Natural Cures THEY don't want you to know about

[MartialArtHeart]

As martial artists, we have probably, at one time or another, become interested in natural medicines. It is an integral part of the asian cultures, and out of all sorts of athletes, martial artists are probably most likely to investigate stuff like this.
Natural Cures is a book by Kevin Trudeau. I have yet to read it, but I have watched many shows, etc. on the subject, and discussed it on other forums. I am curious as to what you think about all of it. Not necessarily the cures themselves, but the massive corruption underneath all of this.

According to Trudeau, the pharmaceutical companies are trying to take natural cures off the market... herbal supplements, etc., and they are paying people off in order to cover up natural cures. They also use additives that cause you to become dependent on their meds.

Why?

MONEY.

Now, I'm no expert, but I can buy this. I've seen too many good cures taken off the market by the FDA... ones with NO SIDE EFFECTS. Cures for depression, insomnia, diabetes, and lots of other horrible afflictions.

Trudeau also claims that it is illegal in the U.S. to cure cancer without chemo, or some other sort of "cure" that helps the companies to make money. He claims this on the grounds that a doctor was arrested for curing a woman's cancer without chemo. ??? If you have any info on this, I sure am eager to hear it! I mean, to me, this sounds ridiculous!

But the fact is that the herbs and other natural meds I have used have worked better than prescriptions, without side effects. And right now I am worried that these, like so many others, will be taken off the market because of special interests. What do you think of this? Do you use natural meds? Do you think this is all bogus?

Like I said, I can buy most of this easily, and I believe that, due to the craziness of society, the rest of it is plausible. I can't wait to get Trudeau's books and read them. Anyone out there read them?

 

[Touch Of Death]

Money plays a role because the laws are written that business cannot put a pattent on a plant.
Sean

 

[Xue Sheng]

Money, ignorance and Western MDs lack of knowledge on the topic play a part true

But.....

My wife is a trained TCM doc from China, trained in acupuncture and herbology, and she is rather amazed at the way people here treat and take herbs here in the US.

Just because they are natural does not mean they are safe some taken with the wrong combinations are potentially deadly and you can OD on herbs as well. You need to be trained in herbs to know how to use them properly and in China a specialist in herbology is equivalent to a pharmacist here. But they have been dealing with and using herbal remedies much longer than us so the average person in China has a much better understanding of herbs that most in the west.

Speaking purely from a TCM point of view some infections are caused by heat and I have heard more than a few people with a cold say they need Ginseng and per TCM Ginseng creates heat which will not cure a problem caused by heat, it will in fact make it worse. So you really REALLY need to know what you are doing with herbs. I really don’t wish to repeat myself here but this is a VERY important point just because they are natural does not mean they are safe

 

[MartialArtHeart]

Xue Sheng, thank you for pointing that out. What I meant was for herbs taken knowledgeably... or at least somewhat

 

[Empty Hands]

According to Trudeau, the pharmaceutical companies are trying to take natural cures off the market... herbal supplements, etc., and they are paying people off in order to cover up natural cures.

Even if true in some way, the way that herbal supplements are marketed in this country is a major problem. No supplement or herb is required to be evaluated by the FDA, or undergo any research at all to show it is effective. Combined with the problems that can result from taking herbs willy-nilly which a poster below discusses, this leaves a recipe for disaster. Other countries regulate herbal remedies in the same way as pharmaceuticals - Germany for instance. We should emulate them in this matter.

They also use additives that cause you to become dependent on their meds.

Do you have any evidence for this at all? If true, it would be enough to completely destroy any company that tried it. Myself, I highly doubt it. Why court destruction when you are already pulling a 20% profit return?

I've seen too many good cures taken off the market by the FDA... ones with NO SIDE EFFECTS. Cures for depression, insomnia, diabetes, and lots of other horrible afflictions.

Which ones? I doubt it, as I stated above the FDA does not evaluate herbal remedies. Only strong evidence of harm would be enough to take something herbal off the market.

He claims this on the grounds that a doctor was arrested for curing a woman's cancer without chemo. ???

My guess if true? The doc was treating someone with an unproven method when proven methods that the patient might have been willing to try were still available. Plenty of cancer patients try unconventional remedies and no one gets arrested. If not, I would love to see the text of the law that makes only chemo legal.

But the fact is that the herbs and other natural meds I have used have worked better than prescriptions, without side effects.

That's just nonsense. If there is enough of an active compound in a "natural" med to bind to a receptor and have an effect, then there is enough to cause side effects in some people. Only the placebo effect has a strong effect without side effects in everyone. Frankly, I think the placebo effect is most of what is going on with these remedies.

But hey, I could be wrong. If there is tons of evidence showing that natural meds are the cat's *** and that the pharm companies are engaged in a massive conspiracy to cover it all up, then by all means show it.

 

[MartialArtHeart]

Do you have any evidence for this at all? If true, it would be enough to completely destroy any company that tried it. Myself, I highly doubt it. Why court destruction when you are already pulling a 20% profit return?

My guess if true? The doc was treating someone with an unproven method when proven methods that the patient might have been willing to try were still available. Plenty of cancer patients try unconventional remedies and no one gets arrested. If not, I would love to see the text of the law that makes only chemo legal.

That's just nonsense. If there is enough of an active compound in a "natural" med to bind to a receptor and have an effect, then there is enough to cause side effects in some people. Only the placebo effect has a strong effect without side effects in everyone. Frankly, I think the placebo effect is most of what is going on with these remedies.

But hey, I could be wrong. If there is tons of evidence showing that natural meds are the cat's *** and that the pharm companies are engaged in a massive conspiracy to cover it all up, then by all means show it.

Perhaps you didn't read my post fully? I am also skeptical, which is the main reason why I posted it. There's no reason to get p.o.'ed.
And as far as it being nonsense... well, to each his own, I suppose. But tell me, why is it that you are so against herbs? It's not some psychic voodoo crap; do you honestly think that out of all the plants, all natural things, that there is nothing to cure human illness? To me, that is nonsense. Respectfully, of course.

And as far as what they are, I've got many. haha, which ailment should I list?

 

[Empty Hands]

And as far as it being nonsense... well, to each his own, I suppose. But tell me, why is it that you are so against herbs?

I'm not "against herbs." I'm against people spending money on ineffective and potentially harmful medical treatments, and I am very much against the irrationality which tends to occur in people with regards to this topic. If any herb has a beneficial medical effect, then research won't make it disappear - it will only validate it. Empirical research is the only way to show what works and what doesn't, and what might be harmful. Anecdotes about cousin Tom and how his cancer went away when he took echinacea won't cut it.

Such evidence is also very useful if someone is going to claim a massive conspiracy by pharm companies to suppress alternative medicine. All I want to see is the evidence, for the conspiracies and for the herbs - and I haven't seen any evidence for the former, and precious little for the latter.

Finally, it really IS scientific nonsense to claim that any treatment can have a medical effect without producing any side effects in anyone. Herbs have drugs in them too, that is what makes them work - and some people will react poorly to them. That is science, claiming that a wonder tonic will cure your ills without any potential downsides is charlatanism.

 

[crushing]

It's all about the money. In fact, money is such a big deal that Kevin Trudeau selling this book at cost, right? Oh, he isn't?

I haven't read Trudeau's books, but I have heard a lot about them apparently from organizations involved in the big conspiracy, like Salon.

http://dir.salon.com/story/books/feature/2005/07/29/trudeau/index.html

 

[MartialArtHeart]

Thank you, Crushing. That is an interesting article, and if true it clears up some things. But there is one thing that puzzles me. He's giving the books away free for "a limited time"... however the s&h is high and I believe that it is just another scam.

 

[MA-Caver]

I haven't bought the book but I plan to. Reading a bit here and there, I've tried one remedy for heart-burn/gas that actually worked. Vinegar. Take a couple of swigs and cuss at the taste/after-taste and take it easy for about 10-15 minutes. I'll be durned if the burning/pressure didn't go away... totally. According to the book the burning sensation that's a result of heartburn is caused by a LACK of stomach acid. Swallowing vinegar helps ADD to it and thus brings the stomach back into balance. Tums, Rolaids, Mylanta and all those other Antacids are trying to REDUCE the stomach acid or excess. Wait a second... they're doing it backwards? Or am I just not understanding the concept of supply and demand?

The fact that the asian culture has known about natural medicines/herbs for centuries is almost a cliche' but it's a true one. Very true.

What is the biggest problem is the pharmaceutical companies here in the states (and likely in Europe) are making BILLIONS of dollars each year peddling their wares. They make Bill Gates look like a pauper. Yes, it's about money... LOTS of money, an almost inconceivable amount of money. When you got that much money you got muscle and where you got muscle you get pretty much whatever you want, irregardless. Hell, they probably own the FDA or they are the FDA.

My parents shell out roughly anywhere from 200+ bucks a month in meds alone. They've got a good health plan where if they stick to the generics they'll do okay. But still, add their pay out to anywhere between 80-150 million people each month... whew!

The American people has become increasingly dependent upon these quick-fix -pop-a-pill for whatever ails ya schemes. Yes, it's a scheme, nothing more than a greedy money making scheme.
What's really scary (to me anyway) is when I watch those drug ads (ironic isn't it?) on TV or read them in mags is the number of side-effects (which are really nothing more than an effect of the drug... side-effects? nice euphemism huh?) each one has. Or how they say don't take this if you have this, that and that and this.
Ok wait a second... these drugs did pass the FDA testing didn't they? ?? Oh wait... scroll up to what I said a few moments ago about said agency... of course they did... whew! Had me worried there for a second. Anyway....

One of the things I like to do once in a while when with one of my father's physicians is to say two words when-ever the issue of money comes up. I'll say it under my breath and just loud enough for them to hear it but not quite enough for them to say they heard it... but they got the dig anyway. Two words -- Socialized Medicine. They of course pretend they didn't hear it as I pretend I didn't say it.
Or at least regulated medicine. If they weren't making so much money off their products they may consider natural medicines/herbs to help supplement. I mean those Rolls Royces with the Deluxe leather interiors are kinda pricey ya know?

I have nothing but disdain right now for the greed that modern medicine presents to the public. That advances in the technology and all of that I applaud them standing and shouting bravo! But at the outrageousness of the COST of the technology... makes me want to spin them around and kick them so hard that a podiatrist and a proctologist will have to work together to get us apart.
Example: 1 rattle snake bite = anti-venom, pain-killers (which I shunned anyway), other assorted meds and one night's stay at the hospital. Total cost... $21,000.00 The pharmacy alone was $16,000.00 + That's ONE night's stay.

Just like with the gasoline prices we keep paying it no matter how much more they keep raising the prices... because we're just too g--damned dependent upon it.

All we have to do is take Nancy Reagan's advice and just say "no".

If one of the candidates can promise that it's going to stop... I'll vote for them in a heart beat.

 

[Grenadier]

As a member of the cancer research community, I will say this much:

Kevin Trudeau is a fraud, plain and simple.

His claims of the miracle cures are fallacious, and prey on the uninformed. Anyone with a fair knowledge of biochemistry should have known that his so-called coral calcium supplements were garbage, and that there were no advantages over a conventional calcium citrate supplement that could be bought off a Wal-Mart shelf.

Not only do his so-called cures fail to work, but they have discouraged many people from seeking real treatment that could have saved their lives, had they done so in a timely manner. The way I see it, he has their blood on his hands.

And for those of you who think that George W. Bush is after Trudeau, think again... He's been doing this garbage during the Clinton and George HW Bush administrations, too.



Some reading on Kevin Trudeau:

http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2004/09/trudeaucoral.shtm

http://www.quackwatch.org/02ConsumerProtection/FTCActions/trudeau.html


Then there was his part in the credit card scam that got him thrown in prison.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0826051trudeau1.html

http://skepdic.com/trudeau.html

Basically, he's so full of fecal matter, that his breath stinks.

 

[MartialArtHeart]

It is interesting to hear both sides... thanks for your input, MA-Caver and Grenadier. Also the articles.

 

[Tez3]

While on holiday in France my daughter bought the American version of Cosmopolitian magazine, we were amazed to find ads for drugs in it. Here advertising drugs is not allowed, you can advertise non prescription remedies though. The thought of going to your doctor and asking him to prescribe a certain make of drug wouldn't occur to us.Our prescriptions cost the same to us whatever they are, I think it's just under £7 at the moment. I get my prescriptions free because I have to take Thyroxine, it's a for life thing so I don't pay. Pregnant mums, those on benefits, children and pensioners don't pay either.

We have recently over here had a chain of traditional Chinese medicine shops set up in a lot of shopping centres and high streets. They offer diagnosis, massage and acupunture as well as Chinese herbal remedies. I think they are proving very popular, I find it a useful compliment to the NHS. There's a great many ailments that can be dealt with by complimentary medicine which can take the strain off doctors allowing them time to treat more serious complaints.
We don't pay our doctors by insurance so we tend to be more reticent about seeing a doctor unless we think it's serious.The doctors do have restraints on them though about how much the drugs they prescribe can cost. if it's too expensive they have to ask permission from the health authority.
I wouldn't have thought the big companies would try to hide herbal remedies more that they would buy and market them?

 

[Skip Cooper]

I have seen the info-mercials for this book. The guy reminds me of all of the "get rich with my proven methods" hacks...I can get rich also if I sell a book to millions of people telling them to spend less than they earn.

I do not plan to buy his book. There are better books on the market for homeopathic remedies, I am sure.

 

[Skip Cooper]

While on holiday in France my daughter bought the American version of Cosmopolitian magazine, we were amazed to find ads for drugs in it. Here advertising drugs is not allowed, you can advertise non prescription remedies though. The thought of going to your doctor and asking him to prescribe a certain make of drug wouldn't occur to us.

Here in the U.S., we are bombarded with commericals about every disease or condition out there and the prescriptions that can "cure" them. A couple of days ago, I had to dodge a question from my 6 year old daughter about certain sexual side effects of a drug they were hawking on television. I was not pleased, to say the least.

 

[Blotan Hunka]

Here in the U.S., we are bombarded with commericals about every disease or condition out there and the prescriptions that can "cure" them. A couple of days ago, I had to dodge a question from my 6 year old daughter about certain sexual side effects of a drug they were hawking on television. I was not pleased, to say the least.

Not to mention all the erectile dysfunction, feminine hygine products, "personal lubricant" and sexually transmitted disease med ads there are out there too.

 

[Tez3]

We get the femimine products but they are so discreet they are actually funny. They don't actually say or show what it is or what it's for, just mystical voices telling you you can now, cycle, swim, dance etc with the screen showing ladies doing these activities! The ads for constipation remedies are even funnier, one shows a lady filling up her handbag with food and it getting overfull then the name of the product and the empty handbag. Ads for tobaco products are banned and the ones for alcohol strictly regulated and have to be on after nine at night the 'watershed' as they call it. Overall our ads are ok, like mini films, sometimes you can't guess what they are selling!

 

[Marginal]

We get the femimine products but they are so discreet they are actually funny. They don't actually say or show what it is or what it's for, just mystical voices telling you you can now, cycle, swim, dance etc with the screen showing ladies doing these activities! The ads for constipation remedies are even funnier, one shows a lady filling up her handbag with food and it getting overfull then the name of the product and the empty handbag. Ads for tobaco products are banned and the ones for alcohol strictly regulated and have to be on after nine at night the 'watershed' as they call it. Overall our ads are ok, like mini films, sometimes you can't guess what they are selling!

 

[Skip Cooper]

This one is a classic :erg:!

 

[MartialArtHeart]

OMFG, why did you have to post this one?! I hate these commercials... xP