Training methodology

[Trondyne]

I don’t understand this modern concept of that’s not wing Chun if you add this or that...a Wing Chun or JKD channel I like on YouTube named Adam Chan, he mentioned how Wing Chun guys would test and adapt the art, one guy fought and beat a boxer and adapted a lot 9f boxing...I believe Bruce Lee did that too.

As the OP said lot of the issues with wing Chun schools are that there’s no conditioning or as you said no adaptation. Another channel On YouTube that’s great is Philip Hartshorn, his Sifu has a channel too, Russ Cichon

I don’t dislike Rokas but I also don’t see who he or guys like Ramsay dewy are to act as though they are the judge and jury of the MA world.

I see Rokas criticizing and awarding points to styles based on how he thinks a style trains which simply isn't the case... It's annoying AF.

 

[Mider]

I see Rokas criticizing and awarding points to styles based on how he thinks a style trains which simply isn't the case... It's annoying AF.

Dan the wolfman made a few videos trashing rokas and Ramsey Dewey...Rokas supposedly bought his blue belt and is terrible in mma

 

[geezer]

Dan the wolfman made a few videos trashing rokas and Ramsey Dewey...Rokas supposedly bought his blue belt and is terrible in mma

Rokas? Well, in all fairness, he's pretty new to MMA, and how good ...or bad he is at it doesn't really factor in to his commentary.

He's mainly an advocate for what MMA offers, as opposed to what he trained before ...i.e. training with resistance and a competitive method for testing your skills against diverse opponents.

And then he's also trying to build a YouTube following

 

[geezer]

I see Rokas criticizing and awarding points to styles based on how he thinks a style trains which simply isn't the case... It's annoying AF.

Yeah, well regarding Wing Chun, Rokas apparently did train that style at one point ...actually under two different organizations and had a bad experience in both. Was he generalizing about the problems or WC (WT)? Sure. But his complaints had some merit. I've been in Wing Chun since the late 70s and all too often have seen the same thing.

To his credit, he did later acknowledge that he was over broad in his criticism and apologized. I don't know what he has been saying lately. I don't really follow him....

 

[Mider]

Rokas? Well, in all fairness, he's pretty new to MMA, and how good ...or bad he is at it doesn't really factor in to his commentary.

He's mainly an advocate for what MMA offers, as opposed to what he trained before ...i.e. training with resistance and a competitive method for testing your skills against diverse opponents.

And then he's also trying to build a YouTube following

I think it does factor in...why would I care what a nobody thinks about MMA.

 

[Mider]

Yeah, well regarding Wing Chun, Rokas apparently did train that style at one point ...actually under two different organizations and had a bad experience in both. Was he generalizing about the problems or WC (WT)? Sure. But his complaints had some merit. I've been in Wing Chun since the late 70s and all too often have seen the same thing.

To his credit, he did later acknowledge that he was over broad in his criticism and apologized. I don't know what he has been saying lately. I don't really follow him....

It just seems to me Rokas doesn’t research the school or teacher. He should Go learn at the Inosanto academy or with Tim Tackett, they do JKD but they def spar.

 

[Cynik757]

It just seems to me Rokas doesn’t research the school or teacher. He should Go learn at the Inosanto academy or with Tim Tackett, they do JKD but they def spar.

Jesus, man, on the first page of this topic there is a video from Rokas. The title of this video is "I WAS WRONG ABOUT WING CHUN".
He asked for examples of combat effective WC, he received and he admitted that some WC schools really teach people fighting.
What the f... is your problem?
I see that you have more problem with MMA than MMA has with wing chun.
BTW: Dan the Wolfman is arrogant ******* (in his youtube rants).

 

[Mider]

Jesus, man, on the first page of this topic there is a video from Rokas. The title of this video is "I WAS WRONG ABOUT WING CHUN".
He asked for examples of combat effective WC, he received and he admitted that some WC schools really teach people fighting.
What the f... is your problem?
I see that you have more problem with MMA than MMA has with wing chun.
BTW: Dan the Wolfman is arrogant ******* (in his youtube rants).

Dan the Wolfman actually fought mma, trained with huge names....who tf is Rokas that I should care what he thinks? If I had an issue with MMA why would I like Dan the Wolfman who has an MMA gym...

what’s your problem, is Rokas some mma bad *** who didn’t buy a blue belt after three months and waste 15 years training bs?

 

[Cynik757]

Dan the Wolfman actually fought mma, trained with huge names....who tf is Rokas that I should care what he thinks? If I had an issue with MMA why would I like Dan the Wolfman who has an MMA gym...

what’s your problem, is Rokas some mma bad *** who didn’t buy a blue belt after three months and waste 15 years training bs?

Dan the Wolfman has "impressive" 2-3 MMA record with only wins over opponents who also have "estimable" record: Jeremy Morrison 10-14 (1-2 before Wolfman's fight) and Tony Hymon (0-2, and 0-0 before Wolfman's fight)... Really huge achievement. I'm starting to build an altar.
He trained with big names? It does not make him a big name.
STILL:
Is Rokas right that many of WC gym sucks - YES HE IS
Has he admitted that some of WC gyms does not suck - YES HE HAS
What is your problem with him? He has enough courage to test himself and his aikido skills. It is much much much more then the rest of aikidokas has ever done. And many of chunners too. And nearly all bujinkan adepts.
He said that some MA suck, but also said - "prove me wrong". Some WC people showed him that he's partially wrong, but bujinkan and aikido communities has failed.

 

[Mider]

Dan the Wolfman has "impressive" 2-3 MMA record with only wins over opponents who also have "estimable" record: Jeremy Morrison 10-14 (1-2 before Wolfman's fight) and Tony Hymon (0-2, and 0-0 before Wolfman's fight)... Really huge achievement. I'm starting to build an altar.
He trained with big names? It does not make him a big name.
STILL:
Is Rokas right that many of WC gym sucks - YES HE IS
Has he admitted that some of WC gyms does not suck - YES HE HAS
What is your problem with him? He has enough courage to test himself and his aikido skills. It is much much much more then the rest of aikidokas has ever done. And many of chunners too. And nearly all bujinkan adepts.
He said that some MA suck, but also said - "prove me wrong". Some WC people showed him that he's partially wrong, but bujinkan and aikido communities has failed.

And what’s your record? Lol what’s Rokas record?

no but I’ve seen his videos and he knows his ****, unless you think Gokor just hands out black belts...maybe he bought it

what test dude he’s a nobody, ive Said what my issues with him are, do you worship the guy? Yeah you’ve met every Aikido expert

who tf is Rokas that anyone needs to prove anything to him? Dude Rokas is a nobody like you and me

 

[Cynik757]

How does it relate to the merit? Rokas general statement is: training methodology counts and some so called "Traditional" Martial Arts schools methodology is ********.
Maybe instead of attacking him, you should try to attack his statement. If you consider his opinion correct why do you attack him? Because he is not a good fighter? So what? He does not claim to be one.

 

[Koryuhoka]

I don’t dislike Rokas but I also don’t see who he or guys like Ramsay dewy are to act as though they are the judge and jury of the MA world.

Total agreement.

To me, they are just creating content for monetization.

 

[Mider]

How does it relate to the merit? Rokas general statement is: training methodology counts and some so called "Traditional" Martial Arts schools methodology is ********.
Maybe instead of attacking him, you should try to attack his statement. If you consider his opinion correct why do you attack him? Because he is not a good fighter? So what? He does not claim to be one.

That creates merit for him how? Dan the wolfman has merit because he trains with top guys and has competed are you illiterate or something?
I do attack his statement

again for the millionth time who tf cares what he thinks, he’s a nobody who paid for a blue belt. You guys suck up to these guys like Ramsey Dewey n Rokas, why? Idk

anyway get this through your head, idc what Rokas thinks and I doubt most do.

 

[Mider]

Deleted

 

[Mider]

How does it relate to the merit? Rokas general statement is: training methodology counts and some so called "Traditional" Martial Arts schools methodology is ********.
Maybe instead of attacking him, you should try to attack his statement. If you consider his opinion correct why do you attack him? Because he is not a good fighter? So what? He does not claim to be one.

I’m trying to understand your logic you’re praising some nobody like Rokas yet a guy with multiple black belts from some of the best guys on earth has no merit to you...

 

[Cynik757]

Just show me what is wrong with Rokas statements mentioned above
- is he right that methology counts?
- is he right that some of TMA schools have wrong methodology?

 

[Mider]

Just show me what is wrong with Rokas statements mentioned above
- is he right that methology counts?
- is he right that some of TMA schools have wrong methodology?

I’m done talking to you, i just told you idc what Rokas says.

Many schools both mma, TMA, BJJ have wring methodology lol...

it doesn’t make Rokas a damn expert

btw I asked you a question, you respect Rokas who’s a nobody yet think Dan the Wolfman is mean ?

 

[Flying Crane]

Just show me what is wrong with Rokas statements mentioned above
- is he right that methology counts?
- is he right that some of TMA schools have wrong methodology?

Some schools have low quality training and instruction, regardless of methodology, and that can vary wildly from one school to another, even within the same system.

Setting quality aside for a moment, specific training methods themselves can vary widely from one school to another, within the same system. Every school isn’t run in the same manner.

I am sure you know this.

So yes, training methodology matters. But I don’t believe it is possible to judge the training methodology of an entire system as “wrong.” Because an entire system doesn’t have a single consistent training methodology.

I am sure you know this as well.

But yes, some schools (TMA or otherwise) use questionable methods and keep the quality bar low. Again, no surprise there. News flash: some schools are better than others. Go figure.

 

[Steve]

Some schools have low quality training and instruction, regardless of methodology, and that can vary wildly from one school to another, even within the same system.

Setting quality aside for a moment, specific training methods themselves can vary widely from one school to another, within the same system. Every school isn’t run in the same manner.

I am sure you know this.

So yes, training methodology matters. But I don’t believe it is possible to judge the training methodology of an entire system as “wrong.” Because an entire system doesn’t have a single consistent training methodology.

I am sure you know this as well.

But yes, some schools (TMA or otherwise) use questionable methods and keep the quality bar low. Again, no surprise there. News flash: some schools are better than others. Go figure.

This isn’t exactly true. For example, the training methodology of aikido is grounded firmly in the pacifist philosophy of aikido. So if you change the training methodology, you do so at the expense of core values within the art. You are aberrant and are ostracized.

I am sure you know this.

So, while there may be some aikido schools with a different training methodology, they are exceptions to a rule.

and as a result, we can discuss aikido training methodology as a whole, while acknowledging that there may be exceptions.

I am sure you know this, as well.

 

[Mider]

This isn’t exactly true. For example, the training methodology of aikido is grounded firmly in the pacifist philosophy of aikido. So if you change the training methodology, you do so at the expense of core values within the art. You are aberrant and are ostracized.

I am sure you know this.

So, while there may be some aikido schools with a different training methodology, they are exceptions to a rule.

and as a result, we can discuss aikido training methodology as a whole, while acknowledging that there may be exceptions.

I am sure you know this, as well.

Not true, not everyone believes Aikido is about pacifism Etc. There are plenty of aikido teachers who train and teach it for real defense