Shorin Ji Ryu

[Bob Hubbard]

Folks, I see tempers flaring and I think its time to take a step back n cool off.

Couple of things:

1- We're -way- off topic here.

2- We are dealing with differences in philosophy, and experience.

Kimpatsu is a traditional student of the Japanese arts. Both KenpoTess and nightingale8472 are students of an American art. The Japanese arts have a reputation of being stricter, and more conservative, whereas the American arts are more relaxed and laid back. Its a culture class. (As an example, in some Asian arts being hit with a stick by the instructor to aid your focus is common. In the US, at the least a lawsuit would arise. Both are right for where they are.)

I recomend everyone take a deep breath and relax.

I do not see any harassing going on. I see questions being asked and tangents resulting.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by Kimpatsu
Then why do you keep harrassing me?

Tony

Just between two guys on the internet.

Your approach here is brash and sometimes seems to seem arrogant. It is your way or the highway. Well to be honest if everyone took this attitude then no one would learn anything. Including here. The owner of the board could kick everyone out who disagrees with him. Yet he allows discussions to go on and on and on, and only steps in when he absolutely must, for the preservation of the board.

Yet, if I followed your rules and logic, you would not be a member here. You are not friendly and do not offer friendship. You demand respect, and when an issue is questioned you get upset and insult. SOmetimes people will even ask you more questions which you seem to take as a hostile action. No one is out to get you per se. You could just be friendly and continue to educate some or all of here on your art.

So maybe in my unasked for opinion, if just relaxed some of the attitude and came across as this is the way I was taught and this is what I know, and not like th rest of the world is totally wrong. Remember everyone at one time thought teh world was flat. Perceptions of evironment and or history can change depend upon which side of the story you are on. I understand that this may seem like we are lecturing to you. It is not my intention to tell you how to operate. As a mamber of this board I can share my experiences and the boards goals and desires and rules. Yet, you seem to be duplicitous. It is ok to make fun of others and to question tem yet it is a personal attack on you and your art when someone asks a question and does not have enough knowledge to phrase the question in the proper words. It is then your job and priviledge to educate them. If you expect them to phrase it in a humble manner that you expect, when they do not know how to ask the question humble other than the words they already have chosen.

I mean I could ask you to understand the term Friendly? You have this tendency to answer a question with a question. And while I like this method to get some people to open thier minds and think, I do not think it is always the best way to get your point across.

Also, you have a tendency of ignoring certain parts of posts or questions put to you. i.e. some of my previous posts. I do not understand this. In my mind if I follow your logic you are only being a troll, as you have called other people on this board. Yet, you have a presence here and elsewhere that shows this is most likely not the case. Yet, it is confusing to me, in your actions.

So, from one guy to another, sit back enjoy the ride, do not assume that everyone is out to get you, and just chill and relax and answer questions, and see how many new sheep flock to get a new education. This is just my opinion, you can ignore it as you have previously. Fine.

Enjoy!

PS: I will be out the next couple of days at the Local Ren-Fest (* Holly Grove Renaisance Festival *) so I am not ignoring you, I am just otherwise occupied.

:asian:

PSS: Or ignore the post in whole as Kaith has posted, My Apologies Bob I was typing as you posted also.

 

[Kimpatsu]

Rich, do not question my knowledge or understanding of Shorinji Kempo. I am the only Kenshi currently on these boards. As I pointed out before with quote from Richard Dawkins:

I am sometimes accused of arrogant intolerance in my treatment of creationists. Of course arrogance is an unpleasant characteristic, and I should hate to be thought arrogant in a general way. But there are limits! To get some idea of what it is like being a professional student of evolution, asked to have a serious debate with creationists, the following comparison is a fair one. Imagine yourself a classical scholar who has spent a lifetime studying Roman history in all its rich detail. Now somebody comes along, with a degree in marine engineering or mediaeval musicology, and tries to argue that the Romans never existed. Wouldn't you find it hard to suppress your impatience? And mightn't it look a bit like arrogance?

You can ban me if you like, but it won't make you right or me wrong. People can ask questions of Shorinji Kempo, but not tell me what the art is about. You want arrogance? Nightingale argues medicine with doctors! I find myself very imaptient with people who come here not to learn, but to lecture me on what my art entails. By all means, ask questions, but do not make statements. No one here is qualified to do so.

 

[Rich Parsons]

Originally posted by Kimpatsu
Rich, do not question my knowledge or understanding of Shorinji Kempo. I am the only Kenshi currently on these boards. As I pointed out before with quote from Richard Dawkins:

My Apologies

I never once sad anything about you not know about your art.

You keep quoting RIchard Dawkins, may I have a link to his works or to his books. so, I may understand the big picture

Originally posted by Kimpatsu

You can ban me if you like, but it won't make you right or me wrong.

I never said I was going to ban you. I apologize if you took it this way. I only ask for you to go back and read all of my posts, and see if you see intent. I thought not, yet i have been wrong before.

Originally posted by Kimpatsu

. . .
I find myself very imaptient with people who come here not to learn, . . .l

With Respect. On Impatience, I cannot help you.

 

[Kimpatsu]

If you want Dawkins, check out his website. I recommend his books, too. (I'm a big fan.)
Impatience is a problem; I'm like the teenage Anakin Skywalker in AOTC.

 

[D.Cobb]

Originally posted by Kimpatsu
No. Why do people who know nothing aboutthe subject want to argue with those who are qualified to have an opinion? I find that very galling. Like Richard Dawkins said:

How can a man who has never been a Shorinji Kenshi think he has something to teach me, when I've been a Shorinji Kenshi for 19 years this November? Does he disagree with his doctor about medical advice? His lawyer about legal advice? I've dedicated half my life to this art. I think he should accept that I know what I'm talking about.
Now, why don't you ask him the same question?

I'm afraid, I'm going to have to take Kimpatsu's side on this one. Those of you who are American Kenpo practitioners would hate it if someone who wasn't an AK practitioner came here and gave you a totally different history to the one set out by SGM Parker. All of a sudden after 19 years as a Shorinji Kenshi, Tony is told by someone not of his style that the history of his system as he knows it, is totally wrong. I think I said it in another post, you've got to try standing in someone elses shoes, no matter how tight they are, to know where they are coming from.

--Dave

:asian:

 

[kenmpoka]

Originally posted by D.Cobb
I'm afraid, I'm going to have to take Kimpatsu's side on this one. Those of you who are American Kenpo practitioners would hate it if someone who wasn't an AK practitioner came here and gave you a totally different history to the one set out by SGM Parker. All of a sudden after 19 years as a Shorinji Kenshi, Tony is told by someone not of his style that the history of his system as he knows it, is totally wrong. I think I said it in another post, you've got to try standing in someone elses shoes, no matter how tight they are, to know where they are coming from.

--Dave

:asian:

Mr. Cobb,

I did not tell Tony how to perform his techniques, nor did I offer any expertise. I do believe that I said that I am not familiar the details verbatim.

The different perspective on the history did not just come from my mind. It has been documented and I did offer a credible source for him to contact and dwell further in the matter.

At times the history is at best tainted due to political reasons. I do know and practice and exchange info with couple of practitioners of Shorinji Kempo, so I am familiar with the similarities. At certain level most arts differ in details only. The presence of Jujutsu, Aiki projections, randori, posturing and movements are apparent in the system and give clues to its history.

Additionally having a broad knowledge in various arts, I see similarities in the execution of the techniques that verify the history for me.

In any case I am done with this subject.

Salute,

 

[Kimpatsu]

The source you cited was NOT credible.
Only official Shorinji Kempo sources are credible. The So Doshin Monogatari (Story of So Doshin) is the official biography. If there is a discrepancy between the biography and your info, then your info is at fault.
Also, techniques can evolve independently and yet each other. Kind of like the evolution of the eye. Telling me that I'm wrong is just plain daft; hence Dave's post.

 

[James Kovacich]

Are there any opinions on Shorinji Ryu Jujitsu?

 

[Nightingale]

not sure...

Kimpatsu's statement that "only official shorinji kempo sources are credible" is extremely disturbing to me. does anyone else have information about this art?

 

[Sensei Manny]

If you please, it is very interesting the comparisons between Shorinji Kempo and Shorinjiryu Kenkokan styles of karate-do; as is the simularities with all the so-called "differnent" styles. To this forum, I would like to learn more about the various histories, add my two cents worth, and also give my opinions, as I am a practitioner of Shorinjiryu Kenkokan Karatedo, former student of Hanshi Masayuki Kisataka, and Shinan Wayne Donivan.
Point of interest: I am stedfast in training and maintaining the original Shorinjiryu Kenkokan System of Shiai (competition).

 

[jks9199]

If you please, it is very interesting the comparisons between Shorinji Kempo and Shorinjiryu Kenkokan styles of karate-do; as is the simularities with all the so-called "differnent" styles. To this forum, I would like to learn more about the various histories, add my two cents worth, and also give my opinions, as I am a practitioner of Shorinjiryu Kenkokan Karatedo, former student of Hanshi Masayuki Kisataka, and Shinan Wayne Donivan.
Point of interest: I am stedfast in training and maintaining the original Shorinjiryu Kenkokan System of Shiai (competition).

Can you tell us more about that competition system?

 

[repz]

not sure...

Kimpatsu's statement that "only official shorinji kempo sources are credible" is extremely disturbing to me. does anyone else have information about this art?

I took shorinji Kempo for a while. They seemed to be a secular group, not really mingling with outsiders (just my impression). They used to be very religious, which at the time of its creation suited it well since American GIs wanted to ban martial arts after ww2 in japan. Now they are about philosophy and have guidelines and rules. They have a tight knit group, and a large global association, so I could understand the comment of official shorinji kempo sources being only crediable, its an org founded by the founder and is still active with no splinter groups or infighting. It would be hard for someone outside their "family" to make comments about the founders history since the founder history is documented by them.

I considered it a good style, nice stand up with solid takedowns.