Article: Paulus Hector Mair's Ars Gladiatoris and Modern Military Combatives

[Ran Pleasant]

Below is a link to the article by ARMA scholar David Knight. I think David's work should be of interest to everyone on this forum.

http://www.paulushectormair.com/CQC_PHM.htm

 

[lonecoyote]

Great link! Thank you!

 

[Keith Jennings]

Thanks for the link, Ran. That article does a really good job showing how historical styles can be just as effective today as they were 600 years ago.. The CQC methods of Medieval fencing are brutal and effective as hell. In fact, I still maintain that Fiore dei Liberi’s counter-dagger curriculum is the best I’ve ever seen, traditional or modern. Of course, when dealing with smaller edge weapons like a tactical folder, things change. But for dealing with large daggers, IMO Medieval counter-dagger methods have no equal.

 

[Ran Pleasant]

...I still maintain that Fiore dei Liberi’s counter-dagger curriculum is the best I’ve ever seen, traditional or modern.

I fully agree. Clearly something that one should not leave home without it.

 

[arnisador]

Is their a site that demonstrates Fiore dei Liberi’s counter-dagger curriculum well enough that I could compare it to what I know from FMA?

 

[Matt Anderson]

Is their a site that demonstrates Fiore dei Liberi’s counter-dagger curriculum well enough that I could compare it to what I know from FMA?

There is a complete English translation here: http://www.varmouries.com/wildrose/fiore/section2.html

Of course the material is open to interpretation, but may be useful for your comparison.

 

[Keith Jennings]

Check out: http://www.the-exiles.org/#

Go to the "Fiore Project" and check out the translation of the dagger (daga) material. There are nine Masters of the Dagger, where each one deals with a specific type of attack, ranging from reverse grip, forward grip, forehand, backhand, ect.

Additionally, there are Four Master that basically govern the entire dagger material. They are the Masters of disarms, limb destruction, arm locks (called ligadura in Italian), and throws. They cover the various responses to any attack with a dagger, with the emphasis being on you never try and force a certain technique. For example, the first technique of the First Master is a triangle disarm. If you force themselves forwards and you can’t pull off the disarm, no problem, you slip them into the middle arm lock (ligadura mezana). If they fly back, still not a problem, you follow with a throw or arm break.

Unfortunately, there are no updated video clips on the web that I know of. However, I do know that in an upcoming issue of Modern Knives, there is going to be a Western Martial Arts Special that is going to showcase both Medieval Italian and German counter-dagger techniques by arguably the best in the business, so that should be worth a look.

FWIW, when dealing with small knives such as a tactical folder, I found the most effective techniques come from modern FMA-derived methods. IMO, the best counter-weapon methods come from those systems that actually know how to use the weapon.

 

[arnisador]

Interesting! I see many FMA similarities, but it's hard to tell without seeing them move.