Physical difference between men and women regarding training...

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Talk' started by jks9199, Feb 15, 2014.

  1. jks9199

    jks9199 Administrator Staff Member

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    Jul 2, 2006
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    [h=3]Physical differences between men and women regarding training [/h]
    In brief -- Lise Steenerson is saying that there are quantifiable, definite differences between male and female bodies. These differences influence (or should influence) training. And it will definitely influence what they do in self defense...

    Let's hear what others have to say... Do you agree? disagree? Is it a simple matter to adjust, or does it go deeper?
  2. zDom

    zDom Senior Master

    Aug 21, 2006
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    I agree. But then, we should always train with a thought to our body type and its advantages and disadvantages.

    Specific to male/female: question once came up on whether a front kick following a punch should go inside (closer to the centerline) or outside the kick.

    Came to the determination that, in most cases, the kick should go inside for a male, since his shoulders are probably wider than his hips, and outside for a female, since her hips are probably wider than her shoulders.
  3. Tony Dismukes

    Tony Dismukes MT Moderator Staff Member

    Nov 11, 2005
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    I may have more to say on the article later, once I've had some time to gather my thoughts. In the meantime, I'll just drop this in here:
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
  4. tshadowchaser

    tshadowchaser Sr. Grandmaster

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    I think that the muscular difference between most male and females is usually taken for granted. That being said the male should be able to excert more strength in the movement of an object. That would impact the amount of power that is excreted in kicks and punches.
    That same difference could also make a difference in agility and speed
  5. Tgace

    Tgace Grandmaster

    Jul 31, 2003
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    As in discussions I have had regarding women in military combat roles...IMO you have averages and exceptions.

    On the average, men are going to have more size, muscle mass and strength (especially upper body but overall as well). Sure, some women will be stronger than men...but the issue becomes "what do you plan for?" Do you retool infantry screening and training for the exceptions or for the average? Do you plan your martial arts training needs/strategy and tactics based on exceptions or on the average?
  6. aedrasteia

    aedrasteia Purple Belt

    Oct 30, 2006
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    T-gace - no disrespect to you. Your post made me think of this:

    Average? Most frequent?

    Not a stranger, someone known and trusted. Well documented - as the age of the target/survivor decreases, reliable increase in perpetrators who are _very_ well known or family members.
    but consistent across age, race etc of all survivors.

    Location is _inside_ the perpetrator or target's home/residence, workplace, school, home of friend or family member. seldom 'on the street'. well documented.

    Perpetrator uses relationship (existing or created) to build confidence/trust, create an emotional
    psychological" fog" to confuse or distract the targeted victim. If she has a 'gut feeling or intuition'
    the perpetrator will consistently work to undermine, distract, or pretend to be "hurt that you don't trust me".

    Perpetrator will use his authority-position to discount and dismiss 'gut-feelings' or will use it to isolate
    the target physically or emotionally/mentally.

    Perp will also lay early groundwork with others to discredit the target's perceptions or questions.

    Perpetrator uses progressive, intrusive behavior-language-structured situations to see if the victim
    can be maipulated to undermine her own gut feelings, and physically and emotionally isolated.

    Strategic, persistent use of targeting and testing by the perpetrator.

    Deliberate, strategic use of any alcohol/substance to diminish or incapacitate victim:
    add xtra alcohol to drinks, add unflavored alcohol (vodka-grain) to non-alcoholic drinks,
    use any substance (sometimes in combination w/alcohol) more common than roofies or GHB
    such as valium, etc.

    Limited, strategic use of _minimum_ physical force/strength necessary.
    Control other factors first, little force is necessary or used because force
    leaves evidence; bruising, choke marks etc, supporting victim's report (if she does report).
    If there are no marks or minimal marks that can be explained or justified, she is more likely
    to be discredited

    Sexual assault is frequently a process; by the time the actual assault occurs
    the game/process is nearly over, the perpetrator controls the field, has created the advantage
    and it's nearly over. well-documented

    It is at this very late point that MA-based SD4W is just getting started.
    And then comparative strength may be critical.

    But even here - emotional, psychological 'hooks' socialized into girls and women
    over years do the most damage. well-documented

    Steenerson is making a point. But it's mostly a very limited point.

    I work to focus on what actually happens - all of it.

    in the last 3 months i've seen no stranger assaults, not one. And i've
    seen 14 survivors (that's just me, not the entire group).

    do not misunderstand - solid physical skills are very important. strength can be an issue.

    but it is one, usually less relevant, factor. And perpetrators know it.
  7. TKDTony2179

    TKDTony2179 Blue Belt

    May 18, 2013
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    I seen that video once before. I think she suckered punched the guy because she heard 3 and she just punched. LOL...that was funny. Any how, I would think that on average a man vs woman with same weight the man will still hit harder. In this case of the video it is proven that a well train athletic woman cna hit as hard as her counter part. However, the test in the video is wrong. They start out using hook punches to the body but when they went to test upon the dummy the guy used a straight cross in a southpaw stance. The lady started off in a orthodox stance and stepped into a southpaw stance while loading up on a hook punch. She change the punch and used a different body mechanic which allowed her to hit harder. I am not taking anything away from her but it makes a big difference in the numbers.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 24, 2014
  8. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

    Sep 21, 2005
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    i noticed those issues too, but I think it's irrelevant.

    They just told them, hit the dummy as hard as you can. From what was shown in the video, nobody said they had to use a specific punch. So that's what they did, they each hit it as hard as they could, with whatever they felt would do the job. They both did use the left hand tho, so that was consistent.

    She had a better understanding of the body mechanics, and she applied that in a way where she landed a more powerful punch. Maybe she hit "smarter", but that was really kinda the point of the exercise. A woman who knows what she is doing can hit as hard, or even harder, than at least some of her male counterparts.123

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