What don't you like?

[tradrockrat]

what bothered me the most about how I was trained has to do with the distinct lack of grappling at the lower belts. To put it simply, in the ABA there is no requirement to learn any of it. I never showed a single takedown, choke, or even arm bar at any belt test - ever.

Now I was lucky, my instructor made me work out with wrestlers and taught me some naban and Python along with the standard curiculum, but to take an art that professes "practicality before beauty" and ignore the grappling seems stupid as hell.

Most practitioners get grappling from seminars and workshops, and if they really like it at blackbelt they begin to study the Python system.

Just doesn't sit right with me...

 

[tradrockrat]

Oh shoot, forgot my biggest issue of all!


Politics.


Stupid, stupid politics.

 

[Marginal]

The ****ING politics!
Can't we all just get along, and get it done?

Too true.

 

[kidswarrior]

1. McDojo bait and switch: Oh, by the way, at XXXX level everything goes up in price, testing is by __________ whom you've never even seen, and who you later discover is an emotional 3-year-old--and a sexist, to boot, passing the women in far shorter testing-time and far easier conditions.

2. Incredibly silly 'self-defense' techniques of said McDojo.

3. Eventually taking up cross training, and running into ageism. Guess to some I look younger than my chronology, so when studio owner realized my true age (and I guess gave up on me as a possible 'disciple/inheritor' of the art), as well as my not readily accepting the art as crystallized in its 1960s form, when the world was very different--people could get into fights and no one got shot, or even sued!), everything went south--promotions dried up, etc.

Either that, or I'm just whiney today. :waah:

 

[morph4me]

One of my pet peeves is doing a technique from a different position and calling it a different technique so you can claim to have "hundreds of techniques" when you have 20 recylced ones.

 

[Shaderon]

One of my pet peeves is doing a technique from a different position and calling it a different technique so you can claim to have "hundreds of techniques" when you have 20 recylced ones.

Yes this gets me a bit too.... and the Politics!!!! I don't mind the respectful bowing and the respectful calling each other Sir and whatnot, but..... sheesh!

 

[LawDog]

Shaderon,
In your last posting I am not sure of what you mean by "Politics".

 

[tellner]

Shaderon,
In your last posting I am not sure of what you mean by "Politics".

Consider yourself to be the most blessed and fortunate of men if you haven't had to wade through the typhus-laden malarial open sewer of martial arts politics :shrug: For a practice which is supposed to make people peaceful, philosophical and enlightened martial arts sure seems to bring out the egos, the petty third grade playground dynamics and behavior that would surprise you in an emotionally disturbed mugger.

 

[HKphooey]

I would have to say the politics. I like learning from different sources. I do not like for anyone to tell me another person's views are BS or not the "right way".

 

[dturtleman]

the fact that, once i become a black belt ( if i'm fortunate enough), i may feel a need to take boxing, in order to know how to punch.

 

[LawDog]

Tellner,
Thanks for the reply. Your right about my lack of envolvement in martial arts politics. The group that I am actively involved with is run much like a family. The last time that I was exposed to this "politic's thing" was back during the eighties when I was a member of the old IKKA.
It has been so long since I had been exposed to this b.s. I was not sure if it's early trendy meaning had been changed. I personally have a major problem with the many who have these huge ego's.

Everyone has of some level of ego, what matters is if they extend it beyond their own inner self and project it into the faces of others.

 

[kidswarrior]

I personally have a major problem with the many who have these huge ego's.

Everyone has of some level of ego, what matters is if they extend it beyond their own inner self and project it into the faces of others.

Well said, LawDog.

 

[kidswarrior]

1. McDojo bait and switch: Oh, by the way, at XXXX level everything goes up in price, testing is by __________ whom you've never even seen, and who you later discover is an emotional 3-year-old--and a sexist, to boot, passing the women in far shorter testing-time and far easier conditions.

2. Incredibly silly 'self-defense' techniques of said McDojo.

3. Eventually taking up cross training, and running into ageism. Guess to some I look younger than my chronology, so when studio owner realized my true age (and I guess gave up on me as a possible 'disciple/inheritor' of the art), as well as my not readily accepting the art as crystallized in its 1960s form, when the world was very different--people could get into fights and no one got shot, or even sued!), everything went south--promotions dried up, etc.

Either that, or I'm just whiney today. :waah:

And I left one off: learning an art billed as street defense, then being tested on point sparring (game of tag, but only to targets that I wouldn't bother with in street defense).

Why train in knife hands, spear hands, tiger rake, open tiger's mouth, palm heel, hammer fist, snake hands, immortal man, pinch and twist (as inner thigh) etc. etc., then be bound by boxing gloves to test? HUGE contradiction.

And why train in realistic street targets like eye rake/poke/gouge, groin rip or smash, all manner of neck and throat attacks, joint locks and hyperextensions, ankle and knee stomps/kicks, then be told these are off limits (of course!--couldn't really make them fair game), and you can only hit with hands encased in boxing gloves (as one GM said, I'd rather fight in hadcuffs, since I have at least the possibility of using much of my training). And the kicking--again only to select targets.

To me, this shows a serious disconnect in the overall strategy of those at the top.

PS: This is not a rant against sparring (Hey, I boxed--about 300 years ago, but still). If an art teaches and practices sparring, then that's certainly what you'd expect to be tested on. But you'd already know the rules, both spoken and unspoken, and would be expecting to show what you'd spent all your class time practicing and learning. Nothing wrong with that. But if you spend 99.9% of time learning one thing, then are tested on something else, that's when I have problem. (And I hate sparring because as the 'big guy', they almost couldn't wait till I punched to tell me every punch was too hard [which is also not true--pride myself on my control]). So, I don't train in those misguided places anymore. :ultracool Now I use the Kung Fu San Soo model of mixing it up. It's at least as rough as sparring, but more realisitic given the art(s) I'm learning and teaching.

 

[tellner]

Tellner,
Thanks for the reply. Your right about my lack of envolvement in martial arts politics. The group that I am actively involved with is run much like a family. The last time that I was exposed to this "politic's thing" was back during the eighties when I was a member of the old IKKA.
It has been so long since I had been exposed to this b.s. I was not sure if it's early trendy meaning had been changed. I personally have a major problem with the many who have these huge ego's.

Everyone has of some level of ego, what matters is if they extend it beyond their own inner self and project it into the faces of others.

Steve Plinck (my teacher) moved about as far to the upper left corner of the map as he could without actually getting his feet wet or learning to say "eh!" Part of the reason was to get far away from the idiocies and third-grade "I don't like him, and you play with him, so I don't want to play with you" BS. Sometimes I don't think he went quite far enough

The meaning hasn't changed. It's still egos that scrape against the walls as the owners walk into the room. The woofing is still there. One fairly well known guy nearly got himself killed dead for real some years back. I was at my first Silat teacher's house when this guy called him up and said "Tell So-and-so thus-and-such." After a round of "You know, personal communication is best. Here's his number," it got to "Did you have to get me out of the bath to say this?"

At that point the famous martial artist with lots of titles almost made a fatal error. He said "Well you wash your balls, and I'll wash my .45. I know where you live and when your old lady's home alone."

That was the sort of mistake a man should treasure on account of it might be the last one he makes. You DO NOT say this to a hillbilly, especially one who grew up in the middle of a generations long feud. They have an extremely limited sense of humor about threats to the family. We eventually got him sat down, but it took a little while to convince him that there was no need to do anything drastic.

Note: I know hunting someone down and shooting him would have been wrong and illegal. My first Silat teacher knew it. You know it. Everyone knows it. But that's one of those things that makes the law and primal responsibility to defend the family bump up against each other uncomfortably. And that wasn't the first or the last time that kind of crap happened. Is that in the same ballpark as the IKKA in the 80s? Or has the word changed?

 

[LawDog]

Tellner,
Home run.

 

[tellner]

Oy vey.

As you say, everyone has an ego. The hard part seems to be not letting an ego turn into an ego problem.

Some day I'm going to write a study that will get me a lot of death threats, personal attacks and outrage. It will outline the similiarities between the BDSM world and the martial arts. Ritualized props, clothing and behavior. Formalized exchange of power. Role playing. Dominance. Submission. The distinct roles of "top" and "bottom". Even safety signals. The question is, which group has a better handle on the distinction between fantasy and reality. It's not just the curmudgeon coming out. The commonalities really jump out when you look at it from the right perspective. And in both communities there is a lot of people who are more comfortable with the scene than everyday reality and have trouble separating the two.

 

[Kacey]

And in both communities there is a lot of people who are more comfortable with the scene than everyday reality and have trouble separating the two.

I can't speak for the BDSM community, but in the MA communities there are a lot of people who enjoy what they do with their "Ritualized props, clothing and behavior" because it is their way of dealing with "everyday reality" - a time set apart from the rest of their lives, when they can do something that is not part of "everyday reality", because it is not part of everyday reality.

Like any other belief system or activity, there are people who go to extremes, who let their belief in themselves and their own superior abilities (deserved or not) overwhelm the good sense one hopes their parents instilled in them - and there are plenty of people who find the good parts of what they do and who they do it with, in MA or any other activity, and devote their lives to making the world a better place in their own way... so that the extremists in their particular belief or activity can give the entire group a bad name - that being what I don't like about MA, except that it is, by no means, limited to the martial arts community - examples are rampant in religion, politics, professional and amateur sports, business... the list goes on and on.

 

[10,000 Hit Combo]

I hate girls that pick fights for me. I don't want to get hurt and I certainly don't want to hurt the other guy, espeacially if I have no beef with him. I can't understand people.
Oh yeah, the politics!

 

[qi-tah]

My biggest complaint is that I should have started before my mid 40's

Ooh yeah, can i relate to this one! It sucks that my knees are starting to crumble after 6 years of MA! Serves me right for getting into Capoeira first.

I love training ba gua and other CMA, but have to say i do find a few things perplexing/irritating:

1) Having yr teacher change just about the entire syllabus overnight just because he's started training with someone new.

2) Not enough free sparring to test out applications... and when we do have apps, i worry that there's too much emphisis on "counterfighting" techniques.

3) Lots of mystical Taoist stuff that you aren't sure of the validity of - trying to tally the efficacy of acupuncture etal with what i know about anatomy and physiology from a western point of view has led me to examine some pretty out there ideas... I just keep telling myself that things might happen, but not for the reasons that people tell you that they do. (Does that make sense?)

4) Did someone mention something about politics??!

 

[Adept]

I hate western martial arts students who try to out-asian the asians.

You know, having a Japanese flag in class, only speaking in Japanese, drinking green tea, and generally taking themselves very, very seriously. The sorts of classes where as much emphasis is placed on the bowing rituals as the fighting techniques.