taijidao

[DaPoets]

This past weekend I studied taijijian extremely hard for days... eat, slept, and everything taijijian from Thursday night through to Sunday afternoon and practicing a lot everyday now to ensure I avoid my up coming issue. I am taking taijidao this coming weekend (it's just how the classes got schedule in these two differnet TTCS locations and countries....). taijijian I learned at the international center in canada, and now taijidao I'll be learning here in the states.

Question is, is there any advice on taijidao from anyone? Things I should keep in mind? Things to look for? Things to ask?

I'll have to try very hard to keep taijijian and taijidao as seperate as possibile and yet allow them to improve each other and my taijiquan.

Thank you all in advance!

 

[Flying Crane]

Jian and Dao technique is quite different, so you shouldn't be really confusing them. I expect the pattern of your forms will be rather different. It's not just a matter of picking up a different weapon and doing the same form.

Don't try to do too much too soon. If you've just learned something (jian), you might want to give yourself time to develop that and make sure you are solid with it, before you pile something else on top of it. Remember: the more you learn, the more you need to split your time between different things, so the less time you spend on each thing. It's just reality of training. So recognize what pace works well for you and don't try to do too much too soon.

 

[East Winds]

Flying Crane,

Great advice, as usual!!!

Very best wishes

 

[DaPoets]

Lucky for me my Taoist Tai Chi branch is inbetween where I work and live, so during the day around lunch time I have been stopping in to do a couple sword sets w/ one of the instructors there and then in the evening after the beginners class I teach I can do a couple more sword sets w/ a few other instructors. None of them are qualified to teach sword officially but we can at least all practice together.

 

[Flying Crane]

yeah, working in practice sessions whenever you can is a good way to stay on top of things.

I belong to a gym near my office. I often train in the morning before work, and during my lunch break. that's in addition to classes in the evenings and weekends. It can become kind of obsessive, but it works for me.

 

[ggg214]

i have never train with dao or jian. my master told me that these things are the extension of your body. i hope this sentence may give you some understanding about your practice.
i think your jian or dao is not as light as paper. some weight of your dao or jian may help your training a lot.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Jian and Dao technique is quite different, so you shouldn't be really confusing them. I expect the pattern of your forms will be rather different. It's not just a matter of picking up a different weapon and doing the same form.

Don't try to do too much too soon. If you've just learned something (jian), you might want to give yourself time to develop that and make sure you are solid with it, before you pile something else on top of it. Remember: the more you learn, the more you need to split your time between different things, so the less time you spend on each thing. It's just reality of training. So recognize what pace works well for you and don't try to do too much too soon.

yup that about covers it.

 

[East Winds]

Of course the main difference between Jian and Dao is that Jian has two cutting edges whereas Dao has only one. Therefore the techniques of usage are entirely different.

Yang Cheng-fu had some very wise words about learning forms.

"In the second instance are those who impatiently seek quick results, yet who are careless in their development. Before a year has passed they have already studied the hand, sword, broadsword and spear forms. Although able to imitate in rote fashion, they in fact never master the secrets. As soon as one checks their directions and movements, upper, lower, inner and outer, all come up short. If you want to make corrections, then you must amend each and every posture."

Very best wishes

 

[DaPoets]

I actually took that to heart... I chose to only study taijiquan for 12 years before doing another art. Others after only 1 or 2 years began to study luihebafa when it was obvious they needed more time to work on thier taijiquan.
This year (2008) is my year of tai chi. I have chosen to at least take all the workshops and classes that the TTCS has to offer and study diligently 6 days a week (taking sundays off to give my body a break and do house work). I have a lot of work a head of me and my road map has been described as very ambitious but after this past weekend, many came to me saying that based on how quickly I picked up taijijian I should be able to acomplish my goals for this year if I continue to work this hard. I will not do lazy tai chi, each move will have full meaning and intent.

Cheers!

 

[East Winds]

DaPoets,

Can I suggest you have a look at YouTube where you will find some superb Taiji as well as some truly appalling Taiji. Have a look at the different styles - Chen, Yang, Wu, Sun and some completely unknown styles!!! Compare them with TTCS and note the similarities as well as the differences. Apply the same logic to Sword and Sabre forms as well as looking at Xing Yi and Liu He Ba Fa (Lok Hup Bat Fat).

Incidentally I met Mrs Kwan in Colchester when she came over with Mr. Moy many years ago.

Very best wishes on your journey

 

[Xue Sheng]

DaPoets,

look at YouTube where you will find some superb Taiji as well as some truly appalling Taiji.

ain't that the truth

Apply the same logic to Sword and Sabre forms as well as looking at Xing Yi

There's a Xingyi Sword (Jian) form?

 

[Xue Sheng]

Sword and Sabre forms as well as looking at Xing Yi

I found a rare shuangshou jian form done by Xingyi and Bagua so I guess I answered my own question. But it is a 2 handed Jain not a single handed like we use in Taijiquan.

Is there a single handed Jain form that you have seen in Xingyiquan? If so I am very interested in finding out more about it.


EDIT:

Nevermind, a bit more webfu produced these as common weapons in Xingyiquan; Spear, Straight sword, Sabre, Large Sabre, Long Staff, Short Staff, Needles, Fuyue, Chicken-Sabre Sickle.

I knew about all but the Straight Sword, and I suspected thay XIngyi like Bagua used needles. But then again I am still not sure it is single handed Jain.

And I am going off post, sorry about that :asian:

 

[DaPoets]

Been doing that for years.... I'm very aware of what other styles look like and seen their applications countless times. I took classes under Mr. Moy as Buffalo is only an hour and a half drive from the D'Arcy st. branch in Toronto where he tought on Tuesday nights.

DaPoets,

Can I suggest you have a look at YouTube where you will find some superb Taiji as well as some truly appalling Taiji. Have a look at the different styles - Chen, Yang, Wu, Sun and some completely unknown styles!!! Compare them with TTCS and note the similarities as well as the differences. Apply the same logic to Sword and Sabre forms as well as looking at Xing Yi and Liu He Ba Fa (Lok Hup Bat Fat).

Incidentally I met Mrs Kwan in Colchester when she came over with Mr. Moy many years ago.

Very best wishes on your journey

 

[East Winds]

DaPoets

"Been doing that for years.... I'm very aware of what other styles look like and seen their applications countless times."

I would therefore be very interested in hearing your interpretation of other mainstream forms in relation to Taoist Tai Chi.

Very best wishes

 

[DaPoets]

I guess I don't speak of them often mainly because they are not my cup of tea at this point in time in my life. Learning the Taoist taijidao this past weekend was a great experience and I have to say that now I have to get a heavier sword becase that saber is many many times heavier lol. I think it was fairly easy for me to pick up taijidao actually as it's a shorter set than taijijian and for me it was really only learing like 3 new moves that were not in the taijiquan set (foot placement, stretching, turning, sitting standing etc...) but overall it has definately improved my taijiquan. I have lots of practice a head of me but I came out of this weekend being able to fluidly do the set by myself with good form. After I internalize it over the next few weeks I'll give a nice write up on my take on it, taijijian and compare it to other forms that I have seen out there.

Hsing-I is only taught once every 3 years now in the TTCS so since it's taught this summer in July I'm going to go ahead and take it... So that's my next big project and that will be from June 30th - July 4th at the temple in Orangeville. With as much as I have been practicing taijijian, I can do the set w/ a clear mind, w/ out thought of what move is next and I want to get to that point in the next week or so w/ taijidao so that my brain and body will just do the moves and I can then relax.

 

[Xue Sheng]

Hsing-I is only taught once every 3 years now in the TTCS so since it's taught this summer in July I'm going to go ahead and take it... So that's my next big project and that will be from June 30th - July 4th at the temple in Orangeville.

I am very interested in hearing about what the TTCS's Hsing-I (Xingyi) is like. I mean no disrespect and I am not trying to be critical but Xingyi is very much a fighting style and I am interested in what the TTCS take on it is.

I can see the Wuji, Zhan Zhuang, Santi and the other standing postures translating well but the rest is pretty geared towards fighting and I am wondering what it is like at TTCS. Also what forms 5 elements, Animal forms, spear, dao, jain, staff, etc.

I look forward to the post on Xingyi

 

[DaPoets]

I don't know much about xingyi yet as I have only seen it demonstrated a few times with in TTCS and we even had a delegation come to Toronto a few years ago from china that practices xingyi and even though they have been practicing it for many years they have only been taught the main moves and not the entire set as the moves are very powerful in their own right. I was told that the movements were exactly the same. TTCS hsing-i apparently hasn't been taught in 3 years as I found out over the weekend.

 

[DaPoets]

Hey East Winds, I ment to tell you that I have a video of Mrs Kwan teaching Hsing-I to her Feb 2000 class. It shows them doing it twice, once from one camera angle and the 2nd from the opposite angle. Apparently she had breast cancer years ago and ended up beating it. Her husband wasn't so lucky and passed away from a really bad stroke.

DaPoets,

Can I suggest you have a look at YouTube where you will find some superb Taiji as well as some truly appalling Taiji. Have a look at the different styles - Chen, Yang, Wu, Sun and some completely unknown styles!!! Compare them with TTCS and note the similarities as well as the differences. Apply the same logic to Sword and Sabre forms as well as looking at Xing Yi and Liu He Ba Fa (Lok Hup Bat Fat).

Incidentally I met Mrs Kwan in Colchester when she came over with Mr. Moy many years ago.

Very best wishes on your journey

 

[Xue Sheng]

have a video of Mrs Kwan teaching Hsing-I to her Feb 2000 class.

That I would like to see. I am VERY curious about the TTCS take on Xingyiquan.

 

[DaPoets]

Well it's on VHS... so that would actually be a project for me to get it onto my computer. I'll look into it in my spare time for you Xue Sheng.