8th Degree Promotion. Is this a Joke?

Discussion in 'Modern Arnis' started by Kenpo viking, Aug 12, 2003.

  1. arnisador

    arnisador Sr. Grandmaster

    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    44,549
    Likes Received:
    426
    Trophy Points:
    193
    Location:
    Terre Haute, IN
    Hear, hear!
     
  2. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    Jeff and Rocky,

    A person should be promoted upon certain criteria.

    Time spent at the art.
    Knowledge of the art.
    Teaching the art.
    Going to seminars to learn from others about the art.
    Going to seminars teaching the art.
    Passing on knowledge to students about the art.
    Proficiency of the students studying the art.
    Innovating new techniques and strategies about the art.
    Students thinking for themselves understanding what they have learned about the art.

    These are just a few off of the top of my head."


    Beautifully stated, Jeff. :asian:

    "Bottom line is, you are passing on your knowledge to future generations, therefore in one way or another the art lives on!!"

    As we all are, Rock. You, me, Tim, Kelly, Dieter, Randi, Shishir and the rest. As we all are. :asian:

    Yours,
    Dan Anderson

    PS - It looks like we won't hit 8 pages after all. Fine by me.
    :)
     
  3. Rich Parsons

    Rich Parsons A Student of Martial Arts

    • Advisor
    • Founding Member
    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2001
    Messages:
    15,748
    Likes Received:
    425
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Michigan

    Dan,

    I believe it was Jason Farnsworth who made the original post with those comments.

    Tim, and Jeff, both agreed.

    :D

    :asian:
     
  4. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    Jeff, Jason....Geez, what a way to close this thread out. Let me try again:

    JASON. BEAUTIFULLY STATED!

    There. That should correct it. :D

    Yours,
    The Ever Contorversial Yet Wonderfully Mannered Dan Anderson
     
  5. jfarnsworth

    jfarnsworth Grandmaster

    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    32
    Trophy Points:
    158
    Location:
    N.C. Ohio
    :rofl: :rofl:
    Oh, that's ok Sir. I knew what you meant when I read it the first time. I've been called a lot worse than Jeff before so I didn't bother.:D
     
  6. arnisador

    arnisador Sr. Grandmaster

    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    44,549
    Likes Received:
    426
    Trophy Points:
    193
    Location:
    Terre Haute, IN
    It looks from his avatar that Mr. Farnsworth is better looking than me so I wasn't going to object to the confusion!

    But in all seriousness, I worry that Modern Arnis will be absorbed into other arts and disappear...anyone helping to promote it, like Mr. Anderson, has my support!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Mark Lynn

    Mark Lynn Master Black Belt

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2003
    Messages:
    1,274
    Likes Received:
    133
    Trophy Points:
    88
    Location:
    Roanoke TX USA
    Amen to that.
    Mark
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Cruentus

    Cruentus Grandmaster

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2002
    Messages:
    7,162
    Likes Received:
    129
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Location:
    At an OP in view of your house...
    Ha, ha.....we hit eight pages. :partyon:
     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    Not to worry. There are a number of us who will keep it going. And yes, we did hit 8 pages. Yeehah!

    :partyon:

    Yours,
    Dan Anderson
     
  10. jfarnsworth

    jfarnsworth Grandmaster

    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2002
    Messages:
    6,550
    Likes Received:
    32
    Trophy Points:
    158
    Location:
    N.C. Ohio
    I don't know about that.:rofl:


    Also, with all due respect. Any serious martial artist regardless of the art will always want to keep it alive.
    :asian:
     
  11. Tom Caprio

    Tom Caprio Guest

    all this talk and discussion about rank. I think if you are teaching modern arnis it is best receive promotion from SENIORS in modern arnis and not from people outside the style. And where do the grades stop?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    Tom,

    If you haven't read the entire thread, please do. All the pros and cons are thoroughly gone over. Thanks for your opinion, though.

    Yours,
    Dan Anderson

    PS- Buy the books :supcool:
     
  13. Flatlander

    Flatlander Grandmaster

    Joined:
    May 17, 2004
    Messages:
    6,785
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    158
    Location:
    The Canuckistan Plains
    I read the thread, bought the book, (and you should too), waiting for a t-shirt. Hey Dan? MA-80 t-shirts?
     
  14. mike dizon

    mike dizon Guest

    Dan Anderson,

    Thank you for the response. have read the entire thread. I still think that to many people are seeking high dan grades and i still believe that if one is going to accept a rank in modern arnis or in a derivative of modern arnis, then the rank promotion should come from modern arnis people.

    Flatlander abd Dan
    About the book. I am sure teh book is good but no thanks too much material and training to work through here already. Maybe in the future
     
    • Like Like x 2
  15. Emptyglass

    Emptyglass Guest

    Hi there:

    Personally, I agree with the idea that since the passing of Grandmaster Presas, any ranks awarded by him are now "frozen".


    Thanks,

    Rich Curren
     
  16. Flatlander

    Flatlander Grandmaster

    Joined:
    May 17, 2004
    Messages:
    6,785
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    158
    Location:
    The Canuckistan Plains
    The problem with this, though, is that then the growth of the art becomes stunted. Also, if you "freeze" people at the rank that they are, then nobody will ever go past 6th dan. You effectively make 6th dan the highest rank for ever. It does not make sense to disallow people such as the 6 datus from being recognized for growing in the art. I'm sure that if you asked any of them, or anyone that knows or trains with them, if they have gotten better since the Professor has passed, the answer would be yes. The truth is that the art did not pass with the Professor, and it will and should live on.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    Mike,

    Thanks for your thoughts AND I respect them. The fact that you stated them flatly and without personal insults added is appreciated. This was a very heated thread. Who are you training with and for how long? I've noticed on some other posts that you seem to be connected with some of my "older brothers" in the PI. I am hoping that the government sponsored 2006 Remy Presas Memorial that SM Roland Dantes is working on will happen. If so, maybe we'll meet as I'll definitely come to the PI for that.

    Yours,
    Dan Anderson
     
  18. Guro Harold

    Guro Harold Senior Master

    • Founding Member
    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Messages:
    3,829
    Likes Received:
    49
    Trophy Points:
    158
    Location:
    Greensboro, North Carolina
    We have had the pleasure of welcoming to MT at least three people who train in the Philippines who are associated with the some of the Senior Masters in the PI and Austraila, they are Sungkit, Mike Dizon, and Tom Caprio.

    I think that it would be a great opportunity for the rest of the MT Modern Arnis members to learn about the Modern Arnis people and curriculum from these members and others.

    So going along with Dan, please tell us about yourselves. Who you train with, and do you guys train together or know each other? How long have you all trained in Modern Arnis? Were you able to train with the Professor when he was alive?

    Please tell us more history and other information about the Senior Members in the PI, for me, especially SM Rodel Dagoog and and SM Roland Dantes, both whom I have personally met.

    Do you know if any of them will be coming back to the US soon?

    Thanks,

    Palusut
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. Emptyglass

    Emptyglass Guest

    Hi Flatlander:

    I don't agree with you. Since when has stated rank ever been a determining factor as to the growth or value of the art? If the art is being practiced, worked with, spread and thought about it will grow. What does become stunted in my opinion are some of the art's commercial business opportunities.

    As for 6th Dan being the highest, so what? What if 7th was the highest or 14th or 186,543rd Dan? It doesn't make a difference. It's just a number, a point of reference. 10th is the highest most arts folllow. Some have no grades, some have two (student/instructor), etc...

    Belt rank has always rankled me a bit since many people I have come across tend to make a big deal about it. What holds value for me personally is fighting skill, teaching skill, integrity, honesty and love of the art (all of which I believe Professor Anderson possesses in quantity).

    I am positive there are many great teachers and fighters out there with no recognized rank. They just learn what they are taught, practice in dedicated fashion and attempt to grow their skills in their own unique way. In fact, I would be willing to bet that this is the original way things were done before the arts became a commercial business (however, I cannot prove this and must maintain it as a theory).

    Also, there are equally skillful teachers and fighters with very high ranks and they are well-deserved.

    That being said, I don't think belt ranks are necessarily a bad thing as they give people goals to shoot for etc..., but I strongly disagree with your thesis that the lack of them leads to stagnation of a particular style.

    Respectfully,

    Rich Curren
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Dan Anderson

    Dan Anderson Master of Arts

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    1,846
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    73
    Location:
    Bridal Veil, Oregon
    You know, the funny thing about rank, is essentially, ranking is positioning within a group. Many people swear by it while others swear at it. Whether by markings (belts, chevrons, tattoos on the arm) or by skill, there will always be positioning within a group. And, unfortunately, there will always be some sort of contention regarding it within the group unless the leader either a) governs it with an iron hand and tells everyne to knock it off or b) can (and does) pound into the dirt anyone who disagrees with him. If that's the case, then we just wait til he dies to begin the mud slinging. :)

    Yours,
    Dan Anderson
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page