Kerry just handed Bush his behind...

[Cruentus]

O.K....

I just saw the 1st Bush vs. Kerry Debate.

It looks like Kerry whooped Bushes tail. I am not just saying this because I don't like Bush. Looking from an unbiased prospective Kerry is a very skilled debator...probably the best presidental debator we have had as long as I have been alive.

Thoughts on this?

 

[Bob Hubbard]

I'm waiting to see what the 3rd party comments on the commercial, errr, debate are before deciding who won. (bushkerry or kerrybush)

 

[Xequat]

Yeah, not too good for the home team. Bush got a few shots in here and there, but he kept saying the same thing. He also missed some golden opportunities. Kerry referred to us not trying diplomacy and "rushing into war," even though we did try diplomacy for a long time and had a bunch of resolutions (sixteen maybe?), but Bush dropped the ball. There were a couple of other clarifications I was sure he'd make, but didn't.

 

[RandomPhantom700]

I'll have to find a transcript of the debates, I missed out on them tonight. Damned homework. Glad to hear that Kerry came out on top though.

Kaith, on another forum, one person's signature includes a picture that presents the image of one person: on the left-hand side, it's Kerry, but on the right-hand side, it's Bush, and they're merged in the middle to show one man. Kind of a twisted political Harvey Two-Face. You'd probably like it.

 

[GAB]

Hi All,
Short and brief, their was an article not to long ago by a Doctor of neurological disorders.
That in his opinion Bush has the first stages of Alzheimer's disease. Has any one else read this?

Regards, Gary

 

[auxprix]

I'll have to look for it on an American channel here. I'd like to see it for myself.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

RP, sounds like a riot. I'd love to see that image.

For a transcript, try the NY Times. I used to have a subscription and they used to have the debate transcripts in there. Haven't read it in a few years though, so could be wrong. Also, try here: http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/09/30/debate.transcript.1/index.html (Doesn't seem complete at the moment, but they say they are working on it.)

 

[bignick]

I'll have to find a transcript of the debates, I missed out on them tonight. Damned homework. Glad to hear that Kerry came out on top though.

Kaith, on another forum, one person's signature includes a picture that presents the image of one person: on the left-hand side, it's Kerry, but on the right-hand side, it's Bush, and they're merged in the middle to show one man. Kind of a twisted political Harvey Two-Face. You'd probably like it.

the band Rage Against the Machine did that with Bush and Gore in one of their videos around the time of the election...the music video featured a bunch of clips of them saying the exact same thing on a variety of topics

 

[RandomPhantom700]

Here ya' go.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

That pic is just, scary. They mesh so well.....


Regarding the debate, I'm slowly reading through the transcript.
My opinion so far?
Tie. Neither one really said anything thats 'new' to me.

 

[Bob Hubbard]

Correction, close, I give the W to Kerry.
(Theres a joke in that somehow....LOL)

 

[Shade Silverwing]

Hi All,
Short and brief, their was an article not to long ago by a Doctor of neurological disorders.
That in his opinion Bush has the first stages of Alzheimer's disease. Has any one else read this?

Regards, Gary

Believe it or not, I heard this from my Sensei. Evidently, she has connections to this doctor.

 

[Tkang_TKD]

I did watch the debates, and if I were to offer my honest opinion, Kerry definitely came out stronger, and President Bush did have a few good moments.

As I understand it, Kerry could use some knockouts. He came away with a split decision in my eyes.

 

[michaeledward]

O.K....

I just saw the 1st Bush vs. Kerry Debate.

It looks like Kerry whooped Bushes tail. I am not just saying this because I don't like Bush. Looking from an unbiased prospective Kerry is a very skilled debator...probably the best presidental debator we have had as long as I have been alive.

Thoughts on this?

Haven't seen the rest of the thread yet ... But Gore is a pretty good debator too ... although I am still really mystified about what happened four years ago.

 

[michaeledward]

Yeah, not too good for the home team. Bush got a few shots in here and there, but he kept saying the same thing. He also missed some golden opportunities. Kerry referred to us not trying diplomacy and "rushing into war," even though we did try diplomacy for a long time and had a bunch of resolutions (sixteen maybe?), but Bush dropped the ball. There were a couple of other clarifications I was sure he'd make, but didn't.

Xequat ... I would just like to point out that Both Senator Kerry and President Bush are big-leaguers on 'the home team'. I think the analogy is a poor choice, and displays bias ... which you're entitled too. Bias, and its elimination is one of the reasons debates are held.

 

[michaeledward]

Regarding the debate, I'm slowly reading through the transcript.
My opinion so far?
Tie. Neither one really said anything thats 'new' to me.

Bob, I often prefer to review the transcript, rather than watch the event. In this instance, I think watching the debate may also prove beneficial. If you just read the transcript of the 1st debate for Bush Gore, you would miss the 'Gore Sigh', which really, really hurt Gore. Just a couple of thoughts, that you may only get from video.

• there were some silences from the President that seemed to go on for 10 or 12 seconds. Man, was that a long time.
• Senator Kerry sometimes seemed to be struggling to fill in the entire answer / response time.
• President Bush sometimes looked a little bit annoyed at having to participate.
• President Bush sometimes seemed flusted by the question and just rolled back into his 'mixed-message' vamp. (We'll see how that plays in the media).
• Senator Kerry, who drew the first question, was a bit off balance for the first 20 minutes or so.

In my estimation, this debate was won by Senator Kerry on the question directed to Senator Kerry, "If you win the election (or if you are re-elected President Bush) What will be the biggest threat facing the United States on the day you take office?" By this question, the Senator had found his debate footing. His experience on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, his knowledge of this topic (his response was Nuclear Proliferation), and his understand of how this plays into the 'War on Terror', put President Bush on the Mat .... and the continued to run the Dance of Death Extention on him.

Reviewing the 'Insta-Polls' as of 8:00 AM Friday.
MSNBC - Bush 34% - Kerry 66% - 928,000 votes
CNN - Bush 20% - Kerry 75% - Undecided 5% - 283,000 votes.

Also, I watched this debate on CSPAN ... which, for the entire debate, had a split screen that showed both candidates for the entire time. It was great.

 

[Cryozombie]

Unfortunately, I was working last night...

We had the TV on, but I still took a lot of calls durring the debate so I missed a lot of it...

What I did see made bush look like a chimp, but also gave me a creepy feeling in my gut about Kerry... something... not right. (And no, its not just because of the John Kerry/Reanimator thing)

I cant put my finger on it... I hope to be able to focus on the other debates and see if I still get that feeling.

 

[michaeledward]

For those interested, much of the debate is availabe via 'streaming' on the internet.

I re-watched some of the debate on 'MSNBC's 'You Rate the Debate' page.
CSPAN has a video link available, although at the moment it doesn't seem to be working.
CNN has a video link but it requires a subscription.
News Hour on the PBS.ORG site has audio streaming available.

Even if you missed it live ... you can see or hear the debate in a number of places.

 

[loki09789]

Bush dropped the ball a few times for sure. Kerry was battling back on the "flip flop" issue so any shred of consistency he could instill was a win.

Bush dropped the ball on the regional stability issue of Iraq, details about terrorist organizations that have been engaged or taken down in Iraq that will no longer be capable of atrocities would have been a good support.

Countering the "N. Korea has Nuc's TOO" comment with the fact that there was a treaty/cease fire agreement with SHussein that was being ignored and accountability would have been effective. Acknowledging the fact that he/his advisors have changed the game plan to adapt to the changing conditions to counter the perception that there was "NO plan for Peace" would have been good...

His debate style is to refuse to acknowledge points and argue principles and accomplishmenst....viable, but he needs to put more tools in the tool box as a debator.

I, personally, thought Kerry slipped when he was pounding the 'global test' and international approval idea. As much as I am for foriegn cooperation, I have to agree with the Bush mentallity that American foriegn policy should not be based on 'international approval.'

I saw it as a draw myself on issues. Presence, Kerry stood tall, maintained a demeaner of leadership and Bush did his hunch and nod thing again...not the best impression to make with Haptics/body language.... BUT the nervous smiling and "I'm gonna answer that and have details, but first I want to...." from Kerry was just as bad, just not as constant as the hunch and slouch.

 

[michaeledward]

I, personally, thought Kerry slipped when he was pounding the 'global test' and international approval idea. As much as I am for foriegn cooperation, I have to agree with the Bush mentallity that American foriegn policy should not be based on 'international approval.'

"pounding" ?

The wording Kerry used was indeed, unfortunate. No doubt we will hear it in the commercials. But I do not think that one use of the words 'global test' could constitute a 'pounding'.

"Hard Work". How many times did the President use that phrase? "Mixed Messages".

Senator Kerry did talk about building alliances. Recall that you state you are 'for' foriegn cooperation. Of course that brings us back to the 'Respected in the World' language from the DNC.

Personally, I was disappointed that Kerry answered that 'Pre-Emptive' war was something he would not give away. Prevention is, to me acceptable. Pre-Emption is not.

Mike