Other Styles?
- Thread starter SFC JeffJ
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astrobiologist
Brown Belt
I primarily train in Tang Soo Do. My style is basically Korean Shotokan mixed with a little Tae Kyon. But at our school we also teach some Jujitsu and Kobojutsu.
From what I've seen in my studies and training, most martial arts have been derived from mixing other styles together. A lot of korean and japanese martial arts are derived from okinawan styles. However, most of what the okinawans taught came from the chinese. Indeed, martial history can be traced back very far. As a martial art is taught, it is changed as needed per the culture and the time.
A lot of what we teach as a martial "style" is really just our unique flavor of our shared human martial art. Almost all of us have similar principles and concepts in our martial art.
From what I've seen in my studies and training, most martial arts have been derived from mixing other styles together. A lot of korean and japanese martial arts are derived from okinawan styles. However, most of what the okinawans taught came from the chinese. Indeed, martial history can be traced back very far. As a martial art is taught, it is changed as needed per the culture and the time.
A lot of what we teach as a martial "style" is really just our unique flavor of our shared human martial art. Almost all of us have similar principles and concepts in our martial art.
It's common to pick up other styles' katas, but not much else!
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It's actually not unusual at all, for someone to infuse elements of another system into their own.
The gentleman who founded the system that I practice, had trained under Ohtsuka Shihan in Wado Ryu, but later, added a lot of the Shotokan Karate system, forming a hybrid of the two.
The way I see it, as long as the person teaching the martial art has a good understanding of the kihon of each particular system that he combines, then there's nothing wrong with combining the two.
The gentleman who founded the system that I practice, had trained under Ohtsuka Shihan in Wado Ryu, but later, added a lot of the Shotokan Karate system, forming a hybrid of the two.
The way I see it, as long as the person teaching the martial art has a good understanding of the kihon of each particular system that he combines, then there's nothing wrong with combining the two.
twendkata71
Black Belt
Thats funny that you say that, since Wado ryu karate do comes from a combination of Shotokan karate and Jujitsu. Now Ohtuska did keep the more Okinawan versions of the kata, instead of the changes that Funakoshi and his students later made, as well as Shotokan adopted many kata from Shito ryu(Funakoshi's friend and senior in karate Mabuni).
As many of you know Ohtsuka was a master of Jujitsu before studying karate with Funakoshi and then branching off with his own style.
So, yes it is common to take from other styles, even though if you were to ask a Shotokan master in Japan, such a thing is unheard of. The Japanese in many cases follow the philosophy of one style the only style, BS. On Okinawa originally it was quite common for karateka to learn from a variety of teachers, case in point, Funakoshi studied with Itosu(Shuri te-shorin ), and Azato(Naha te{Shorei}). Konishi studied from many masters, Funakoshi, Mabuni, Motobu, Ohtsuka before founding his own ShindoJenin ryu(Ryobukai) Karatedo.
As many of you know Ohtsuka was a master of Jujitsu before studying karate with Funakoshi and then branching off with his own style.
So, yes it is common to take from other styles, even though if you were to ask a Shotokan master in Japan, such a thing is unheard of. The Japanese in many cases follow the philosophy of one style the only style, BS. On Okinawa originally it was quite common for karateka to learn from a variety of teachers, case in point, Funakoshi studied with Itosu(Shuri te-shorin ), and Azato(Naha te{Shorei}). Konishi studied from many masters, Funakoshi, Mabuni, Motobu, Ohtsuka before founding his own ShindoJenin ryu(Ryobukai) Karatedo.
I think most instructor infuse all ther knowledge into their training. If an instructor has studied a couple of systems long enough I can easily understand that the two systems could begin to become one in his teachings
kamishinkan
Green Belt
I agree, It seems that Martial Arts have mostly been adapted from other styles over the years. Today though, modern MA practitioners seem to be frowned upon for doing the same practice. We are told that traditional arts must be kept "pure" even though history proves these 'historical' arts were mainly a compilation of other arts or an art that was infused over the years.
I would say though, that in a sense, I sort of agree with keeping a "traditional" system somewhat pure, at least in the teaching process. For example, teach the art you have chosen to teach and tell the students when you are adapting principles from another art. This will keep the "traditional" system "pure" and help your students to better understand the principles of your system (and the principles of others that they are being shown).
I have a good friend that trained in Shotokan in Japan under Nakayama shihan (as well as others), and he also trained in a Shorin style in Okinawa. He teaches his students Shotokan but readily teaches them moves more likened to Shorin. No problem, he says his instructor(s) had no problem with such things. I assume as long as it was taught as a "seperate" principle (and the students knew it).
I would say though, that in a sense, I sort of agree with keeping a "traditional" system somewhat pure, at least in the teaching process. For example, teach the art you have chosen to teach and tell the students when you are adapting principles from another art. This will keep the "traditional" system "pure" and help your students to better understand the principles of your system (and the principles of others that they are being shown).
I have a good friend that trained in Shotokan in Japan under Nakayama shihan (as well as others), and he also trained in a Shorin style in Okinawa. He teaches his students Shotokan but readily teaches them moves more likened to Shorin. No problem, he says his instructor(s) had no problem with such things. I assume as long as it was taught as a "seperate" principle (and the students knew it).
I think it is very common.
Brian S
Purple Belt
I think it's more uncommon not to anymore.
twendkata71
Black Belt
Personally I have tried to learn from as many sources as possible to develop my karate. I am not trying to create a new style, but at some point in a karateka's journey it becomes their karate not just the style they are learning. Having been envolved with the WUKO/WKF curriculum of the four major styles of Japanese karate and my own research into Okinawan karate, I have had the opportunity to learn from a vast field of knowledge, on kata,bunkai, oyo, kumite tactics, training regimes, etc.
I don't see how a martial artist can fully develop without learning from other styles. I also add Jujitsu, Aikido, Judo, Kenpo, and Okinawan Kobudo into my curriculum. I want my students to be ready for anything and to develop to their full potential. I think that this is what most sensei wanted for their students before the whole commercialization of the arts happened. Commerical gain is the only reason that I can see why a sensei would want to keep their student confined to only one style of training.
I don't see how a martial artist can fully develop without learning from other styles. I also add Jujitsu, Aikido, Judo, Kenpo, and Okinawan Kobudo into my curriculum. I want my students to be ready for anything and to develop to their full potential. I think that this is what most sensei wanted for their students before the whole commercialization of the arts happened. Commerical gain is the only reason that I can see why a sensei would want to keep their student confined to only one style of training.
rebaccawood911
White Belt
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I also try all new styles in karate my teacher helps me out iby giving good training...
Brian S
Purple Belt
Every modern style of karate has integrated other styles of karate. Whether they admit it or even know it is a different topic.
