Permission to pause

[AngryHobbit]

With the Warrior Dash only two and a half weeks away, I've been training harder than ever. POUND on Mondays with half an hour of strength training before the class; yoga on Tuesday; Zumba on Wednesday - also with strength training; aikido on Thursday and on Saturday.

Between all that, and the full-time high-stress job, and the usual household stuff, there are times when I start feeling pretty ragged. And that's when I struggle. On one hand, I was brought up in the spirit of "No pain - no gain" and "just work your way through it." My dad, my uncles, my grandfathers - all former military men - were pretty ruthless in that respect. On the other hand, there are copious amounts of evidence advising against over-training - especially when coming up on a major athletic event of some sort.

How do you make a decision when to push through and when to allow yourself to take a break? What factors do you take into account and how do you make sure you don't feel guilty about taking it easy?

 

[Xue Sheng]

Joint pain = stop
Dizziness = stop
Illness = stop

 

[Monkey Turned Wolf]

What Xue said.

Also, when I realize that the rate I'm going I won't be able to stay at long-term (or until whatever my goal is), I dial it back to a more manageable one. I've had enough times that I pushed through 40+hours a week of MA/exercise/fencing, only to stop completely 2 months later due to burnout. Would rather go a more reasonable pace that I enjoy, and will continue doing long-term. I found that to be more beneficial for competitions as well.

 

[hoshin1600]

i think it all depends on your goals and why you are doing what you are doing.
some times i need more of a mental break then a physical one. my mind gets tired from intense focus on something. going from one activity to another in a scheduled manner can be stressful that has an impact on you. having to get a run done after "A" so that you can move to "B" in order to have time for "C".

 

[AngryHobbit]

Joint pain = stop
Dizziness = stop
Illness = stop

I agree with you on dizziness and illness. But the joint pain is a tough one, because I have chronic pain. So... it's there pretty much ALL the time. I sort of have to pick and choose - is this the regular pain? Or is this some sort of extraordinary pain? Is it going to go away if I stretch and get moving? That kind of thing...

 

[AngryHobbit]

What Xue said.

Also, when I realize that the rate I'm going I won't be able to stay at long-term (or until whatever my goal is), I dial it back to a more manageable one. I've had enough times that I pushed through 40+hours a week of MA/exercise/fencing, only to stop completely 2 months later due to burnout. Would rather go a more reasonable pace that I enjoy, and will continue doing long-term. I found that to be more beneficial for competitions as well.

That's a great point! The mental strain. I am a chronic over-achiever, and this is definitely a factor. It particularly comes into play for the Saturday martial arts class - it starts at 8:30, so no sleeping in, and I LOVE to sleep in on weekends. So, it takes a real effort of will to get myself up and going.

 

[Xue Sheng]

I agree with you on dizziness and illness. But the joint pain is a tough one, because I have chronic pain. So... it's there pretty much ALL the time. I sort of have to pick and choose - is this the regular pain? Or is this some sort of extraordinary pain? Is it going to go away if I stretch and get moving? That kind of thing...

I too have joint pain regularly, but if you have it long enough you know the difference between what is normal and what is not.

 

[AngryHobbit]

i think it all depends on your goals and why you are doing what you are doing.

Oh, that's easy! My goals are to put in a marginally respectable performance at Warrior Dash (for me, it means not skipping any obstacles even if I have to crawl over them), maintain healthy lifestyle, be a super-star at work, take care of my husband, my animals, my friends, my family, and my house, publish a book (translated or original) every three months, and look like Mila Kunis, while doing so.

some times i need more of a mental break then a physical one. my mind gets tired from intense focus on something. going from one activity to another in a scheduled manner can be stressful that has an impact on you. having to get a run done after "A" so that you can move to "B" in order to have time for "C".

As I mentioned in my previous comment - the mental fatigue is definitely there. One of these days... I'll figure it all out.

 

[pdg]

Joint pain = stop
Dizziness = stop
Illness = stop

Surely there has to be a measure though...

Sometimes, I have minor pain in joints, usually caused by a slight pull or over exertion - I'll either train through it or guard/restrict.

Dizziness happens sometimes too. Not that I'm a competitive person or anything but even warmups become a race occasionally

Illness? Of what severity? I've had a couple of colds and generally just get on with it. I admit it's "less effective" exercise, but it's still more effective than sitting on the sofa watching telly...

 

[Xue Sheng]

Surely there has to be a measure though...

Sometimes, I have minor pain in joints, usually caused by a slight pull or over exertion - I'll either train through it or guard/restrict.

Dizziness happens sometimes too. Not that I'm a competitive person or anything but even warmups become a race occasionally

Illness? Of what severity? I've had a couple of colds and generally just get on with it. I admit it's "less effective" exercise, but it's still more effective than sitting on the sofa watching telly...

You do it your way and I will do it mine. Over 40 years of this has lead me to that.

 

[pdg]

You do it your way and I will do it mine. Over 40 years of this has lead me to that.

If it works for you, great - I wouldn't say it's any more justifiable as a blanket recommendation than "my" way though

My job is fairly physically demanding, and I'm self employed - if I don't work I don't get paid.

So, I'm somewhat acclimatised to working through or around niggles.

 

[Xue Sheng]

If it works for you, great - I wouldn't say it's any more justifiable as a blanket recommendation than "my" way though

My job is fairly physically demanding, and I'm self employed - if I don't work I don't get paid.

So, I'm somewhat acclimatized to working through or around niggles.

I get the impression you make a lot of assumptions about me that are rather unfounded....we are not talking a job here, I have had my share of tough jobs in my life and gotten through a heck of a lot of "niggles", we are talking training and if you are concerned about getting paid you hurt yourself training and you can't go to work and get paid

It is where over 40 years of experience at this, much of it not following those 3 simple rules, has gotten me, and in some cases not following those has made it impossible to go to a tough job and I had at the time, have experience with that too.

Also anyone who comments here, unless they are a doctor, a physiologist or a experienced and licensed trainer isn't "any more justifiable than a blanket recommendation than "my" way"

Again, are we done now.

 

[JR 137]

Googling “signs & symptoms of overtraining” lead me to this...

Common Warning Signs and Symptoms of Overtraining Syndrome

• Washed-out feeling, tired, drained, lack of energy
• Mild leg soreness, general aches, and pains
• Pain in muscles and joints
• Sudden drop in performance
• Insomnia
• Headaches
• Decreased immunity (increased number of colds, and sore throats)
• Decrease in training capacity/intensity
• Moodiness and irritability
• Depression
• Loss of enthusiasm for the sport
• Decreased appetite
• Increased incidence of injuries.
• A compulsive need to exercise

Seems pretty accurate to me and what I’ve seen as an athletic trainer (sports med, not personal trainer). No emphasis on the colored parts by me; they were links to articles from my cut and paste. The insomnia and psychological stuff is probably what I’ve seen most. Pain, soreness, etc. is applicable, but less applicable by itself in this regard.

 

[granfire]

Googling “signs & symptoms of overtraining” lead me to this...

Common Warning Signs and Symptoms of Overtraining Syndrome

• Washed-out feeling, tired, drained, lack of energy
• Mild leg soreness, general aches, and pains
• Pain in muscles and joints
• Sudden drop in performance
• Insomnia
• Headaches
• Decreased immunity (increased number of colds, and sore throats)
• Decrease in training capacity/intensity
• Moodiness and irritability
• Depression
• Loss of enthusiasm for the sport
• Decreased appetite
• Increased incidence of injuries.
• A compulsive need to exercise

Seems pretty accurate to me and what I’ve seen as an athletic trainer (sports med, not personal trainer). No emphasis on the colored parts by me; they were links to articles from my cut and paste. The insomnia and psychological stuff is probably what I’ve seen most. Pain, soreness, etc. is applicable, but less applicable by itself in this regard.

I think I need to tell my boss I can come in only eveery other day, 3 times a week, tops....

OHHHHHH
you mean TRAINING......
awe shucks....

 

[AngryHobbit]

I think I need to tell my boss I can come in only eveery other day, 3 times a week, tops....

OHHHHHH
you mean TRAINING......
awe shucks....

I am still looking for ways to cash in all the afternoon naps I refused to take as a kid.

 

[AngryHobbit]

Googling “signs & symptoms of overtraining” lead me to this...

Common Warning Signs and Symptoms of Overtraining Syndrome

• Washed-out feeling, tired, drained, lack of energy
• Mild leg soreness, general aches, and pains
• Pain in muscles and joints
• Sudden drop in performance
• Insomnia
• Headaches
• Decreased immunity (increased number of colds, and sore throats)
• Decrease in training capacity/intensity
• Moodiness and irritability
• Depression
• Loss of enthusiasm for the sport
• Decreased appetite
• Increased incidence of injuries.
• A compulsive need to exercise

Seems pretty accurate to me and what I’ve seen as an athletic trainer (sports med, not personal trainer). No emphasis on the colored parts by me; they were links to articles from my cut and paste. The insomnia and psychological stuff is probably what I’ve seen most. Pain, soreness, etc. is applicable, but less applicable by itself in this regard.

That is a great list - thank you. Definitely worth keeping in mind. I'll need to think about how to adapt it for my needs. For instance, my immune system is shot - @gpseymour has been to Ukraine with me once, and he can tell you what sort of atmosphere I grew up in. The problem with that is - I pick up everyone's sneezes and coughs at every opportunity. So, I can't always tell - am I having lowered immunity because I am tired, or is it just... you know... my lowered immunity, because thank you, Chernobyl.

I'm BPD, so moodiness, irritability, and depression are all part of the three-ring circus in my head. I just have to work hard not to let it affect other people.

Decreased appetite is an EXCELLENT one - I really should keep an eye on that one. I have to be REALLY messed up to quit eating.

Need to think about the compulsive need to exercise - I am more than a little bit addicted to the free endorphins.

 

[drop bear]

You have a goal though. So in theory you would want to set out a short ish term camp to achieve that. Tapering up to about a week before. Then moving to less injury based stuff during that last week.

At which point you will over train but it won't be forever so tough cookies, push through.

Then when you are done. Rest for a bit and slowly start the process again.

 

[drop bear]

Googling “signs & symptoms of overtraining” lead me to this...

Common Warning Signs and Symptoms of Overtraining Syndrome

• Washed-out feeling, tired, drained, lack of energy
• Mild leg soreness, general aches, and pains
• Pain in muscles and joints
• Sudden drop in performance
• Insomnia
• Headaches
• Decreased immunity (increased number of colds, and sore throats)
• Decrease in training capacity/intensity
• Moodiness and irritability
• Depression
• Loss of enthusiasm for the sport
• Decreased appetite
• Increased incidence of injuries.
• A compulsive need to exercise

Seems pretty accurate to me and what I’ve seen as an athletic trainer (sports med, not personal trainer). No emphasis on the colored parts by me; they were links to articles from my cut and paste. The insomnia and psychological stuff is probably what I’ve seen most. Pain, soreness, etc. is applicable, but less applicable by itself in this regard.

That is also a list of just what to expect during any goal orientated training program.

I mean you just described the grind.

 

[AngryHobbit]

You have a goal though. So in theory you would want to set out a short ish term camp to achieve that. Tapering up to about a week before. Then moving to less injury based stuff during that last week.

At which point you will over train but it won't be forever so tough cookies, push through.

Then when you are done. Rest for a bit and slowly start the process again.

I'll need to plan that out with the calendar. I have another mud run in October.

 

[_Simon_]

A very important thread (thank you AH for bringing it up), and I feel I can speak on this.

I've spent alot of my life being hard on myself. Putting excess pressure on myself. I naturally chose a martial arts style that was 'hard' and would run me into the ground. I was tired, injuries would crop up, and I felt no motivation to keep going, all in the name of 'no I've gotta push through. I've gotta look like I'm strong.' It was all coming from a deep insecurity within myself, but I kept denying it and pushing it further away, all because I thought I had to be strong and be 'in control.'

We can often push ourselves so hard in order to mask insecurities, and that's what it was for me. I was trying to pretend that if I looked strong, I must be. If I just stay incredibly tensed, I'll be safe. All sorts of strange belief systems... The last 1-2 years that I trained in my last style I was literally dragging myself.. my motivation was just dwindling day by day and I just was destroying myself.

Then I finally made the call and woke up in a sense, and finally was honest with myself: "I don't wanna do this anymore, I can't do this to myself anymore." As emotional as it was, I knew I could listen to my heart in this. So I left my style.

Then six months later my body gave me further feedback that I needed to ease up on myself, and after 5 trips to emergency, constant excruciating pain, and no one being able to tell me why, I found out I had pelvic floor tension myalgia/chronic pelvic pain syndrome. Basically far too tight within the pelvic muscles which caused incredible pain and a whole host of other issues. It's just where I stored tension as a stress/survival response. Believing I needed to stay 'tight' and 'tense' in order to feel safe. And it finally added up. So this was the body's further way of saying "you need to take it easier...", and I definitely made the right choice in leaving.

Whilst it might not all be relevant to you AH, I write all this because its so... so important that we listen to ourselves, be honest with ourselves, and most importantly be kind to ourselves. Yes it's great to train hard, but things can get out of balance fast. And if you feel guilty when you don't train, it's sooo much more beneficial trying to get to the root of the guilt instead of pushing through it or pushing it away. Asking oneself: "Well why do I need to train and push through? What am I trying to prove? Do I think I'll be a failure if I don't? Weak? Have not much self-worth?" And really questioning whether it's true.

We aren't strong from just putting on some brave face, a fake smile, or looking like I've got my **** sorted. It comes from real honesty, vulnerability, and in just letting ourselves be vulnerable. Letting ourselves feel what we're feeling. Being totally honest as to what our intentions are, and looking at what beliefs surround it.

Sorry this went a little long, but it really spoke to me, and I know I've got a long way to go still in learning to listen to myself and be honest (am still working through my pelvic pain issues, and there are still incredibly painful days..), if anyone gets anything out of it, that's great. This is just my experience. I'd say that everyone is wired differently, and some would benefit from that 'yang' energy (learning about the will, being straight up, learning resilience, perseverance etc), and others the 'yin' (allowing, relaxing, being gentle, nurturing towards yourself).

Overtraining is often simply a case of not being in tune with yourself, not being honest or not being able to listen to yourself. Not taking the body's advice that "I need rest and recovery," and pushing on through. And everyone has different degrees of it, or different tolerance levels. The other guys have given great responses, and that list is definitely a good guide. As long as it leads to a deepening of your listening to your own body and what it needs, that's great. There are some days where you just wanna collapse, and it's okay to! Rest up, and you'll feel the better for it tomorrow, so you can train tomorrow in a much more healthy and functional way.

It's been a process for me, and that tendency to push myself still comes up, but I'm being more and more honest, and taking more rest when it's needed.

A very long winded way of saying: "Be kind to yourself."