Strength & Conditioning for the Martial Arts/Combat Sports

Discussion in 'Health Tips for the Martial Artist' started by Shai Hulud, Mar 15, 2015.

  1. Jenna

    Jenna Senior Master

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    To train to increase strength would be for me to imply I am insufficient exactly as I am to practice my Aikido right now.

    I do not wish to change to fit into my art.. that is an impingement on me..

    it was always for my art to be adaptable enough to fit me as I was as i am now and will be when older. (for each is necessarily different physiologically) and why should I change just because of the prescription of some art? Jx
     
  2. Jenna

    Jenna Senior Master

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  3. Tgace

    Tgace Grandmaster

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    Excuses....

    Look, I'm not saying anyone HAS TO do anything. Don't do any exercise other than your MA training. More power to ya. Different strokes and all.

    What I'm saying is the rationalization that conditioning/weight training can somehow be detrimental is poppycock.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2015
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  4. Dinkydoo

    Dinkydoo Purple Belt

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    I change up my workout every now and then. Right now i'm working to this weekly schedule:

    2 x 1.5 hour kickboxing class
    1 x 2 hour Mantis class

    Mondays - dumbbell routine 1:

    12kg
    3 x 10 rep sets with each arm

    Goblet Squats
    Dumbbell bench press
    Dumbbell Rows
    Skull Crushers
    Lateral Sides
    40 second side plank - one leg raised (once each side)

    Dynamic Stretching

    5k run or sparring

    Isometic Stretching

    Tuesday - kickboxing - combo of fitness/technique/sparring

    Wed - dumbbell routine 2:

    12kg
    3 x 10 reps each arm

    Bulgarian Split Squats
    Shoulder Press
    Diamond Pressups
    Dumbbell Curls
    Lying Rear Delt Raise
    30 second one leg L-Sit (once each side)

    Dynamic stretching

    5 minute rounds of shadow/bagwork

    Isometric Stretching

    Thursday - Mantis Training

    Friday - kickboxing class

    Saturday - anything i feel like
    Sunday - usually a rest day

    This is usually a good solid week of training and I'm quite happy with it. I swap things out if I want to work on something technique based but try to keep 2 weight sessions and 2 cardio sessions per week as standard. If I've been out at the weekend in the pub then I dont do much on Saturday/Sunday
     
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  5. K-man

    K-man Grandmaster

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    I know, and that's what it should be. Unfortunately my passport suggests otherwise. ;)
     
  6. jezr74

    jezr74 Master of Arts

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    The level of cardio practicing with the kids will vary, but it can be in bursts. My son has no concept of playing 1 on 1 in a quarter of a field, he insists on playing the full length, those days hurt.

    Most nights after HKD training, I'm a ball of sweat just trying to make it to my car to get home.
     
  7. jezr74

    jezr74 Master of Arts

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    Totally agree, my strength training has helped me out no end in my Hapkido. I had compound fractures to C3 and 4 in my spine about 5 years ago, and was told to take things easy. I had a lot of pain when I first started HKD, and was starting to adjust everything to not put pressure on my back or neck.

    As the HKD was making me stronger, I noticed my back pain was starting to be less common, so figured I'd start focusing on strength, has work wonders for me strengthening the back muscles and body in general. I have better control, better structure for falls, rolls and take downs now, and can grapple a lot longer giving me more time to work escapes or submissions since I don't tap out as quick. It definitely has not impeded my training but has made it better in my case.

    I have not adjusted my diet so am not bulking, just replacing fat with muscle, in fact my weight has barely changed, still sitting around 95Kgs, down from 100ish. But I think that's where it will stay most likely.
     
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  8. Jenna

    Jenna Senior Master

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    not sure if you are replying to me....i am not arguing with your argument.. I am only wondering why you are implying some MA practitioner -or- their martial technique is insufficient or not up to the job unless that person is able to benchpress 200% of their weight etc?

    what is wrong with them or the technique that more strength is required?? and if the technique is insufficient how does extra strength make it sufficient? Jx
     
  9. Shai Hulud

    Shai Hulud Purple Belt

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    Factor that I've yet to see a kangaroo of advanced age. :p

    Hallo, Jen. :) In combat sports we have what's called "The Trinity" of Technique, Power, and Speed. Execution of a technique without the appropriate discharge of force relative not only to your technique but also to your target is just point-sparring. Immediately I imagine Xingyiquan practitioners punching with all the force of a wet towel, or Taiji practitioners who square off with perfect form but strike and parry with all the intensity of Larry King. developing strength, aside from the good it does for your circulatoru, nervous, muscular and skeletal systems, bullet-proof your technique by reinforcing it with power.

    Also, when squaring off with someone of similar or highercaliber, sometimes speed and power can make all the difference, whether we like to admit that or not.:happy:
     
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  10. donald1

    donald1 Senior Master

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    usually if i can have a partner i like practicing arm and leg conditioning or kumite-bunkai... maybe weapon sparring :D i don't know nothing about supplement stuff i just go outside and decide... im going to work out for thirty minutes or for and hour and half. i always do stretches first :) even if its just ten minutes of stretches. probably practice a form or two(fix mistakes, get the memory better and make form more smooth) and run a couple miles 2-5 and anywhere between depending on how much i want to run
     
  11. Jenna

    Jenna Senior Master

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    Hallo back SH.. Speed and power yes I agree with you about this.. Though it seems the concensus here is to equate speed and power with deadlift strength or VOMax measurements.. Tell me why is it being missed that speed and power can come through refining technique and refining and refining.. train it.. feel it where it works or where it is inefficient.. refine it.. train it.. repeat repeat.. it simply CANNOT be about purely benchpresses and kettlebells??

    IN this case I concede I am out of step with the prevailing orthodoxy.. OK fine :) and but I would rather spend what time I have refining technique to match my physique than trying to alter my physique

    If your art requires that you become stronger than you are or fitter than you are (and does not quite like you as you are right now) well that is fine if it suits you..

    I am happy with my self and am happy my art PERMITS me to perform just as I am with no changes other than what is wrought in me by virtue of training its techniques..

    Like some one said.. horses for courses.. each to their own and happy to openly share opinion :) Jxxx
     
  12. Tgace

    Tgace Grandmaster

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    "Technique" doesn't provide speed or power. Your muscles provide all movement for your body. All technique provides is an efficient movement to make the most of what you have. Techinque is always going to be limited by the fitness/strength/condition of your body.

    Professional Football players (American) don't reach the peak of their abilities by playing football alone. Exercise and human performance development is pretty solid science.

    Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
     
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  13. Shai Hulud

    Shai Hulud Purple Belt

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    Weapon sparring for cardio. I should look into that.:eek:
     
  14. Andrew Green

    Andrew Green Grandmaster

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    I'm going to suggest a different way of looking at that. In any activity we do things repetitively and in specific ways. The goal of a S&C regime is to not just improve our ability to do those things, but to correct imbalances that occur from doing them and let us keep doing them with less risk of injury.

    For example, a lot of striking based arts tend to neglect pulling exercises. They will throw punches, do pushups for days, but largely neglect the back. This should be counter-balanced with rowing like exercises.

    S&C is not just about getting stronger at what you already do, it's about filling in the holes of what you are not doing as well and keeping your body balanced so that you don't injure yourself. A lot of injuries come about because a person has overtrained one muscle group while under training another, they move the wrong way and blow out there back, knee, or shoulder, pull a hamstring, etc. because the muscles on the other side couldn't hold up to what they muscles on the other side of the movement where trying to do.

    At the end of the day most people practice martial arts for health reasons, and IMO if you are not including some S&C into that you are not achieving that goal as effectively as you should be.
     
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  15. donald1

    donald1 Senior Master

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    helps to start off with foam :) wooden weapons tend to... hurt if you forget to block or get out the way :blackeye:. my favorite weapon for weapon sparring is the 6 ft bo staff :) i got my distance from the opponent thus giving me time to think about what to do:D
     
  16. Shai Hulud

    Shai Hulud Purple Belt

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    What's a skull crusher?

    And that's a hell of a weekly routine. What martial art do you practice?
     
  17. donald1

    donald1 Senior Master

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    to me it sounds like a choke hold :D but im pretty sure im wrong
     
  18. Tgace

    Tgace Grandmaster

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    Skull crusher....a triceps exercise.

    Lay on back on bench. Barbell held in narrow grip with arms extended like a bench press. Bend elbows till hands are just above forehead or head crown. Extend back to start position.
     
  19. Tgace

    Tgace Grandmaster

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    Medicine ball floor slams and burpee/heavy bag drills are other things I do.

    Burpee-punch combo
    Burpee-kick
    Burpee-elbows/knees
    Etc
    Etc
     
  20. Dinkydoo

    Dinkydoo Purple Belt

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    Why, thank you! Its been my routine since the beginning of January and I've been getting some results I'm happy with. I sometimes sub out one of the classes for more solo stuff at home to give me more time working techniques, depending on what I feel I need to give attention to. It generally stays at that level of intensity though, whatever the current focus is.

    Another poster has beaten me to it, Skull Crushers are a tricep exercise. I usually lower the weight for these and laterals. I'm pretty strong and can burn through a hell of a lot of pressups in a session but I still feel 12kg on each arm is too much for 3 sets of 10 right now.

    [​IMG]

    I did a traditional(ish) style called Lau Gar (its really a hybrid) for 2 years before moving onto 7 Star Praying Mantis. I've been doing that for around 2 years too but I've been cross training at a freestlye Kickboxing club for about 12 months now in attempt to address things I felt were missing from my training. We have instructors from a variety of backgrounds (Karate, Kickboxing and a bit of Grappling) that have input into the syllabus and lesson plan which makes it quite a varied and fun system to train in. I started training there as a means to develop my sparring and to pressure test my skills more but I absolutely love it, and its influenced how I now approach my MA training significantly.123
     

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