Which is more important socially?

Discussion in 'US Election 2008' started by ArmorOfGod, Sep 2, 2008.

  1. ArmorOfGod

    ArmorOfGod Senior Master

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    For a moment, let's put party politics aside for this question.
    Which is more signficant in terms of postive change for race and gender: a woman running as VP, or a black man (or really any race other than the usual white) running for president?

    AoG
     
  2. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    Both are significant; but the question is which "black man" or which woman.
    Sean
     
  3. tshadowchaser

    tshadowchaser Sr. Grandmaster

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    Both are significant as they both show a change from what has happened in the past
     
  4. arnisador

    arnisador Sr. Grandmaster

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    It's an interesting question in some ways and an unanswerable one in the end. I feel that the female issue has drawn more enthusiasm in the race due to the close Democratic competition; but because we've had a female V.P. candidate before, because the pres. candidates got there on their own charisma and records while the V.P. candidates were chosen by those winners, because the pres. contest is more important than the V.P. contest, and because in my opinion race is a more divisive issue than gender if one must choose between these two important social concerns, I definitely feel that Barack Obama's achievements are of much greater significance than Sarah Palin's important accomplishment.
     
  5. Empty Hands

    Empty Hands Senior Master

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    The black man running for President is more significant. First, the office of President is much more powerful and significant than Vice President. That makes Sen. Obama's potential victory that much more significant. Second, a woman running for VP on a major party ticket is not unprecedented. Geraldine Ferraro was the Democratic VP nominee over 20 years ago. Third, women in general do not have the sense of powerlessness and alienation from politics that much of the black community does. Therefore, an Obama victory may change attitudes and provide a more needed example to a greater extent than a Palin victory would.
     
  6. FearlessFreep

    FearlessFreep Senior Master

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    Considering there have been both woman and back heads of state, I don't think it means that much. It may something about American culture, but American racial and gender issues don't encompass human issues as a whole
     
  7. MA-Caver

    MA-Caver Sr. Grandmaster

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    I've been wanting to start a thread titled "President Obama Assassinated" in the study as a possible glimpse in to the ramifications of that event which many that I've talked to (here in the South) seem to feel will happen. Or at least an attempt or three. Some say he won't even get to say "I do" when he takes the Oath (IF he takes the oath)...
    If McCain wins and then dies from (a bullet, age, whatever!) then the Madam VP steps up unless some pig-headed (male) Sec. Of State says Noooo, we can't have that!
    Socially both are good as (already stated earlier) it will be a major change in how things used to be. The predominate white-boy hierarchy will no longer be... kinda like Professional Golfing.
     
  8. Darth F.Takeda

    Darth F.Takeda Blue Belt

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    Voting only because someone is black or a female is stupid.

    If a black man tells me he is voting for Obama because he is black and nothing else, he is a racist and an idiot.

    If a woman is voting for McCain/Palin because she is a woman, she is equally stupid.

    Smart people consider record, acheivments, politicol idology and what kind of leader they are.

    This year their are alot of stupid people planning to vote, I just find their is more stupidity on the left, but there is a good amount on the right.

    When a Libertarian, who is not a jackass when it comes to oversea's relationships and Military matters comes along, look out both parties.
     
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  9. mrhnau

    mrhnau Senior Master

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    I don't think any Sec. of State would be upset with a woman stepping up.

    Umm... to be frank, have the golf links been filled up with blacks now because of Tiger? Has viewership among blacks increased? I honestly don't know.

    fair enough

    as well as Elizabeth Dole, Hillary Clinton, Rev. Jackson and Alan Keys (whom I liked very much) for president. I'm sure I missed a few...

    However, since there are many more women in this country, the effected population would be much larger. Was Kennedy's presidency a validation of the Catholic community?

    AMEN!!!!

    we will see how it works out... blacks historically have not voted Republican, so unless Barack can encourage a lot of them to come to vote, things may not change too much racially. Now, if Palin can pull the Hillary vote, then we might see a nice upswing for the Reps. I think its kind of going to be a wash. Another close election. I think Barak will get out the black vote, but I also think a reasonable amount of women will cross the aisle.

    I'm ready for a legit third party candidate. Does not need to be Lib., but a decent amount of the population agrees with at least some of their party policies.
     
  10. girlbug2

    girlbug2 Master of Arts

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    Obama is the more historically significant candidate, for certain.
     
  11. crushing

    crushing Grandmaster

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  12. elder999

    elder999 El Oso de Dios!

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    Well, since race is largely an artificial construct, he's black because he says he is. :lol:
     
  13. crushing

    crushing Grandmaster

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    I thought that too, but if that were the case, why doesn't it apply to Tiger Woods? The media and people (because of the media?) have consistently given him a racial designation with which he doesn't seem to agree.

    There are just to many people and organizations whos power depends on continuing the 'one drop rule', from White supremists wanting to maintain their 'purity' to the NAACP who "bitterly opposed" the multiracial category on the census (see Tiger Woods link). So they invoke fear, uncertainty, and doubt to continue the ridiculous "largely artifical construct" as you so eloquently put it.

    Here is an interesting opinion piece I just ran across while looking up the phrase "post-racial".
     
  14. Big Don

    Big Don Sr. Grandmaster

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    According to King's "Dream" speech, the correct answer is both, or either, or neither...
    Uh, under that, Obama doesn't measure up so well, he has years long, sometimes decades long associations with some pretty unsavory people, and, like it or not, you are known by those you associate with. He associates with racists(Wright), terrorists (Ayers) and criminals (Rezko).
     
  15. Big Don

    Big Don Sr. Grandmaster

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    If that is the sole reason you have for voting for them, don't vote.
     
  16. Empty Hands

    Empty Hands Senior Master

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    Keating 5 anyone?
     
  17. celtic_crippler

    celtic_crippler Senior Master

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    Sigh...it's irrlevent really.

    The very fact that some are wrapped up on gender and race in the 21st century instead of the platform of the candidate is a sad reminder that we are no more closer to being "evolved" than we were in the 20th century.

    Sure, a female or non-white in office would in part demonstrate progress, but that should not be the determining factor of progress.

    There are way too many things clouding today's issues, the more garbage we can weed out in an effort to actually focus on what the issues are the better.
     
  18. Big Don

    Big Don Sr. Grandmaster

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    Gee, how does that refute Obama's cronies?
     
  19. Big Don

    Big Don Sr. Grandmaster

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    Fact is, he is also half white, but, the only mention he or his campaign have made of that is the "My grandma is an average white person" gaffe.
    Is he ashamed of one or the other? Does he think one or the other is more or less desirable?
     
  20. Makalakumu

    Makalakumu Gonzo Karate Apocalypse

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    The unfortunate thing about this statement is that a libertarian will never come along that supports our current foreign policy. If one actually take the time to understand the founding fathers and the Constitution of this country, one might realize this.

    How many people who swore to serve and protect actually knew much about the document in which they swore?123
     

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