Chinese Goju/RVC

stone_dragone

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I just took advantage of Blackbelt magazine's VHS clearance sale ($2.95 per tape) and bought the five part series from Ron Van Clief. I bought them for informational purposes, but not to learn the system from tapes. Holding my own opinion in check for a few minutes, I was wondering:

1. Anyone out there study this brand of karate?
2. Anyone else have the tapes? If so, what is your opinion on the system as presented?
3. Has anyone seen this form outside of UFC IV ?
4. Does anyone have information on RVC's training (i.e. how long he studied each system --Jujutsu from Moses Powell, ninjutsu from Ron Duncan, etc-- that he claims prior to synthesizing Chinese Goju)?

I did a search on MT but couldn't find anything substantial.

Thanks.
 
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stone_dragone

stone_dragone

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Just re-introducing the question...and adding another...does anyone have a link to streaming video of the RVC UFC fight.
 

D.Cobb

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I could be wrong, but I am under the impression that before it was called Goju Ryu in Okinawa, the Chinese name for it was RoRoKo.

If anyone knows otherwise, then I'm happy to be enlightened.

--Dave
 

Jin Gang

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That sounds like a lot of baloney. I don't know about any UFC fights, but there doesn't seem to be anything Chinese about this guy's style. Ryuru ko is the Okinawan way of saying the name of a famous Chinese martial arts teacher who is said to have instructed Higashionna Kanryo, one of the "fathers" of naha te, in possibly white crane style kung fu. Higashionna was one of Chojun Miyagi's teachers, the founder of goju ryu.

Did a little google search.
Mr. RVC looks like a tough guy, and I'm sure he knows some stuff, but this sort of style label is misleading and pointless. If it's Chinese, then use the Chinese words for hard and soft (in whatever dialect you want). I think he's calling it Chinese trying to cash in on the popularity of kung fu. The only Chinese teacher mentioned on his site is Leung Ting, a Wing Chun teacher. The rest of his teachers are American Goju guys, (like Peter Urban). American Goju is dervied from Japanese Goju through Gogen Yamaguchi, which is a little bit different from the original Goju Ryu of Okinawa (which is has a little in common with some Chinese styles from Fukien). American Goju is probably as close to American kempo karate as it is to Okianwan Goju Ryu, in style.

He is also listed as a member of the world sokeship council. This is a bad sign. These "councils" are a joke that anyone can join for a fee. It gives you a piece of paper and a title that you have payed for, in order to trick people into thinking you are widely recognized as some sort of master.

I think he's probably a tough guy who might be a good fighter (I found out that he lost his match in the UFC 4 against Royce Gracie via submission, but at least he got in there and went for it).
I think there is very little "Chinese" in his system. It might be "goju" in the sense that there are hard and soft principles combined, but it would have little in common with Okinawan goju ryu. There's no telling how long he actually trained with any of those teachers listed on his site, and what he actually learned. However, this is the case with a lot of teachers.
If it's only 2.95 for a tape, what the hell. Something doesn't need to be ancient and traditional to be effective, and maybe he's got some good skills.
 

still learning

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Hello, Did a short research here: Ron Van Clief born on Jan25, 1943.

Was also a US marine. He did over 14 movies, stunts in 5 others.

He fought full-contact and non-contact karate tournments.

He study under "Goju-ryu" Mr Peter Urban, train w/ Frank Ruiz,Moes Powell.
Ron Van Clief also study "Wing Tsun".

1971 Started his own style" Chinese Goju" -(10th Degree) In the 4th UFC at age 51,(0ldest person to do so) , he challenge Royce Gracie who won with a rear naked choke.

Ron Van Clief is known as the " BLACK DRAGON".

Aloha,
 

still learning

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Hello, (MORE) ..He was in many more movies over 14 for sure.

Shidoshi Ron Clief, enter more than 900 martial art tournaments, 8 times United States Champion, 5 times World Champion.

Has over 25 schools in 18 countries

ALSO A POLICE OFFICER TOO!

I am sure alots more can be add too....


Aloha,
 
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stone_dragone

stone_dragone

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The responses that I am getting show that everyone here seems to be in the same boat that I am in...we can all find information about who he studied under in the 70's and what he did before then, but as to what rank he earned under Urban and Ruiz and what ranks he holds in other styles other than "dan rank".

I have no intention of taking anything away from the man's accomplishments, but he seems to have made a good and big name for himself by what could have been a jump from 3rd degree to 10th Degree just because he felt like it.

I have found no information available on any of his ranks other than obscure references to "dan rank/black belt rank or equivalent in ..." and a few names dropped.
 

searcher

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Why don't you just e-mail him and ask for more specific information. I remember watching him in the UFC fight he had. And there are many that consider him a master. I am not taking his side or anything, but it may be easier to get answers from the source.

I wonder if his jump up in rank has anything to do with the time around which the belt system came into use. It had not been around very long when he was coming up throught the ranks. Just a random thought.
 
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stone_dragone

stone_dragone

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Why don't you just e-mail him and ask for more specific information. I remember watching him in the UFC fight he had. And there are many that consider him a master. I am not taking his side or anything, but it may be easier to get answers from the source.

I wonder if his jump up in rank has anything to do with the time around which the belt system came into use. It had not been around very long when he was coming up throught the ranks. Just a random thought.

Good question and possibilities...I was just thinking that myself shortly after I wrote my last post. I might try to contact him so that I can be a better informed martial artist.
 

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