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Buka

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Moved here last summer. Left Boston, stayed a few days in L.A visiting friends, flew here. Booked everything at the local AAA office. (always do, never a problem) We were flying United.

Get to the airport, get our ticket and head to the plane. BAD on us, never looked at the ticket. (It was a hectic and emotional time, as relocations usually are.)

We had separate seats. My wife was across the aisle, and two rows up, in a middle seat next to a gigantic women for a six hour flight.
Usually, a gentleman would switch, but she wouldn't let me, I always ride the aisle, in case something happens on the flight. Always have; always will, have some good training concerning that.

We stay in L.A and leave again. This time we check the tickets. Again, we are separated. But I straighten it out with the boarding attendant and we have some sweet seats with much leg room.

Flash forward to a month ago. We get a call at work about an unruly passenger at ticketing. Three of us respond. He's unruly alight, he's steamed and about to blow. Two of us are giving him stink-eye as the third talks to the agent. Turns out, the guy, also a doctor, is flying with his wife and four children. He made all the arrangements himself. He and two of the kids together in one row, his wife and the other two kids in the row in front of him.

But when he gets the tickets - all six of them are in separate seats, not even close to each other. Three of the kids are under ten years old. Now we're giving stink eye to the agent. Serious stink eye. We ask, "you're kidding, right?"

We ended up taking him and his family upstairs to the gates and had the agent up there work her magic and get them all together. His family will never fly that airline again. Neither will mine.

From an airport cop's perspective, when you get these calls you rarely know what they are about. Just that someone needs to be taken off the plane. But I don't work with anyone who would have handled it that way. (in the vid)
 

Buka

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While the airline handled it poorly...so did the passenger.

Yes, the airline handled it poorly. But the old doc played has cards perfectly.
I;m told there's more to him than meets the eye.
 

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It appears now that they needed to make space for an employee.

The window of opportunity on these flights is before it boards. It's not uncommon for a flight to offer incentives for people to get them to voluntarily delay their travel. Alaskan Airlines often offers a free domestic round trip voucher. That gets people moving, usually.

But on the plane, after everyone is seated, that's just terrible judgment. And those officers had to know they would be all over YouTube.

I don't even see being seated as that big a deal. Offer incentives. If nobody accepts, offer bigger incentives. It's your (the Airline...) screwup, so it's up to you to make it right.


While the airline handled it poorly...so did the passenger.

You are required to give up that seat when the Airline deems it necessary. Refusal to do so is a crime, and if you continue to refuse then you must be forcibly removed.

Tell that to Ghandi...

Besides, I do not think it IS a crime. It's a violation of FAA rules. OK, fine. But FAA rules are not laws. Ignoring flight staff ca certainly rise to the level of a crime, but sitting in the seat you paid for and ignoring their demands that you leave shouldn't qualify. The staff assaulted HIM, not the other way around.
 

CB Jones

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If nobody accepts, offer bigger incentives. It's your (the Airline...) screwup, so it's up to you to make it right.

I agree. United should have upped their incentives. Its bad PR.....but legally they are not required to. And when you buy your ticket you agree to this policy. Also, I believe you can buy no change tickets that protect you from being bumped in these instances.


Besides, I do not think it IS a crime. It's a violation of FAA rules. OK, fine. But FAA rules are not laws. Ignoring flight staff ca certainly rise to the level of a crime, but sitting in the seat you paid for and ignoring their demands that you leave shouldn't qualify.

They had a legal right to require him to leave the aircraft. When he refused, that became a crime of trespassing or remaining after forbidden depending how that state defines it. Trespassing and/or Remaining after Forbidden are crimes.

As an officer you try to get the person to comply, but if they do not then you have to take action. I do not know if they arrested him or not. But when he refused to comply, they should have instructed him he was under arrest and removed him in that capacity.
 

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Well according to CNN, he's likely to get between $500k and $1mil for this. CB you may be techbically correct. But they failed their customer. They also faiked their shareholders. I wouldn't be surpriaed if the CEO resigns or is fired and if they fold or file for bankruptcy the employees the will almost certainly lay off will have been wronged too.

Sometimes being technically right isn't actually right.
 

CB Jones

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Well according to CNN, he's likely to get between $500k and $1mil for this.

I think CNN is wrong on that estimate.

He will get shut up money, but not that much. The public's attention span is short and the public will forget about this quickly and move on. The good to come out of it is they should re-evaluate their policy's on incentives offered to entice passengers to volunteer.

But regardless the airlines have to be able to move flight crews from airport to airport so they don't have to cancel flights...so bumping passengers will not end.


To me, you bought the ticket under the agreement that the airline can bump you....when it happens it sucks....but that is the agreement.

You don't want to be bumped....pay for that service. But again, I'm kinda a stickler for rules.
 

Steve

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I think CNN is wrong on that estimate.

He will get shut up money, but not that much. The public's attention span is short and the public will forget about this quickly and move on. The good to come out of it is they should re-evaluate their policy's on incentives offered to entice passengers to volunteer.

But regardless the airlines have to be able to move flight crews from airport to airport so they don't have to cancel flights...so bumping passengers will not end.


To me, you bought the ticket under the agreement that the airline can bump you....when it happens it sucks....but that is the agreement.

You don't want to be bumped....pay for that service. But again, I'm kinda a stickler for rules.
its all speculation, but will be interesting to see how much he gets. Typically, it seems $50 to $100k for this kind of thing is common.

CNN is speculating this case, because of other aggravating factors including recent negative PR will cost them more.
 

CB Jones

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Typically, it seems $50 to $100k for this kind of thing is common.

That's my guess.

Hey, I would gladly take a bloody nose for 50 K....matter of fact....I'll throw in a shiner to boot for that much. ;)
 

Steve

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I was stoked to go get Indian food for dinner at my favorite Indian restaurant (Manraj Palace, btw). They have the best jalfreezi. Got out voted by the rest of the clan. Bummer.
 

ks - learning to fly

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Had a professor who was known for tough exams and sitting at his desk smiling at you the whole exam.

We called him the Smiling Executioner.

On a side note we also had a professor who was a Vietnam Vet that we nicknamed Dr. Napalm. Lol.

Yeah, mine sounds like your executioner - that being said, I probably
learned more from him than any other professor that I ever had! AND -
can proudly say - out of the 6 courses I had him for, I earned 1 C +, 1 B,
and 4 A's :)
 

CB Jones

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Yeah, mine sounds like your executioner - that being said, I probably
learned more from him than any other professor that I ever had! AND -
can proudly say - out of the 6 courses I had him for, I earned 1 C +, 1 B,
and 4 A's :)

The "Smiling Executioner" was actually one of the nicest professors at the university....but he made no bones about it....easy exams does neither the University, Profession, or Student any favors. ;)
 

Flatfish

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Ugh, had to dress up today to pretend that I'm respectable.....I hate dressing up
 

Dirty Dog

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Yeah, mine sounds like your executioner - that being said, I probably
learned more from him than any other professor that I ever had! AND -
can proudly say - out of the 6 courses I had him for, I earned 1 C +, 1 B,
and 4 A's :)

An A&P prof I had as an undergrad was like this.
The university expects a certain number of people to fail, otherwise the bell curves are wrong. Rumor had it that this guy failed enough people that nobody else in the department had to fail anybody. I recall seeing test results returned and more than one student just sitting there crying.
Everything was essay.
If you gave the correct answer, he'd give extra credit for amusing comments you might add. But if you gave the WRONG answer and added funny, you'd lose the same number of extra credit points. I recall getting an extra 10 points when asked to describe how BP is regulated. I said "cleavage and hemlines" and then gave a long, detailed, accurate answer.
 

drop bear

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So I got graded in BJJ last night.

Thats right. I am a 4 stripe white belt bitches.
 
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granfire

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I think CNN is wrong on that estimate.

He will get shut up money, but not that much. The public's attention span is short and the public will forget about this quickly and move on. The good to come out of it is they should re-evaluate their policy's on incentives offered to entice passengers to volunteer.

But regardless the airlines have to be able to move flight crews from airport to airport so they don't have to cancel flights...so bumping passengers will not end.


To me, you bought the ticket under the agreement that the airline can bump you....when it happens it sucks....but that is the agreement.

You don't want to be bumped....pay for that service. But again, I'm kinda a stickler for rules.

I don't think the public's attention span is this short anymore.
We had a crash course over the last 2 months.

from not following the story, I hear the old man got pretty banged up.

And on a side note, it wasn't United staff, but airport security.
He might get 2 paychecks....

And since the doctor's reputation was tarnished (or an attempt made)
Seems like the ex cop who did most of the dragging had a lot of skeletons in his closet as well. Big ones.

People are wondering if he was trying to let 'the filth' know what's what in this new world order....
 

gurobuzz

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I don't think the public's attention span is this short anymore.
We had a crash course over the last 2 months.

from not following the story, I hear the old man got pretty banged up.

And on a side note, it wasn't United staff, but airport security.
He might get 2 paychecks....

And since the doctor's reputation was tarnished (or an attempt made)
Seems like the ex cop who did most of the dragging had a lot of skeletons in his closet as well. Big ones.

People are wondering if he was trying to let 'the filth' know what's what in this new world order....
getting ready to head home , several reasons to be anxious !. I am flying United #2 all the saber rattling from every corner. I have been living and teaching in the Philippines in a quiet section of the country
 

granfire

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getting ready to head home , several reasons to be anxious !. I am flying United #2 all the saber rattling from every corner. I have been living and teaching in the Philippines in a quiet section of the country
put your mouth piece in!
 

Buka

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It's almost one a.m and I'm eating a whole stack of waffles.
 
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