Why choose a particular MA: The clone argument.

[geezer]

What follows are a few semi-random ruminations on how I feel about the choice of the style I study. I remember when I was just getting going and I thought it was the best art ever. Then over time I got to meet some top level people in other arts. Eventually I grew up a bit. Oh, I still love what I do, but if I had to do it all over again? Well, who knows. it's a big world, and it's full of cool stuff.

Anyway, I got to thinking about this topic after talking to a beginning student after class the other day. In our conversation, made a reference to the fighting effectiveness of another well known martial art. The student wanted to know if our style could beat the other style, and looked disappointed when I answered, "not necessarily".

I remember thinking to myself, "Boy wouldn't these questions be so much easier to answer if I just 'drank the kool-aid' and really believed that my art alone was "the best ever". But I don't believe that. I just know that, right now, it's the best art for me.

And, there are so many reasons why I feel that way: In part because I really enjoy it. Partly because many years ago I sort of "fell into it" and now with so much time invested, it's something I'm reasonably good at, and I wouldn't want to change now. Partly because now I'm getting on into my late 50's, and I like that it's not an art that's heavily dependent on strength, flexibility, acrobatic skill. Or constant, hard-core sparring and grappling. I'm long past the time in my life when my body will endure that kind of stress on a regular basis... And, of course partly because it's a really cool art with a long and rich history that is quite effective for self defense.

Unfortunately none of these highly personal reasons seemed likely to satisfy a new student who just wanted me to tell him that what we do is simply the best. Not being a great liar, I ended up answering by describing what I see as our style's strengths

...and then I added the "clone" argument: What if you had an identical twin or clone of the same age, with the same strength, intelligence, coordination ...even the same old injuries and weaknesses. Suppose this clone trained in "martial art X" for the same time as you've trained in your art. What if you went up against your clone. How would you fare?

So here's how the conversation ended:

"Well", I told my student, "I'm confident that with what I know, any match against my "clone" would turn out fine, no matter what style the clone had studied".

"Really?" the student exclaimed. "Our style is that good?"

"Well sure our style is good." I replied. But if I went up against my clone, ...you know somebody with my same skills and intelligence ... we'd both call it off and go have a beer. And that would be just fine by me.

 

[seasoned]

Great analogies, Steve.

I feel when we're young we want to know what we are doing is worth our time. our mind is trapped in a certain mind set pertaining to what brought us to this particular art, in the first place.

But, as time goes by, for me anyways, the art no longer makes me, but I now make the art. As to which one is better, well, I know people that had great form and in sparring got their butt handed to them. But, on the other hand, there were people with form not so great but if push came to shove I would want them in my corner for sure.
I too feel good where I'm at and feel comfortable in my chosen life time art. I know you have heard it a 1000 times, but there are no bad arts, just people training at different levels for different reasons..............

 

[Chris Parker]

Ha, I'm a little more blunt... if a potential student even says something like "I want to train in this because it's the best martial art!", I immediately ask them what would make them think that? How would they know? And if they ask if it's the best, the answer is "No". Followed by "Well, it depends. What do you want out of it? How do you see the aims of training? If you want to win tournaments, it's not. If you want to get fit, it's not. If you want to spar, it's not. If you're wanting to handle modern violence, then the traditional side isn't either (we do cover that, but it's 1/3 of the class, and you can't just do that part). If you're not interested in weapon study, it's not. If you're not interested in aspects of Japanese culture, it's not." By this time, they've usually become quite unsure of what I'm saying, do I even want to teach them? Is the art good for anything? "But if it appeals to you, if you can see yourself growing through learning the art, if you can find a way to appreciate the depth and breadth of our approach, then it can be. But here's the thing... there's no such thing as the "best" martial art... there's only the best for you".

And if they can't follow that, then they won't last as a student of mine, really.

With the idea of handling a clone of myself, I'd like to think that I'd handle them fine... but that's as much to do with my familiarizing myself with as broad a range of approaches and arts as it is to do with my belief in what I teach and train. I just hope that my clone, sharing the same level of insight and intelligence as myself, would be able to obviously recognize that, and avoid the encounter in the first place...

 

[WC_lun]

The "best" depends entirely upon what you want out of an art and is highly personal. Young guys want to think they are gonna learn this magical art and be like a supehereo, able to kick everybody's butt. I study what I study because it is effective and effecient. As a young man, I probably would not have appreciated that as much, preferring something I could get accolades with. So even for one person, what is the "best" has changed over time.

 

[pgsmith]

Ha! That scenario is pretty familiar, and right up there with the one where you're trying to show something in particular, and the student keeps saying "but what would you do if I did this instead?" I used to try and seriously answer their questions and we'd end up going off on various tangents. Now I just tell them that I'd slap them up beside the head for not paying attention to what I was showing them, and ask if they want a demonstration.

 

[chinto]

my answer when asked things like that is this. there are many trails up the mountain out there...( pointing to a near by mountain) if you go up any of them, you end up in basically the same place don't you? the answer is usually "yes" then I ask them is there a best car out there for everything? the answer is usually "no". I tell them martial arts are the same. what is best for one individual, has what they want and covers their needs may not for some one else. injury or other limitations may effect what is best for some one. Also, there is what are you wanting it for? self defense? sport competition, for health? all of them have some aspect that can be for all of them.. so you have to ask yourself is this what you want to do? then I tell them that all martial arts are good, but I prefer the way the Okinawans developed to do things. That DOES NOT make it better then say Kung fu, or Judo, or Silat,... just different in some ways the very same in others. and if some one who was say a 7th dan in Karate, and some one who was the same rank in some other art were seen in a fight, at that point, often you would not be sure who was who, because they all have in general the strikes the grapples and locks and brakes and throws, just different doctrines and strategies as to when and how to do them. last but not least that "IF YOU FIGHT YOU MAY DIE" And that is regardless of style. there is always some one out there who is better trained, stronger, tougher, meaner and more experienced.

 

[Bill Mattocks]

Because I started later in life, I never had the desire to find the 'ultimate' martial art, or the belief that any such system existed. Like geezer, I believe there is something valid in just about every style out there; and there are good and bad practitioners of those systems.

I chose Isshin-Ryu for several reasons, which I believe are still valid. In no particular order:

1) It was close to my house at the time.
2) The instructor was well-known and well-respected throughout the Isshin-Ryu world. His lineage was very clear, very near the founder of the art.
3) No contract.
4) I'm a US Marine veteran. Isshin-Ryu was known to me when I was stationed on Okinawa; it was known to be the "Marine Corps" choice in general. Not that Marines didn't study other systems, they did.
5) Isshin-Ryu works very well with my body type and plays to my strengths and my weaknesses (powerful, no high kicks, nothing fancy, get the job done and get out).

If I had to find another school, I guess I could. If I had to find another style, I'm sure I could manage to find something. However, after four years, my dojo has become like my home, and my dojomates are like my family.

There is a small part of me that believes our dojo is 'best', yes. I see other schools doing kata at local competitions. Eh...no. Even our style...no. I feel fortunate, even blessed, to have ended up where I am. But if I were in those other schools, I'd probably feel the same way.

In the end, the best style is the same as the best school, which is the same as the best training. The best is the one you continue with. What matters most, IMHO, is to keep training, never stop.

 

[geezer]

In the end, the best style is ....the one you continue with. What matters most, IMHO, is to keep training, never stop.

Well said.

 

[Kinghercules]

I was always told its not the style but the person and how they use it.