Aikido in an Mma gym

[drop bear]

So, ignoring for the moment that this was a hoax, you don't take any input from anyone? See, for me, I'll take that input and then try to figure out how valuable it is based on what else I can find, rather than just toss it out because it happened off-camera.

I was surprised (before I saw the rest of the video) this was happening in an MMA gym, but assumed it must have been during pretty light sparring, probably with someone making the mistake of punching from a bit too far away (so the punch wasn't compact enough). But I was willing to take it as input and give new thought to whether this might have more application/availability than I'd thought. It would be new information for me to consider.

I was going to face book the guy and ask for evidence. Which is how I found out about the second vid.

Because off camera also means made up.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

I was going to face book the guy and ask for evidence. Which is how I found out about the second vid.

Because off camera also means made up.

Correction: off camera means possibly made up.

 

[Martial D]

There wasn't any evidence that Jow Ga techniques work before I posted me doing the techniques. You can still look today and you won't see people doing those techniques that I do.

Are those techniques only valid because I showed they are or were they already valid and I just had to figure out it really works?

Oh..I haven't seen those, only a couple of light sparring videos. Did you also make vids of you jow ga'ing people in a live situation?

 

[JowGaWolf]

Oh..I haven't seen those, only a couple of light sparring videos. Did you also make vids of you jow ga'ing people in a live situation?

I have videos of me doing more intensive sparring but nothinges of me going full on warrior mode with the focus of ending my opponent's ability to engage in an attack.

If a person can't stop me when I'm going slow, then it's not likely they can stop me at full speed and power. I'm not bragging because it holds true for me. If I can't stop you at slow speeds then how can I stop you if you are at full speed.

Youll never see me fight at 100 % Unless someone attacks me in the street or I fight in a full contact competition.

 

[Buka]

Off camera means off camera, not filmed at that time. The only other reference I've heard concerns actors, as in their life off camera means their private life.

When did this become a term meaning possibly made up?

Are the Martial Police at it again?

 

[jobo]

Oh..I haven't seen those, only a couple of light sparring videos. Did you also make vids of you jow ga'ing people in a live situation?

he would have to be followed round with a camara and wait for a bar fight, possible, but a bit time consuming

 

[drop bear]

Correction: off camera means possibly made up.

In this case though specifically meant made up.

Because people really will believe any old thing. Which was the point of that video.

 

[Martial D]

he would have to be followed round with a camara and wait for a bar fight, possible, but a bit time consuming

LOL

Or competition. Either way pulling stuff off while exchanging lightly without much pressure is not really indicative of how the same techniques might perform at full speed and power, and bad intent.

Last Saturday me and one of my regular partners sparred a round using only classical wing chun (he's a WT guy). It was fun. We giggled. It 'worked' insofar as we were moving around trying to hit each other, with some success.

If someone were trying to take my head off though....

 

[JowGaWolf]

Because people really will believe any old thing. Which was the point of that video.

This is what I took from the video when I first watched it.

• Someone who I might have watched more videos of because they appeared to be serious about their training.
• Someone who was credible enough to try to figure out how a technique might work in reality and not in just theory.

This is what I take from the video now.

• Someone who would rather spend time fooling someone than spend time on actually exploring techniques
• Someone who is no longer credible enough for me to be interested in any videos they produce.

It may sound like I'm upset that I was fooled, but in reality I'm not upset. It was just a waste of my time because I thought someone was able to get that "light bulb moment" through quality training, trial and error, and sparring. I thought they were able to figure out a piece of a puzzle and that I would have valuable insight on how a martial arts technique may work.

I would have rather watch some fail 1000 times then fake like something works. The achievement of flight was built on the failures of others learning through actual attempts and taking note of where things work and where they don't work. It wasn't built on someone faking it, for the purpose to prove that "people will believe everything."

If I have spend 1 second wondering if a person is trying to fool me about something at this level of importance (low level) then why bother with them. There was no need of doing a hoax and it doesn't prove "that people believe anything." It only proved that that people thought highly enough to seriously look at what they say, but now many people are probably thinking in the back of their minds. "Are they trying to fool me like they did before." If that's what you think of someone, then why bother dealing with them?

 

[JowGaWolf]

Either way pulling stuff off while exchanging lightly without much pressure is not really indicative of how the same techniques might perform at full speed and power, and bad intent.

I will show you the difference between my light sparring and sparring at a medium level of intensity. I have video of that. Not sure why you think the damage will be less at a higher intensity. I cross the street thinking that a car is going to hit me lighter if it's moving faster.

 

[_Simon_]

and a good hammer can't turn you into a carpenter, I know this as I own several good hammers, nor would I take on a Ferrari for commuting .

I'm not interested in a daft analogy discussion, have you got a meaning definition of can and can't fight that we can consider

Ah and we're back to the defining "can/can't fight"! I was wondering if that would ever pop back up again

 

[Martial D]

I will show you the difference between my light sparring and sparring at a medium level of intensity. I have video of that. Not sure why you think the damage will be less at a higher intensity. I cross the street thinking that a car is going to hit me lighter if it's moving faster.

Link.

 

[JowGaWolf]

Link.

First I'll show you an aspect of light sparring. Most of the times you only see me working on one or 2 techniques at a time when I spar. I use sparring to learn which means I care more about getting things correct than about winning. This is what I can do with a front leg sweep (my front leg does the sweeping here). Play it in slow motion and you can see that I need very little room to pull it off.

The reason I'm showing this video is because of the reality of the sweep and how things don't always appear as they seem.

• The faster you come at me, the easier it is for me
• The harder you come at me, the easier it is for me
• The faster you come at me, the more I'll increase my intensity and speed.
  
• The harder you come at me, the more power I'll put into my attacks

The first 44 seconds one would think I'm below average in sparring. beginning it looks like I'm not that experienced in sparring. Count the number of punches and kicks I throw. I look horrible. But what you don't know until now, is that the first 44 seconds is just me studying my opponent. Taking notes, identifying patterns, looking for openings, testing my opponents reaction and a bunch of other things. Did I mention I spare to learn? This is how I am most of the time when I spar. Think about it, Do you really think that sweep is going to be lighter and slower if I increase my intensity, speed, and power? When it comes to sweeps the more you increase your intensity the easier it is to pull off a sweeps. Sweeps 101. When my opponent increases intensity and power it means he's fully committed to the movement, it also means it's more difficult for him to stop and evade, reverse and evade, change direction and evade. This is why I like fighting brawlers. The difficult fighters are those who commit just enough to nail you without reducing their ability to backout of a bait, counter, or trap.

I have one more light sparring video to show then I'll show my intermediate sparring.

I probably should have made this a different thread. So the next one will probably be in a different thread.

 

[Gerry Seymour]

This is what I took from the video when I first watched it.

• Someone who I might have watched more videos of because they appeared to be serious about their training.
• Someone who was credible enough to try to figure out how a technique might work in reality and not in just theory.

This is what I take from the video now.

• Someone who would rather spend time fooling someone than spend time on actually exploring techniques
• Someone who is no longer credible enough for me to be interested in any videos they produce.

It may sound like I'm upset that I was fooled, but in reality I'm not upset. It was just a waste of my time because I thought someone was able to get that "light bulb moment" through quality training, trial and error, and sparring. I thought they were able to figure out a piece of a puzzle and that I would have valuable insight on how a martial arts technique may work.

I would have rather watch some fail 1000 times then fake like something works. The achievement of flight was built on the failures of others learning through actual attempts and taking note of where things work and where they don't work. It wasn't built on someone faking it, for the purpose to prove that "people will believe everything."

If I have spend 1 second wondering if a person is trying to fool me about something at this level of importance (low level) then why bother with them. There was no need of doing a hoax and it doesn't prove "that people believe anything." It only proved that that people thought highly enough to seriously look at what they say, but now many people are probably thinking in the back of their minds. "Are they trying to fool me like they did before." If that's what you think of someone, then why bother dealing with them?

My reaction is similar. I want input. I can't trust his input now, because he might throw something out to prove a point, and I'll go trying to figure out what it means to me, until he releases the follow-up (which I might actually even not see).

I'm okay with folks who explain why techniques don't work, even on techniques I like. I want to see what they say and if it gives me new information to examine the technique. While it most often just reinforces what I knew to be the weaknesses of the technique, sometimes it gives me insight - perhaps why something I thought I could work on won't be a good idea.

But this kind of false information is no better than any other kind. I'd rather he'd just started with the follow-up video.

 

[JowGaWolf]

I'd rather he'd just started with the follow-up video.

Yep had he just started with the follow up video, I would have been fine. From there we would be able to discuss what's not working, why it's not working. Is it not working because the other guy knows about it focus on preventing the technique from being used vs trying to focus on hitting the person. Is the technique being used against the wrong punch? It would be like working a puzzle. There are 10,000 ways to do a technique the wrong way. Start identifying the wrong ways to do it, and eventually you 'll end up with the correct way to do it.

 

[Martial D]

First I'll show you an aspect of light sparring. Most of the times you only see me working on one or 2 techniques at a time when I spar. I use sparring to learn which means I care more about getting things correct than about winning. This is what I can do with a front leg sweep (my front leg does the sweeping here). Play it in slow motion and you can see that I need very little room to pull it off.

The reason I'm showing this video is because of the reality of the sweep and how things don't always appear as they seem.

• The faster you come at me, the easier it is for me
• The harder you come at me, the easier it is for me
• The faster you come at me, the more I'll increase my intensity and speed.
  
• The harder you come at me, the more power I'll put into my attacks

The first 44 seconds one would think I'm below average in sparring. beginning it looks like I'm not that experienced in sparring. Count the number of punches and kicks I throw. I look horrible. But what you don't know until now, is that the first 44 seconds is just me studying my opponent. Taking notes, identifying patterns, looking for openings, testing my opponents reaction and a bunch of other things. Did I mention I spare to learn? This is how I am most of the time when I spar. Think about it, Do you really think that sweep is going to be lighter and slower if I increase my intensity, speed, and power? When it comes to sweeps the more you increase your intensity the easier it is to pull off a sweeps. Sweeps 101. When my opponent increases intensity and power it means he's fully committed to the movement, it also means it's more difficult for him to stop and evade, reverse and evade, change direction and evade. This is why I like fighting brawlers. The difficult fighters are those who commit just enough to nail you without reducing their ability to backout of a bait, counter, or trap.

I have one more light sparring video to show then I'll show my intermediate sparring.

I probably should have made this a different thread. So the next one will probably be in a different thread.

Uhh. K

 

[Martial D]

My reaction is similar. I want input. I can't trust his input now, because he might throw something out to prove a point, and I'll go trying to figure out what it means to me, until he releases the follow-up (which I might actually even not see).

I'm okay with folks who explain why techniques don't work, even on techniques I like. I want to see what they say and if it gives me new information to examine the technique. While it most often just reinforces what I knew to be the weaknesses of the technique, sometimes it gives me insight - perhaps why something I thought I could work on won't be a good idea.

But this kind of false information is no better than any other kind. I'd rather he'd just started with the follow-up video.

This is why it's not good to take people's word to mean much. You can see what 'works' by watching a lot of fights, where stuff is working. Everyone seems to have ten pages of theory, so the commodity value of theory is low to me. I'm only interested in reproducible results.

 

[RTKDCMB]

Plenty of lardos that can and will use their tremendous weight to knock you to Tokyo.

What if you are already in Tokyo?

 

[drop bear]

My reaction is similar. I want input. I can't trust his input now, because he might throw something out to prove a point, and I'll go trying to figure out what it means to me, until he releases the follow-up (which I might actually even not see).

I'm okay with folks who explain why techniques don't work, even on techniques I like. I want to see what they say and if it gives me new information to examine the technique. While it most often just reinforces what I knew to be the weaknesses of the technique, sometimes it gives me insight - perhaps why something I thought I could work on won't be a good idea.

But this kind of false information is no better than any other kind. I'd rather he'd just started with the follow-up video.

It is an example of the culture differences. Where bjj for example is all about critical thinking and testing ideas.

And other arts rely on authority.

You can actually notice the difference in conversation as well.

He did a BJJ version but different culture.
Rokas Leonavičius

 

[jobo]

My reaction is similar. I want input. I can't trust his input now, because he might throw something out to prove a point, and I'll go trying to figure out what it means to me, until he releases the follow-up (which I might actually even not see).

I'm okay with folks who explain why techniques don't work, even on techniques I like. I want to see what they say and if it gives me new information to examine the technique. While it most often just reinforces what I knew to be the weaknesses of the technique, sometimes it gives me insight - perhaps why something I thought I could work on won't be a good idea.

But this kind of false information is no better than any other kind. I'd rather he'd just started with the follow-up video.

the guys a you tube star, he probably earns a reasonable income off it, to do that he needs " hits" putting out Vid that cause controversy, is a better way to do that than an earnest, this is how to make a technique work vid, not only will he have had a lot of hits on this vid, his follow up" I was only joking vid will also have been popular,

that's on top of his very popular I'm giving up aikido vid,
.we are just feeding his income stream by even discussing his views