Ramirez
Black Belt
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abortion protesters confronted
- Thread starter Ramirez
- Start date
Good fellow.
The Englishman in me thinks it a bit gauche to record events and to get a little heated in the process but top marks for giving a much needed riposte.
The Englishman in me thinks it a bit gauche to record events and to get a little heated in the process but top marks for giving a much needed riposte.
Blade96
Senior Master
anti-abortion protestor. My favorite kind of people.
NOT.
NOT.
Empty Hands
Senior Master
The couple make "good victims" because they were married, with a baby with a congenital defect with no chance for survival. However, no one deserves to be harassed by these jerks, even if they aren't "good victims." That's something that continually seems to be forgotten when only women who were raped or abused somehow seem to "deserve" their rights based on the arguments put forth. Of course, to some like Sharron Angle, even the raped and abused don't deserve their rights.
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In the clinic protester mentality, rape survivors aren't victims either, because "two wrongs don't make a right." In my days as a clinic escort I saw that conversation at least a hundred times. The only thing that's relevant is the "precious perfect little baby," even if it has no chance of survival, was the result of a brutal assault, is a dangerous ball and chain threatening to tie a woman to an abuser for life, or is already dead and turning septic.
On the other hand, I also witnessed a lot of conversations identical to the one in the video. We'd see a lot of enraged spouses and enraged parents of teenagers coming back outside. It lifted my spirits a little, but of course it was always as productive as this one is. It's not a comment on your average pro-lifer, but talking to a clinic protester is a lot like talking to an active drug addict. It's all very self-serving circular logic.
On the other hand, I also witnessed a lot of conversations identical to the one in the video. We'd see a lot of enraged spouses and enraged parents of teenagers coming back outside. It lifted my spirits a little, but of course it was always as productive as this one is. It's not a comment on your average pro-lifer, but talking to a clinic protester is a lot like talking to an active drug addict. It's all very self-serving circular logic.
That third thing is untrue, but OK.
Sean
Just guessing, but I think he means this part...
This part is not true, as there is the police, courts, and child protective agencies which would prevent the abuser from coming into contact with the woman or the child.
RandomPhantom700
Master of Arts
These resources may be available, but people (male or female, but in this case we're talking female) who are on the receiving end of an abusive relationship often don't even think of them as options. Whether they're aversive to authority or simply psychologically dependent on their abuser, all the cops and restraining orders in the world won't help an abuse victim who won't seek them.
This isn't meant to say anything about abortion one way or another.
Idiots will do idiotic things.
I *do* wish health care providers would start handling medically necessary abortions in hospitals on an outpatient basis rather than outsource to abortion clinics.
I *do* wish health care providers would start handling medically necessary abortions in hospitals on an outpatient basis rather than outsource to abortion clinics.
But, then you'd see how few are truly medically necessary and how many are an idiot's form of birth control, and that is the last thing the abortion supporters want.
That's all true, but it has nothing to do with the child. The position stated was that the child would somehow keep the woman tied to her abuser. Iet is her co-dependent, self-destructive behavior that would accomplish that, not the fact that she had his baby.
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Not necessarily. Parental custody laws can be a peculiar thing. And there's also out-and-out kidnapping. It's pretty easy for an abuser to manipulate the system to make the victim look bad - casting the victim as the abuser, calling the victim's mental stability into question, and on and on. An uninformed jury can take that at face value and conclude that the victim is an unfit parent. I've seen it happen.
aedrasteia
Purple Belt
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Oh no. The presence of a child does make a connection she cannot break, unless she relinquishes _her_ relationship to that child, or he cuts his ties. Or an observant judge takes decisive action. As long as he is the legally recognized father, he can and will claim the right to see and have a relationship with the child. Even if he has a pattern of violence against her. And if she is the custodial parent or if custody is shared, he will be able to see and come close to that woman daily or weekly, unless she can find a safe and reliable way to do visits, etc through another family member or friend. And, of course, he can legally challenge anyone used as a go-between or destroy the arrangements she tries to make by last minute changes, sudden new locations and times for transfer of the child, abrupt cancellations. It becomes easier for the abuser to use access thru the child to track her movements and where she is living or working, increasing the threats, harassment and danger. The only recourse she may have is going back to court again and again and again. hoping to show a pattern of non-compliance (if she has a good lawyer - which costs $$). And if he can finagle to get a different judge every time, who is unfamiliar with the case this can and will go on for months. And if she becomes worn down over time or overwhelmed and his violence ramps up, I guarantee she will be terrorized, injured or killed.
which has not one damn thing to do with her. How do I know? Doing or assisting with child visits on behalf of women with abusive partners and watching as the abusers game the system, mostly ignore their kids and stay vigilant for a path to doing more bloody damage. And they often succeed.
Quite so. Oftentimes offspring in these situations become more like possessions or pawns used by the abuser to further abuse the victim. This often leads to torturing of the child either directly or indirectly. The cycle is insipid and cruel.
Here are some questions relating to this topic: Should rape, from having sex with passed out college girls to the most violent kind, be a death penalty offense? Should incest be a death penalty offense? Should the victim of either crime have a court santioned license to kill her attacker after the act of the crime? The answer to these questions are important to this topic.
