Massive New York Protest

[Kane]

See the link below if you have not heard about it;

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/story/0,13918,1283422,00.html

Bad tactic the democrats are using by making such a massive protest. Making them look like they are going out of control. If you have seen any video footage of the protest, it actually looks kind of funny.

This massive protest might be the republicans fault as well because they choose a city where there are so many more democrats than republicans.


What do you think?

 

[RandomPhantom700]

Blocking off streets? Infiltrating delegates' hotels? I realize that stuff like this (depending on what "infiltrating" entails) is perfectly constitutional, but we just saw a thread earlier discussing how people who so much as hold anti-Bush signs are arrested for disturbing the peace, or some such ********.

I agree with them, and hope that their protests actually acheive something other than a whole lot of court cases, but I just hope that they keep things legal. THe last thing they need is to inadvertantly reinforce the idea that these liberal protestors are potential terrorists.

 

[RandomPhantom700]

Oh yeah, no swearing. Forgot about that.

 

[hardheadjarhead]

I just saw it on CNN...it was HUGE.

Protests at the '68 Democratic convention helped kill the Democrats that year. Richard Daly's cops bat the tar out of people, and it was spread across the news.

Personally I don't think this will hurt the Dems. It'll hurt the Republicans. If the cops start cracking people (and I doubt this will happen) the election will get uglier.


Regards,


Steve

 

[michaeledward]

United for Peace and Justice was anticipating 250,000. According to some reports, today the numbers may have topped 400,000. The police would not give an estimate. I heard there were approximately 60 arrests today.

I will be looking closely for Republican Congresspeoples staffs in any boisterous outbreaks, just like the recount shuffle.

Remember, they are planning for a minimum of 1,000 arrests per day.

 

[Kane]

It's kind of scary; some of those protesters are probably plain Bush-Haters to the point of insanity. I'm sure if they get a chance to they will try to assassinate George W. Bush! It’s there right to protest, I just hope it won’t get out of hand. The republicans should have the convention elsewhere in a place where at least the city is neutral. Most people in New York City hate Bush.

 

[michaeledward]

It's kind of scary; some of those protesters are probably plain Bush-Haters to the point of insanity. I'm sure if they get a chance to they will try to assassinate George W. Bush! It’s there right to protest, I just hope it won’t get out of hand. The republicans should have the convention elsewhere in a place where at least the city is neutral. Most people in New York City hate Bush.

Wow ... talk about hatred.

Just who is the 'THEY' you think will try to assassinate the President of the United States? How do you define 'Insanity'?

And yes, it is their right to protest, it's called the First Amendment to the Constitution. Those who are protesting are doing so out of their Patriotic feelings and love of country.

And where do you suggest the Republicans hold their convention where citizens might not be opposed (even strongly opposed) to Bush Administration policies?

 

[Tgace]

Maybe Im a cynic, but I would say most of the issues being protested have more to do with "special interests" (sexual orientation issues, abortion, stem cells, $$, etc.) than any "Patriotic feelings and love of country". Not that those issues dont matter, but I feel many people dont feel much past their own self interests anymore.

 

[shesulsa]

I think it's about time people showed how they feel about the Bush presidency, policy and legacy. I just hope the Dems don't allow the Reps to incite anger and violence on the part of Dems, since the Republican language base tends to use provocative terms...such as Kane's statement / accusation.

I find it interesting that Tgace expressed concern that everyone seems to be after their own agenda rather than support the country...but this country was founded in the spirit of individual rights and tolerance...and they seem to be melting away under false patriotism.

I think we all really need to pay attention to the divide-and-conquer tactics in use by our leaders. Right now, the country is very divided and this is really not good. I fear for our future in 100 years.

 

[Tgace]

Politics always seems to be about "picking sides" on side issues rather than issues that we all can agree on. What should the focus be?

 

[rmcrobertson]

We can agree that if the Democrats hold a convention in Boston, with virtually no protest and lots of local cooperation, and the Republicans hold a convention in the city that perhaps more than any other has reason to support the, "war or terror," and a zillion people turn out to protest...you see where I'm going with this?

And as for the proposition that these protestors are merely self-interested, gee, I thought the whole premise of capitalism was that self-interest was A Good Thing. You know--like when you weasel out of Vietnam service, surf on your family's wealth and power, sell out whatever there is to sell out to become President, and then run your campaign around calling other Americans traitors?

Protest has a long, proud tradition in this country. Or it did, last time I checked our history...in point of fact, protest is exactly what our particular brand of patriotism seems to be all about. So, love it or leave it.

 

[Kane]

Wow ... talk about hatred.

Just who is the 'THEY' you think will try to assassinate the President of the United States? How do you define 'Insanity'?

And yes, it is their right to protest, it's called the First Amendment to the Constitution. Those who are protesting are doing so out of their Patriotic feelings and love of country.

And where do you suggest the Republicans hold their convention where citizens might not be opposed (even strongly opposed) to Bush Administration policies?

Some people hate Bush so much that if they get the chance they might try to kill him. Think about it.

I'm not saying the people on the street is insane, that is just a figure of speech. I just hope that the protest doesn't turn to ugly.

 

[shesulsa]

Some people hate Bush so much that if they get the chance they might try to kill him. Think about it.

Okay, this sounds a lot like news digested to me. Come on, now - how many dems to you hear saying, "I'm sure some people hate Kerry so much that if they get the chance, they might try to kill him." You have inferred the application of a generalization when the correct reference might be to a handful of people.

Your statement is not taken seriously because you cannot be serious in a general sense. You are flinging this statement out at a large group of people to whom it does not apply, and it is a serious accusation. Do you really not see how preposterous it is?

 

[michaeledward]

Some people hate Bush so much that if they get the chance they might try to kill him. Think about it.

I'm not saying the people on the street is insane, that is just a figure of speech. I just hope that the protest doesn't turn to ugly.

Okay, this sounds a lot like news digested to me. Come on, now - how many dems to you hear saying, "I'm sure some people hate Kerry so much that if they get the chance, they might try to kill him." You have inferred the application of a generalization when the correct reference might be to a handful of people.

Your statement is not taken seriously because you cannot be serious in a general sense. You are flinging this statement out at a large group of people to whom it does not apply, and it is a serious accusation. Do you really not see how preposterous it is?

I find it much more scary than you shesulsa. You see, I think most people think that most people are like themselves. This is perhaps, on reason why I find it difficult to understand why people such as Kane and deadhand31 are such stuanch Sean Hannity listeners ... oops, I mean conservatives. I think that most people have the same ability it see and understand the duplicitousness of our current administration.

Here, however, Kane is saying that he thinks some Americans hate so much that they are likely to assassinate the President. This tells me that Kane is capable of thinking such things.

Of course, if we assume that Kane is capable of assassinating a President, simple because he thinks others are, I think we will find a huge denial. Appropriately so.

The only other conclusion is that Kane has mentally purchased the argument of the 'Other'. "Those Democrats are not like Us Americans." "They don't love their country Like we do." "They are like the Russians of the 70's, athiestic, communists." "They don't love their children like we do." "The Iraqi's can't handle freedom."

Dehumanize. Where do you suppose this is being taught?

I am about as left as anybody on this board, and the most drastic thing I have called for is the President's Impeachment.

Maybe Im a cynic, but I would say most of the issues being protested have more to do with "special interests" (sexual orientation issues, abortion, stem cells, $$, etc.) than any "Patriotic feelings and love of country". Not that those issues dont matter, but I feel many people dont feel much past their own self interests anymore.

Why are the two mutually exclusive?

"I love America because it is a free country, and as a woman, I should be free to do with my body what my morals and my doctor feel is appropriate."

"I love America because the protection against unreasonable searches and siezures guarantees that I can do whatever I would like with a consenting adult in the privacy of my bedroom."

"I love America because of its rich history of scientific research has provided bountiful benefits for citizens of the global community. I think the governement should support such research, rather than restrict it."

"I love America because I can be self-centered, egotistical and arrogant. Because we are CAPITALISTS (signed Ken Lay)".

 

[Tgace]

Im not saying the two are necessarily mutually exclusive...just that I dont think many people link the two concepts. If anything there seems to be A lot of "America sucks because (insert some topic)..." Somehow when I make this point, the conclusion that Im against protest is made. I dont think I said that.....

 

[michaeledward]

I'm curious why you think a protestor thinks 'America Sucks'?

Might a protestor think the Bush Adminstration Sucks ... yes, sure ... but I don't see how that relates to America Sucks. I do not think the policies of one administration are 'America'. I do not think even the ongoing battles represent 'America'. Might your brush strokes be a bit too broad?

 

[Tgace]

Well...since many sources Ive seen have quotes of protesters saying they want to make such a scene that they will shut the convention down....stifling the opposing viewpoint seems unamerican to me, no matter which party does it. I may be critical of people, but Ive never implied they should be stopped.

 

[michaeledward]

The argument you are making is that the Republican National Convention is America. Because a protestor wants to shut down the RNC, they must think America Sucks. That does not follow.

Additionally, to think that all protestors speak with the same voice and desire the same thing is, I think, false. I would like to see what Protest Groups you are referring to, and the calls that they have made for shutting down the convention.

I am not concluding, by the way, that you are 'on' any side. I'm curious why you think anyone has stated so. I do disagree with your premise and I think your thought processes are erroneous.

 

[Flatlander]

Half a million protesting citizens and the main bulk of the incumbent political party all in a measureable and distinct space. What an opportune moment for terrorism.

I agree that all should have the right to peaceful assembly. I don't think that I would attend at this time, though. I would just excercise my right to vote, and stay away from the crowds.

 

[michaeledward]

Well ... I really want to be there ...

but, life intervenes.

But But ... Hizzonor - CPlusAugustus is going to be in town today .... speaking at Nashua High School North ... I'm off with my protest signs shortly ...


Robert ... I have " WWMD? 971 copyright rmcroberston" on one side.