Obesity and Self-protection?

[shesulsa]

That said and done, I'd like to hear what you do to keep yourself in optimum health, KC.

What is your daily intake of fiber? Do you monitor your blood sugar? What is your position on the whole animal protein + complex carbohydrate food combination thing?

How do you keep your gut peptide balance healthy and how do you monitor it? What is your position on peptides and obesity? Do you think Beano helps?

These are all things that are a regular part of my life and I'm curious just how carefully everyone monitors their health, fitness level and dietary intake?

 

[beau_safken]

Hmm well now that this is in the health section...

Fat people die more than skinny people.

Commence the slippery slope arguement.

 

[stone_dragone]

I, too, would argue that it is a question of why one studies a self-defense art. I'm not talking about the "I don't wanna get mugged" reason, but the deeper need met by such education, which could arguably be the desire to avoid being a victim of SOMEONE ELSE's violent will. There's the key...SOMEONE ELSE's will.

When it comes to someone controlling their own will (having one oreo instead of the entire pack) it becomes a totally different question. Knowing what we know today, should a sense of self preservation lead to a loss of weight? One would hope so...but that isn't the case. Humans are hardwired to hoard food in the place that is the easiest to store...our gullet. It is an unfortunate self-preservation method that now counteracts our well being.

Do I prefer to exercise and maintain a "healthy" weight. Yes. Do I revel every time I go home and see my highschool buddies (and ex girlfriends!!!) who have nearly doubled their mass since graduation? Absolutely. Do I study MA/SD to hurt other people? No. Am I about to put a hurtin' on these Girl Scout thin mints... mmbmhbm..mbbm..

 

[MJS]

Am I about to put a hurtin' on these Girl Scout thin mints... mmbmhbm..mbbm..

Those damn cookies!! I hear ya though...I just can't seem to say no to the mints!!

 

[beau_safken]

Those damn cookies!! I hear ya though...I just can't seem to say no to the mints!!

Thats something I can't find a arguement against at all....

 

[Stan]

Stone_Dragone, thank you for trying to move this interesting thread back towards the disucssion of a true paradox and away from insults.

Philosophically, this subject reflects on what it means to be free, and what responsibilities go with freedom. Many would say, (and I'm not necessarily one of them, so don't you go pigeonholeing me politically that the fat martial artists that this thread started out about could be a metaphor for the American Republic. We are strong in the defense of our freedom from domination from other powers, but may not always do as much as others to develop ourselves, be it in physical fitness, art, literature, science, or whatever.

The protection from the arbitrary will of another that I mentioned above is one of the most important aspects of freedom. John Locke defined slavery as the absolute, arbitrary power of one person or group over another. Whether malicious or not, a person who exercises such power over another can threaten the other's live at any time, so the yielding of the power in the first place is a threat to life. Maybe this arguement about the unhealthy martial artist is an arguement about what it means to be free, what it means to be willing to fight for one's freedom, and what the responsibilities of a free person are.

 

[MJS]

Thats something I can't find a arguement against at all....

And whats worse, is that after we're done buying from friends, family and co-workers, I go to the grocery store, and what do I see set up, outside the entrance/exit doors??? Girl Scout Cookies!!!!!!!!!

 

[MSUTKD]

I would think that if someone was really interested in self-defense that he or she would also be interested in physical fitness. I do not believe that you can truly defend yourself if you are not in shape. You can have a job, family and life along with staying in shape. It is just how you set your priorities. As instructors I think we have to set an example for the student. My teacher is 70 years old and still trains everyday and looks great.

ron

 

[Cruentus]

Long post ahead: I think people need to be healthy, period.

Yet, the way we view health as well as our overall condition is problematic in our society of extremes. We have actoresses who have gotten tinier and tinier, atheletes and body builders who have gotten larger, leaner and more muscular (and not without the aid of drug use, I might add). There are more diets, diet food, and gym memberships then ever before, yet in america as a whole we are more obese then we ever have been. And other countries are following suit - we just happend to be the leaders. Anyone want to know why?

I would love to know why myself. I am not an expert on the subject, but I have an informed opinion. If I had to guess, I would guess that the reason we are so unhealthy has to do with 3 things - toxicity, social-economics, and psychology.

Toxicity: We live in a more toxic environment then ever before. The air we breathe and the water we drink are filled with garbage. Food companies are allowed to put more toxins in our food then ever before, and the FDA rubberstamps all of it. Toxins that end up in our body are stored as adapose tissue. If it wasn't stored, then all that poison would float around wrecking havoc on our system, making us sick or possibly killing us. So, our body creates more fat to store toxins as a defense mechanism. Losing fat, then, becomes an uphill battle with the more toxins and garbage we expose ourselves too.

Social-economics: I don't know if this is the right term, but basically I am refering to lifestyle. However, I am not refering to mere lifestyle choices because our societal structure has limited our choices, or at least made them more difficult. Most households have 2 working parents instead of one, and people are kept busy, busy, busy. So, taking the time to have home cooked meals, and taking the time to walk more and exercise more is becoming less of an option for many people. People just don't have the time because our middle class is erroding, so people are busy trying to pay bills. THis means more processed foods and fast foods, and less exercise time. This means more toxins in our diet, and less time to buy fresh foods and prepare fresh meals. People try to combat this issue through fad diets and consumerism; buying supplements, pills, diet plans, exercise equipment, and gym memberships. However, it just doesn't give most people the results because there are no quick fixes. What is needed is a lifestyle change that is harder and harder for many people to do these days.

Psychology: We have a extremest consumerist mentality in our society. We can't just eat right and be healthy. We all want to have rippling muscles, lean bodies, washboard abs, etc. We all want to look like the cover of a magazine. And we all want it right now. Most people don't want to accept the fact that due to genetics and lifestyle situations, they are never going to have the body of a god or goddess, and therefore should just try to live healthy every day and forget about the magazines. Most people, usually after the holidays, crash diet and hit the gym and buy all kinds of crap to try to make themselves look really healthy really fast. Then, when they don't attain their unrealistic goals, they get unmotivated and life takes over. They get "busy." And, with our extremest consumerist mentality, we PAID for that diet plan and gym membership, so dammit we should be bathing suit ready in 8 weeks. Well, I did that, so now I am entitled to gorge myself with all kinds of garbage because I EARNED it by dieting and exercising all that time. They of course neglect to tally the 3 months of sedentary behavior followed by 2 months of holiday gorging in their entitlement to reaching perfection in 8 weeks.

Well, you get the idea. What is required is a lifestyle change. But instead, because of our mentality, people go through fustrated cycles of crash diets and exercise plans, followed by apathy and unhealthy habits due to unattained goals that were unrealistic in the first place. People seem to flip back and forth between these cycles until total fustration causes them stop caring, and to REALLY let themselves go.

Yet, where should we stand on this issue as self-defense advocates?

I think that we first of all should not fall victim to the superficiality of idolizing the drug users of the athletic world, putting them up on the pedistal as the physical criteria that we all need to achieve. This is unrealistic and part of the problem rather then the solution.

What we do need to do is advocate a healthy lifestyle. Keep in mind that there are a lot of people who may not look like they are in shape, but who may be all around very healthy. Unless someone has to be wheeled in the room on a gurney, it isn't always evident by looking at them that they are unhealthy. There are a lot of people out there who don't look the part, but who are in better condition then others that do. You can't judge a book by it's cover. I also think it would be arrogent to say that you couldn't learn a self-defense concept or skill from someone who doesn't "look" in shape.

That all said, as combatants and as self-defense instructors, we can't ignore the fact that the better shape we are in, the better off we will be in a fight. So, being in shape should be a part of our self-defense plan. The better fighting condition we are in, the more likely we are to survive a violent encounter. We need to know this for the sake of ourselves and anyone we teach.

Paul

 

[shesulsa]

To capitalize on Paul's point ... are we saying that only lean people with good cholesterol, normal blood sugar and decent cardiovascular fitness are entitled to learn self-defense?

And speaking of slippery slopes what about differently-abled persons? How do these people protect themselves ... from themselves? And should they DARE to teach self-defense?

Also ... I'd still like to know how certain members keep themselves in top condition. You know, that question about fiber and stuff?

 

[Edmund BlackAdder]

Ladies, Gentlemen, and small wormlike creatures currently tied into a Gordian Knot: Let me cut through the maze.


Discussion of nuclear arms, politics and other cranial-rectal issues: Please go to H...The Study

Discussion of Self Defense related ideas: Go to Self Defense.

Discussion of Health matters: You're in the right space.

(The question of mind however is up for debate.)


Martial Artists should be fit. Period.
However. Being overweight, in any amount, does not diminish the quality of the material an individual may offer.
It may effect their application and demonstration of said material.

I have seen a number of "large" martial artists. Some of them are slow and lumbering beasts. Others move quite well for someone that size, often moving well for a much "slimmer model".

Yes, it would be nice if they were "fit", but their own health is their concern. I'm more concerned with the quality of material, over physical appearance quirks.

Yes, it does hurt their credibility, but on that same line, I've never met a gym teacher or little league coach who was ready for battle either.

 

[Xue Sheng]

One comment and I am out of this.

Has anyone ever seen a picture of Yang Cheng-fu?

He was considered an amazing teacher and he was allegedly undefeated.

And the most widely taught Tai Chi in the world today is.....Yang Style.

 

[MJS]

Yes, it would be nice if they were "fit", but their own health is their concern. I'm more concerned with the quality of material, over physical appearance quirks.

Amen!! Unfortunately, and due to the many reasons already listed, some people just may never have a low percentage of body fat, a washboard stomach, and be in overall good health. As you said, that is the choice that they want to make.

Personally, I'm not looking at how many stripes they have on their belt, how many fights they've had, or how big or small their stomach is, but instead, what they can teach me.

Mike

 

[Edmund BlackAdder]

One comment and I am out of this.

Has anyone ever seen a picture of Yang Cheng-fu?

He was considered an amazing teacher and he was allegedly undefeated.

And the most widely taught Tai Chi in the world today is.....Yang Style.

Heck, I've seen alot of paintings, and pictures of older masters. Can't say I recall ever seeing any that looked "fit and trim". Alot were little bald fat guys. Guess the stuff they did was effective without having to be ready to run a triathalon. I like that. What good is any art that will only work if one is ready to model in a fitness magazine?

 

[Cruentus]

How does one protect oneself from oneself? Please answer - how does one do this, in your opinion?

Well....all I have to say is that if I can get through the day without hitting myself, then its been a good day. I have protected myself from myself considerably...

 

[shesulsa]

Moderator Note:

Flame posts have been removed in an effort to restore the integrity of the thread.

G Ketchmark / shesulsa
MT Senior Moderator

 

[Shirt Ripper]

Man, you guys post fast...I was at Aikido...and what happened with this thread I was reading the third page and trying to get to the fourth and they both dissapeared...probably not worth it then, eh?

Majority of the P.E. teachers I have known were quite sad...I would never let someone you can't do math try to teach me math (or anyone else for that matter!) so why would I let a fat guy or gal try to teach me about physical activity...sad...just sad...makes me want to get my teaching licensure.

 

[shesulsa]

I rather like the idea of a discussion of protecting oneself from ... well, oneself.

I'm curious - how many out there are aware, for instance, of a genetic predisposition to a certain health problem and take active steps against that illness or disorder?

How many have metabolic disorders (if you're willing to disclose) which keep you from being as trim as you ought to be according to your caloric intake vs. caloric usage?

 

[Shirt Ripper]

I rather like the idea of a discussion of protecting oneself from ... well, oneself.

I'm curious - how many out there are aware, for instance, of a genetic predisposition to a certain health problem and take active steps against that illness or disorder?

How many have metabolic disorders (if you're willing to disclose) which keep you from being as trim as you ought to be according to your caloric intake vs. caloric usage?

Oh man, I've got a serious history on my hands. Most cardiac fun is present there...my dad recently developed type II. I was about 260lbs. in eighth grade so I have a little personal history added to that and was about as borderline diabetic as one can get. Thank God for my bike, the weightroom and football, eh? I currently train strongman primarily with a major emphasis on overall condition (as if you could avoid it training for strongman) as well as some aikdio. My diet is layed out with my bloodline in mind. I'm just glad I shaped up and started absorbing information so young so as I can avoid my dad's current situation and his father's and grandfather's lethal cardiac incident in their early 50's.........Hopefully.

 

[bushidomartialarts]

i'm a kenpo guy. many of you know that this thread could have been inspired by many of our seniors.

it's a running joke among many kenpokas i know that obesity is a rank requirement somewhere above 5th.

funny, but i find it disappointing. a few extra pounds is one thing, but no martial arts teacher should need to rest going up a flight of stairs, or require a two mirrors to wash his junk.