there a 'good' way to approach a new teacher and ask him to be his student?

    May is feedback on the experience that others had when changing teacher or dojo.

    thank you for your time :asian:
     
  2. bluekey88

    bluekey88 Senior Master

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    I would say a lot depends. If you are staying within the same organization then you should be able to keep your rank. If you are changing organizations (going from Bujinkan to Genbukan for example) you'll porbably not be able to keep your rank. A lot depends on the teacher you are going to and how they run things.

    The rest is based on courtesy. You should let your old teacher know you are leaving and why. You should be honest with your new teacher about who you trained with and why you are switching as well. If you keep your rank, then you may have to wait to get promoted until you understand the new school's system and your abiloty there matches your rank. Again, a lot of this depends on what the new instructor wants to do.

    Peace,
    Erik
     
  3. steelnshadow

    steelnshadow White Belt

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    Hi,

    Thanks for your reply, I am remaining within the Bujinkan, just changing instructor.
     
  4. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    Bujinkan is pretty informal from what I have seen. As long as you are respectful to your previous sensei and your new sensei I think most won't mind.

    It also matters why you want to change. For example, moving to a different state is a different matter than being thrown out of the dojo because you knocked up the senseis daughter and then dumping her. Of course these are 2 extremes that most likely do not apply to you, it was just so you got my meaning.
     
  5. Aiki Lee

    Aiki Lee Master of Arts

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    Keep in mind that even if it is the same organization their requirements for the rank may be different. You could be overqualified or underqualified for it depending on what that teacher expects from his students at that level.
     
  6. steelnshadow

    steelnshadow White Belt

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    :).. nope no banging of daughter or changing state, I just feel the need to change teacher and perspective of training. I have been with this teacher for around 10 years and I have been feeling the need to change for some time. Not sure if its normal or not.

    Well thanks to all..

    You were all very helpful.

    Cheers

    Peter
     
  7. Krevon

    Krevon White Belt

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    I would think hard about it before changing. Actually define the reasons and then have a talk with your teacher. It takes a long time to develop a good relationship so do all you can to keep it.
     
  8. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Talk to your instructor. And your prospective new instructor.

    In fact, maybe find a chance to sit down with them both together... They might have interesting insights for you.

    Don't just leave without a word and go to the other guy... It's rude. It's disrespectful. And it's just plain annoying.

    There's nothing wrong with feeling that you need to change to a different instructor. It's part of growth, sometimes. Or it's what you need to appreciate who you have been training with. But you do owe the guy you've been with for much of ten years some explanation.
     
  9. steelnshadow

    steelnshadow White Belt

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    Well I still need to find the new instructor, I have some in mind but I need to be accepted as their student.

    I totally agree...

    I didn't think about it this way before.

    thanks :asian:
     
  10. DuskB4Dawn

    DuskB4Dawn Green Belt

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    Unless your a member of Bujinkan. you would lose your grade and start from white belt again :)
     
  11. steelnshadow

    steelnshadow White Belt

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    Strange you would say that, I spoke to some ex students and they told me that they left because they were not allowed to change school. The old students said that after they left, our instructor informed them that he wrote an email to Japan removing their grades and expelling them from the Bujinkan..

    He said that since he was the highest grade in the region anyone willing to train in the Bujinkan had to train under him...

    Any comments?
     
  12. bluekey88

    bluekey88 Senior Master

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    My instructor has cahnged instructors a number of times. He went from a Steve Hayes affiliation to Bujinakn in Texas, then chantged instructors when he moved out east. He then changed again for reasons similar to yours (wanting a different direction in his training). In addition, he takes every opportunity to train with a variety of folks whenever the opportunity presents itself.

    So, changing inst5ructors is not a bad thing...just be open and honest about why. don't burn bridges.
     
  13. Bruno@MT

    Bruno@MT Senior Master

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    Yes. Some people take themselves waay too seriously. :)
    That has nothing to do with the Bujinkan specifically though.
     
  14. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    Agreed. The guy has control issues. Hatsumi has never expelled anyone from the Bujinkan. He has removed the name plate of Hayes as Hayes had moved away from the Bujinkan's approach, which is not him "expelling" Hayes. Add to that the way that the Bujinkan is a two-tier hierarchy (Hatsumi, then everyone under him), it really doesn't matter what grade this guy has, no-one has to train under him. At all. They can still very easily train in the Bujinkan under any licenced Shidoshi, or if they are 5th Dan or above themselves, and have a Shidoshi licence, under their own authority. Provided grading certificates (from Japan) can be shown, a new Bujinkan dojo should have no issue in honouring a Bujinkan grade. They may or may not rank you that way themselves, but that only really has an impact on the future gradings, not the present grade.

    It sounds like a power-trip bluff on the part of this "senior" instructor, with no precedent to back it up. I'd call him on it, by turning up at another school, asking to see the reply email, or just going to Japan myself. And steer clear of the guy in future, he doesn't sound like the type of person I'd want to learn anything from in any case.
     
  15. DuskB4Dawn

    DuskB4Dawn Green Belt

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    its seems to me that Bujinkan has become to commercialised. it seems its all motivated by money. no wonder they took such drastic actions. this seems somewhat extreme just for a student leaving an organisation
     
  16. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

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    I'm going to recommend reading my post above yours there.

    And really, if the Bujinkan is concerned only with money, how is that served by kicking out students, and therefore not getting any more grading, training, or membership fees from them. Frankly, your statement doesn't hold water there.
     
  17. BujinBos

    BujinBos Yellow Belt

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    It's not the Bujinkan that's the problem. It is those bad apples who have fallen and rolled far from the tree.
     
  18. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Most of the Bujinkan clubs I've looked at aren't money makers... Most are part time "jobs" for the instructors who have a "real" job, too... I'm not familiar with the costs of licenses and advancement, or even training at the Bujinkan Hombu... but I don't get the impression much of it is all that expensive.
     
  19. bwindussa

    bwindussa Yellow Belt

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    I agree with JKS 9199. The 2 Togakure instructors I studied under did not do it for the money. It was a passion in their lives they wanted to share. It was normally a part-time job they did after a long day's work.
     
  20. DuskB4Dawn

    DuskB4Dawn Green Belt

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    yes olay itr not for money but what is all the trouble for such a small thing. perhaps the do not want the students to train in different organisation. thus forcing him to train only in Bujinkan. its like kyokushin karate and shoto karate. its a big corporation. they dont want to lose money and have to make these rules about membership. but thats my opinion on this.123
     

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