Take Downs

[MartialArtist]

Originally posted by akja
I don't agree with that 100%. You say "proficient in any one system," that is way to general. Most systems are not that good against other systems and proficient does not mean mastery.

To defend against other styles without knowing anything about them, you would need to be more than "proficient." That is my take. You may consider proficient to be much better. But I think the early UFC's prove what I just said.

I have a JKD background and I'm training with a JKD guy that is throwing all kinds of stuff at me and our arts are similar. So I'm sure that you could undertand why I beleive what I am saying.

Although I do think that I see attacks coming at me pretty good, I beleive that the way that I see things is due to practicing in several systems over the years.

Nah

Say you're a boxer. Then you'll see attacks coming. If you make the transition to wing chun, you'll still see the punches coming.

And I wasn't aware that systems fought. You can't limit the style, which many people are doing. You might look at say, for the sake of example, TKD as ineffecient and incomplete. It's just high kicks they say. That's what I mean by limiting a style through sheer ignorance.

I met a wing chun guy at a seminar. I have very little wing chun experience. However, I had been training in combat TKD, boxing, and wrestling since childhood. Everything I did, the guy saw it coming. And I wasn't no slouch either, as I was very quick and hit hard at that age.

Just because one system doesn't have a certain technique doesn't mean one can't defend from it. To say that is stupidity.

 

[MartialArtist]

And if you bring the UFC into the mix... The UFC, even in its early days, was still a sport. However, many people countered and attacked people when they also had no experience working with X or Y technique. A sport wrestler isn't used to having kicks and punches thrown at him, but depending on the person, can very well defend themselves against it. A boxer can defend against kicks. In the UFC, many boxers had trouble with takedowns. But look at their backgrounds, they came from a purely sport background. Wrestlers coming from a purely sport background did better than boxers due to the environment of the fights. Plus, many of the sport wrestlers "used techniques outside of their system" as you put it. I mean, sport wrestlers don't punch. However, in the UFC, they did punch, they did pound on the ground, etc. That is what I mean.

 

[MartialArtist]

Originally posted by akja
I don't agree with that 100%. You say "proficient in any one system," that is way to general. Most systems are not that good against other systems and proficient does not mean mastery.

To defend against other styles without knowing anything about them, you would need to be more than "proficient." That is my take. You may consider proficient to be much better. But I think the early UFC's prove what I just said.

I have a JKD background and I'm training with a JKD guy that is throwing all kinds of stuff at me and our arts are similar. So I'm sure that you could undertand why I beleive what I am saying.

Although I do think that I see attacks coming at me pretty good, I beleive that the way that I see things is due to practicing in several systems over the years.

BTW, by proficient, I mean at least 10+ years of experience. Profiecience is actually understanding the principles of physics and biomechanics and knowing how to apply them. Truly understanding the principles opens up many techniques at your disposal as understanding the principle means you can vary certain techniques and kinda go with the flow. You can make quick adjustments depending on the person and so forth. Perhaps mastery was a better word.

 

[MartialArtist]

So what I'm exactly saying is that there is no rule book for fighting, nor are there any rule books for systems.

There is no rule that says wrestlers can't punch, boxers can shoot, etc. Systems of combat are not set like that. If you saw me in action, you probably wouldn't think of it as TKD/hapkido/yudo. Even with my backgrounds in wrestling and boxing, and if you knew that, you still wouldn't say it's this and that. Every combat art is complete, and whether you choose to accept it is up to you. Now the arts don't spend equal time in the ranges of fighting, but that's what makes them unique, it's not a question on superiority. When you see people fight, many times, you can guess their lineage, but it is never 100% correct. You can't view arts in a narrow view. You can't think of it as in this situation, X art will handle it this way and Y art will handle it this way. That is impossible and there are millions of variables. And within each system, there are styles within the system, and styles within that.

 

[James Kovacich]

Originally posted by MartialArtist
BTW, by proficient, I mean at least 10+ years of experience. Profiecience is actually understanding the principles of physics and biomechanics and knowing how to apply them. Truly understanding the principles opens up many techniques at your disposal as understanding the principle means you can vary certain techniques and kinda go with the flow. You can make quick adjustments depending on the person and so forth. Perhaps mastery was a better word.

My use of the word proficient in my posts could be defined as "well versed", not quite equal to mastery. I consider myself to be a proficient ground grappler but I am not a master grappler.:asian: