Who is YOUR neighbor supportin'?

[Flatlander]

Guys, is this thread about who you're supporting, or who your neighbour is supporting?

 

[hardheadjarhead]

Guys, is this thread about who you're supporting, or who your neighbour is supporting?

Sorry.

Kerry. If you couldn't guess.

My neighbor and her live in lover are also supporting Kerry. They just moved in. I believe their dog Henry is also a Democrat. He has a gentle, honest look to him.

Could anyone make up a poll on this? Or has there been one?


Regards,


Steve

 

[Cryozombie]

Whos for letting the illegal aliens stay? Thats probably who my neighbors, living 7-8 families to a 2 bedroom house, are voting for.

 

[michaeledward]

Whos for letting the illegal aliens stay? Thats probably who my neighbors, living 7-8 families to a 2 bedroom house, are voting for.

I think that would be Bush. He would like to legalize all current undocumented workers in the US (Good for Agri-Business).

Kerry is for 'earned' legality for undocumented workers. That means some sort of litmus test for those here.

Today I heard it took Bush 3 & 1/2 years to get to his policy. Kerry stated he would develop and announce his program in the first 4 months of his presidency.

But, that was a rhetorical question, right?


Also ... Robert ... While I agree that our neighbors can support whomever they would like to support, and it is none of our business, the other side of the coin is who is 'purchasing access' to our policy makers should be public, shouldn't it?

Mike

P.S. ... I sent 100 bucks to Granny D for Senate. ... I kept meaning to send some cash to Kucinich, but now that he's gone with Kerry ... I think I'll just send a vote ....

 

[shesulsa]

Okay - my neighbor to the north is voting Democrat all the way. My neighbor to the east is voting Republican all the way. And my neighbors to the west and south don't vote because they feel disenfranchised and believe the vote to be fixed and fraudulent.

 

[lonecoyote]

Well,this information being out there is scary, because some of us live in areas where it seems like we are the only ones who support the candidates we do. I'm a democrat who lives in an ultra conservative part of the country. Conservatives in some parts of the country probably feel the same way. We keep our opinions to ourselves, don't bring up politics in normal everyday conversation and grind our teeth a lot because it seems like the whole world, at least the one we see in our daily life, no one sees things our way. So I don't want people knowing who I contribute to. And I won't put on a Kerry bumper sticker, because I know that I'd walk out of the coffee shop and meet up with some jerk who felt that he had to set me straight about America. Republicans in some parts of the country probably feel that could happen to them too. We're too divided right now, not willing to listen to each other, too intolerant, for this information to be public.

 

[michaeledward]

Well,this information being out there is scary, because some of us live in areas where it seems like we are the only ones who support the candidates we do. I'm a democrat who lives in an ultra conservative part of the country. Conservatives in some parts of the country probably feel the same way. We keep our opinions to ourselves, don't bring up politics in normal everyday conversation and grind our teeth a lot because it seems like the whole world, at least the one we see in our daily life, no one sees things our way. So I don't want people knowing who I contribute to. And I won't put on a Kerry bumper sticker, because I know that I'd walk out of the coffee shop and meet up with some jerk who felt that he had to set me straight about America. Republicans in some parts of the country probably feel that could happen to them too. We're too divided right now, not willing to listen to each other, too intolerant, for this information to be public.

So much for a 'Free Country', eh ?

Thanks for contributing - Mike

 

[Brother John]

Yep, teachers and unions. Sources of All Evil in the universe. It's the damn teachers who keep demanding that kids actually learn stuff--those darn Judy Blume books! that dratted evil-lution!--and the damn unions that have the unmitigated gall to--get this!--demand living wages, affordable health care, a safe working conditions.

Those bastards. If they'd just leave the corporations, the fundamentalists, the wealthy, and Rupert Murdoch alone, a man could enjoy himself a little.

I've no idea who my neighbor's supportin'. I figure it's none of my beeswax.

Wow...
a tad bit touchy there Robert?
He didn't say anything that's not just plain fact.

take a breath Rob...
it's gonna be Okay.
:ultracool

Your Brother
John

 

[Brother John]

I believe their dog Henry is also a Democrat.

That's a new demographic.
I knew those Dems could motivate their grass roots base.
:ultracool

Your Brother
John

 

[deadhand31]

Instead of "holding your nose" while voting for Kerry, how about looking at his record, and being proud to cast your vote:

He would close the loopholes that reward corporations taking jobs overseas.
Voted YES on adding sexual orientation to definition of hate crimes.
Voted NO on prohibiting same-sex marriage.
Voted YES on prohibiting job discrimination by sexual orientation.
He would FULLY FUND the mandated education standards
He has voted in favor of every initiative to improve the environment
He has voted in favor of almost every elections reform measure.
He's against cutting or privatizing social security.
He supports separation of church and state.
He has a distinguished military record.
He's actually worked for a living.
The difference between Kerry and Bush is so obvious, let's stop the "nose-holding."

1. Corporations are always going to take their jobs overseas, because it's cheaper.
2. The concept of a hate crime is horribly biased. If a black man attacks a white man, it's not a hate crime, but no matter what happens, if a white man attacks a black man, then it is.
3. I have no opinion on.
4. Alot of republicans even voted for that.
5.He also voted against the current educational standards.
6.Not aware of these reform measures, i need to look into them.
7.If you're allowed to take what's being put into social security, and stick in inot a RothIRA, you won't NEED social security. Last time I checked, not having to depend on the government is a good thing.
8.Faith based initiatives and treatments have been shown to be cheaper and more effective. Noone is forced into them. They go voluntarily.
9.Distinguished? What planet are you living on? The vast majority of veterans in his own company have said they wouldn't trust Kerry to be president. He hasn't released his military records, and one of his former Commanding Officers stated why: on one of his evaluations, it was writtent that he "needed constant supervision". He also flipped off a veteran in front of the memorial, but for some reason the media didn't want to report that.
10. Worked??? He married an heiress to the Heinz fortune!!!

 

[deadhand31]

Sure...we're going to have to pay for it through taxes...but once we start taxing big businesses and the rich like they deserve to be taxed...which is their fair share...it ought not be that big of a problem.
e

Umm, just want to let you know, the richest 2% pay for HALF of the nations taxes. Would you like to have their percentage of taxes taken out of your paycheck? You know, to do your fair share?

 

[michaeledward]

Wow...
a tad bit touchy there Robert?
He didn't say anything that's not just plain fact.

What exactly is a 'plain fact'?

I can understand the teachers. The teachers union tends to go liberal. They're also peeved at the no child left behind act. Because of the vouchers being instituted, teachers have to work harder to make sure that the students actually learn something. They also don't want to have their jobs on the line if a student ends up doing a better job at a private school, while costing the taxpayers less money.

Unionized teachers often support the Democratic party. While there are a wide variety of views within both political parties, it is a 'plain fact' that teachers "go liberal". Yes, many professional educators are upset with the No Child Left Behind act .... possibly because it has become an 'Unfunded Mandate' ... something I used to hear about from Republicans. Hmmm. And, as others have pointed out, the certainty of the 'plain fact' that private schools cost taxpayers less money can also be questioned.

As for laborers, well, unions in general tend to go liberal. I, myself, have never been one for unions. They benefit the people who want to work the least the most. Unions can bring about good things, but they take things too far. You're not allowed to fired slackers because they've been there longer, you can't send job descriptions to doctors so they know what someone has to do at work, and they have no financial accountability to anyone.

It is also a 'plain fact' that liberals don't want to work, which is why they form unions. And collective bargianing is really about controlling all the money in the country without any accountability. Thank God for Wal-Mart.

As for self-employed people, why the hell would they go with Kerry? He's a guy who votes for every damn tax increase and tried to put a 50 cent a gallon tax on gas. A self employed person could expect a lower profit margin with Kerry.

And it is a 'plain fact', that Kerry is going to set price controls on independent businesses to control profit margins .... Free Market be damned. Self-employed people don't need to find ways to become more efficient, thus lowering their costs. Nor should they be able to set prices for goods and services to determine their profit margins. Kerry, will take care of all of that for us.

It is a "PLAIN FACT".

Mike

OK ... sorry about the sarcasm .... what deadhand31 said was not 'plain fact', it was spin. Certainly, he is entitled to his opinion, as are we all. But facts are not generalizations ... and generalizations are not facts.

 

[Flatlander]

But facts are not generalizations ... and generalizations are not facts.

That's a fact.

 

[hardheadjarhead]

9.Distinguished? What planet are you living on? The vast majority of veterans in his own company have said they wouldn't trust Kerry to be president. He hasn't released his military records, and one of his former Commanding Officers stated why: on one of his evaluations, it was writtent that he "needed constant supervision". He also flipped off a veteran in front of the memorial, but for some reason the media didn't want to report that.

A "vast majority"? Cite the poll.

Did you see the Democratic Convention last night? Two boat commanders from his squadron, the living members of his crew and crew members of other boats appeared on stage with Kerry. The Special Forces lieutenant whose life he saved spoke. He won the nations third and fourth highest awards for valor (Silver Star, Bronze Star)...and these awards had to be submitted by one of his former commanding officers. Kerry didn't put himself in for these medals.

As for releasing his records, you're about three months behind the information loop:

"APRIL 21--John Kerry was "unofficially credited" with killing 20 enemy fighters during his five months in Vietnam, according to military records just released by the Democratic presidential candidate's campaign. The body count reference is included in a glowing 1969 Navy report that noted Kerry, a 25-year-old junior grade lieutenant, exhibited "all of the traits desired of an officer in a combat environment." The Navy document, a copy of which you'll find below, was among hundreds of pages released today by the Kerry camp in response to requests from reporters and criticism from Republicans demanding full disclosure of the U.S. Senator's military record."

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0421041kerry1.html

10. Worked??? He married an heiress to the Heinz fortune!!!

He was a successful prosecutor prior to being a Senator. He was a Senator prior to meeting Theresa. Her late husband introduced SENATOR Kerry to Theresa...after he died, the two hooked up. Are you even aware how long they've been married? NINE YEARS. Do you think he was panhandling prior to that?

Here's his work record:

1972-1978; Assistant District Attorney, Middlesex County, 1977-1979; Attorney, 1979-1982; Massachusetts Lieutenant Governor, 1982-84; U.S. senator, 1984-present.

Given that they met in the early nineties, I think it safe to say you're buying into some pretty silly myths here.

Regards,

Steve

 

[Brother John]

Hey Steve
Isn't it true that this isn't the first wealthy heiress that J.Kerry has married?
Thought I'd heard to the contrary.

Also: What constitutes a "successful" prosecutor? Just wondering. Didn't know how long he was one or what it is about his time as one that makes him 'successful'.

honestly just wondering.

Your Brother
John

 

[rmcrobertson]

One of the things this thread shows is what we all already know: some folks WILL NOT look at reality or at history. They won't do it. They'll throw moral accusations. They'll make ridiculous claims ("faith based initiatives are cheaper...people go voluntarily"), which they'll never question. They'll insult and attack anybody who doesn't agree with 'em--if it's politics, the usual attack is that you're, "un-American"--and then turn around and accuse you of creating social turmoil.

It won't surprise me a bit if Bush ends up re-elected, and I'll tell you why. People vote for Bush because they're scared: they're scared of the way the country is changing (as it always has) demographically, and they prefer the constant race-baiting to an understanding of who their fellow Americans really are. They're scared about their jobs (and they probably should be), and they don't want to see the contradictions between the economics in which they believe and what those economics do to people, communities and countries. They're worried about what they see as moral collapse because they've been encouraged to look at history completely unrealistically, because this best suits the purposes of conservative politicians. They're scared about their health--and they should be--but they don't want to consider what's happened to their environment because of our economic system, they don't want to consider diet and exercise and stress reduction, and they don't want to admit that other people need care too.

What's worst about the Republicans, these days, is their absolute denial of the social contract--they may play images of America, but they advocate policies that tear the country apart. They may yell about morality, but every time you turn around, these guys are getting caught cheating and lying about their companies' finances. And always--the market, the market, the holy market.

I suspect Bush will end up re-elected. It's the politics of fear, of race, of greed, of ignorance.

I just wish the Democrats could do a little better. Any time your left wing's represented by Dennis Kuchinich (a granola fascist if I ever saw one) and Howard Dean (a weird and creepy shrieker), you're in trouble.

Hillary's looking better and better, since there's no chance anybody like Tom Hayden, Tim Wirth, Bob Kerrey, or Barbara Jordan will make it.

 

[Brother John]

What exactly is a 'plain fact'?

Unionized teachers often support the Democratic party. While there are a wide variety of views within both political parties, it is a 'plain fact' that teachers "go liberal". Yes, many professional educators are upset with the No Child Left Behind act .... possibly because it has become an 'Unfunded Mandate' ... something I used to hear about from Republicans. Hmmm. And, as others have pointed out, the certainty of the 'plain fact' that private schools cost taxpayers less money can also be questioned.

It is also a 'plain fact' that liberals don't want to work, which is why they form unions. And collective bargianing is really about controlling all the money in the country without any accountability. Thank God for Wal-Mart.

And it is a 'plain fact', that Kerry is going to set price controls on independent businesses to control profit margins .... Free Market be damned. Self-employed people don't need to find ways to become more efficient, thus lowering their costs. Nor should they be able to set prices for goods and services to determine their profit margins. Kerry, will take care of all of that for us.

It is a "PLAIN FACT".

Mike

OK ... sorry about the sarcasm .... what deadhand31 said was not 'plain fact', it was spin. Certainly, he is entitled to his opinion, as are we all. But facts are not generalizations ... and generalizations are not facts.

Thanks for saying "sorry about the sarcasm", that makes a difference.

Guess I've always thought that it was generally accepted fact that the NEA is liberal and almost always supports the Democratic party and not the Republican party. Do you know of a NEA group that does the opposite?? I don't.

You yourself said that the teachers are, in general, upset with the "No Child Left Behind" act.

It is also a 'plain fact' that liberals don't want to work, which is why they form unions.

This I didn't know. The liberals I know almost all have jobs and do well at them. I don't think that political persuasion goes hand in hand with one work ethic or the other. BUT: I do believe that unions end up having the effect of defending workers who have little to NO work ethic...just becuase they've been there a while.
I also agree with his point that unions are a mixed deal, producing some good and some negative effects. Is this not true???

And it is a 'plain fact', that Kerry is going to set price controls on independent businesses to control profit margins .... Free Market be damned.

One someone is "going to do" isn't a fact, it's a promise.
Polititians from both sides of the isle are notorious for breaking those.

Maybe these are generalizations as you say. So be it.
They are generally true.

Your Brother
John

 

[Cryozombie]

But, that was a rhetorical question, right?

Nope. I really was wondering what their stands on this issue were. I knew Bush was for it, didnt know what Kerry thought... and yeah, I was being sarcastic about my neighbors, although truthful.

 

[PeachMonkey]

Umm, just want to let you know, the richest 2% pay for HALF of the nations taxes. Would you like to have their percentage of taxes taken out of your paycheck? You know, to do your fair share?

Your idea of "fair share" is kind of skewed.

The richest pay a FAR tinier share of their total income in taxes than do anyone else.

Wage earnings make up 71% of total personal income in the US, but taxes on wage earnings make up 88% of total federal personal taxes. On the other hand, investment income makes up 22% of US total personal income, but investment taxes make up only 11% of total federal personal taxes.

Guess which income group makes most of their income from investment income?

Over time, since the Reagan administration, the ratios of wage tax vs investment tax have continued to alter in favor of the wealthy. The wealthy retain more and more of their income all the time. Is that "fair"?

Why isn't it "fair" that the people who benefit most from our society contribute most in order to perpetuate the opportunities and benefits of that society?

 

[PeachMonkey]

What's worst about the Republicans, these days, is their absolute denial of the social contract.

Republicans and Libertarians, on the whole, appear to deny the actual existence of the social contract. Their policies appear to advocate a return to some sort of neo-feudal society, where the hoi polloi happily scrabble at their hamster wheels, producing more capital and happiness for the wealthy few while still living fever-dreams of somehow being uplifted to those classes where they, in turn, can reap the labors of others.

The hardest part for me is telling which members of those groups actually recognize this and actively want that sort of society, and which simply buy into the vision sold to them by the right-wing political machine.