Practicing Both Sides

Discussion in 'Kenpo - (EPAK) Ed Parker's American Kenpo Karate S' started by cdhall, Aug 3, 2013.

  1. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    If I only had two hours to train I wouldn't be faffing around on a pole, I'm a martial artist not a pole dancer. A pole dancer trains on a pole to make them good at what they do. Martial artists train martial arts to make them good at what they do.
    If by 'headlock' you mean something like a RNC, not strength is involved in putting on of them on. I have no idea what a 'leg twist' is but if I want strong kicks...I train kicks, repeatedly, off both legs in front and back techniques.
     
  2. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    Yes, but that can mean vastly different positions depending on what's going on.
     
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  3. Kung Fu Wang

    Kung Fu Wang Grandmaster

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    I did say that one should train "general techniques" on both sides, but train "door guarding techniques" on one side only.

    May be I should explain what "leg twist" is here. The "leg twist" is not a kick. You use your leg to twist on your opponent's leg, break his balance, and take him down.

    [​IMG]



    Since the human bodies do not have such kind of "leg twist" strength during birth and through daily life, this "special" strength will require special training and to hang/twist on a tree/pole is one way to develop that strength. You can also use the single_head to develop it too.

    [​IMG]

    The issue is since you (general YOU) have to start from ground zero. If you spend 2 hours of your training time on one leg, you will get 2 hours of your result back on that leg. If you spend 1 hour of your training time on your right leg, 1 hour of your training time on your left leg, you will get 1 hour result back for your both legs. Since 2 hours of training result is better than 1 hour of training result, if you want to develop on both sides, you will need to invest twice as much training time. The decision will be yours.

    If we look at someone who had seriously trained this skill, we can see that the "training mark" is on his right foot but is not on his left foot.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2015
  4. Tez3

    Tez3 Sr. Grandmaster

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    'leg twist'...all done by 'special' strength alone eh?
    Nope, don't think so, it's technique, technique, technique all the way. I've done a lot of informal Judo ( my instructor was a Judoka first before he did anything else) so I don't know the names of throws but I'm sure a Judoka here will give the correct nomenclature for what you are describing. Judoka don't fuff around with poles, they practice the throws.

    A picture of a pair of feet proves nothing you know. What exactly do you train?
     
  5. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    What it should always mean, is that when doing thing on your blindside, you should actually turn your head, and point your dominant eye toward what you are doing. :)
     
  6. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    Can you explain how eye dominance matters in unarmed (or
     
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  7. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    If you keep your dominant eye forward, you can see perfectly well what is happening just to the outside, but you lose perspective of things that are happening way inside. The thing of it is, you can't do anything about what you can see on the outside, but move.
     
  8. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    Are you saying your peripheral vision is different between your eyes with regard to dominance?
     
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  9. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    Yes. Weak side enhances the peripheral at the expense of your true focus.
     
  10. Blindside

    Blindside Senior Master

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    I am still not understanding, so you are saying that peripheral vision is equal between dominant and non-dominant eye, but having input from both eyes weakens your ability to react to your dominant eye?
     
  11. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    I love the bowling analogy; so, if you aim with the opposite eye of the hand you throw with, you have a better view of the lane next to you than you do your own. So, unless you close your dominant eye when you switch sides, which is impractical in a fight, you will be aiming with the wrong eye. LOL
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2015
  12. BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG

    BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG White Belt

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  13. punisher73

    punisher73 Senior Master

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    I have seen this debate before in regards to Ed Parker's kenpo. Ed Parker's commercial model was big on "ideas" for exploration without hard and fast rules. One of the motion experiments was "Category Completion", this is where you see some bad ideas, just so you have a technique that completes the category. For example, you have a technique against a right punch. Then you have inside/outside, hands up/hands down etc. etc.

    As with a lot of the material (ie: many of the "2" sets) that was added in as filler material, practicing the self-defense techniques on both sides was filler material to give students more stuff to do.

    The system is designed for a right hand dominant person. The left side is the support side, while the right side is the dominant side. It doesn't mean that you don't use the left side, but it will always support the majority of action on the right side. Practicing on both sides can be a useful exercise, and some techniques may fit your style/approach better, but I think it is a waste of time to require the techniques to be done on both sides like that when they are designed for a purpose and there are others that address it from the other side already.
     
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  14. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    In a sense, the opposite side is a totally different technique idea.
     
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  15. punisher73

    punisher73 Senior Master

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    Yep, based on the premise that we are mostly wired for a dominant side and a support side. The other basis is that it is designed with a right hand dominant defender against a right hand dominant attacker.
     
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  16. BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG

    BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG White Belt

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    I am curious if you do up blocks or down blocks not using the lead leg as in zenkutsu dachi
     
  17. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    We don't use that stance. It will blow out your knee.
     
  18. BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG

    BUCKNAKEDBULLFROG White Belt

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    I meant during kata?
     
  19. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

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    The rule of thumb is to align your bracing leg with the main blocking arm.
     
  20. Kickboxer101

    Kickboxer101 Master Black Belt

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    There's no reason why you can't practice both sides of techniques in your own time during your own personal training outside of class but in class it's just a waste of time to be honest because you won't get through as much stuff each lesson if everyone's basically doing the technique at least twice and then some will get confused and then it'll have to be demonstrated etc just not worth it in class but by all practicing it on your own doesn't hurt
     

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