Ki Chuan Do - one of the best Self Defense systems

[oldyangtaijiquan]

Maybe some things at AT site are publicity and are not 100% as they stated. If he was a policeman that is keept in the minutes. I don't think that confrontations are filmed or written in detail. But If you really want that minutes request them where Perkins worked and if you will have a good excuse to see them they will show them to you (but probably they will not show them to you). If he was a policeman he certainly had fights at his work and the best you can do is to ask his former co-workers.
But let now KCD in peace, who will be attracted form will find if it is worth time.

But what about SPEAR (Tony Blauer)? Any experience with that system or other RBSD?

 

[Matt Stone]

Maybe some things at AT site are publicity and are not 100% as they stated.

Then that makes the claims fraudulent, which invalidates anything else he may have to say...

If he was a policeman that is keept in the minutes.

The "minutes?" Of what, a meeting somewhere? I don't understand what you are trying to say...

I don't think that confrontations are filmed or written in detail.

But doesn't he state that they are "documented?" That would imply some form of recording of the encounter, wouldn't it?

If he was a policeman he certainly had fights at his work and the best you can do is to ask his former co-workers.

1) We have no proof he was a policeman, though I suppose that would be easy enough to prove/disprove;

2) Just because someone is a policeman doesn't necessarily mean they had "fights" on the job... There is a difference between a fight and arresting a suspected criminal, not the least of which is a little thing called "back up."

3) My father was a police officer for 20 years and I can't recall his ever bragging about countless "fights," and he had quite an active career...

But let now KCD in peace, who will be attracted form will find if it is worth time.

A moth may be attracted to a flame, but that doesn't stop the flame from being dangerous to the moth...

But what about SPEAR (Tony Blauer)? Any experience with that system or other RBSD?

I already told you I've had experience with Systema... Why do you chase SPEAR so much?

 

[Don Roley]

So we are all in agreement. John Perkins is a fraud. Since we know he lies, we can bet that other claims such as the value of his system are also probably lies as well. In fact, every video clip from the site shows that Perkins has very little skill in self defense or martial arts.

I don't think people of skill and quality like Marc MacYoung and Peytonn Quinn should be discussed in the same thread as a cowardly, incompetent fraud like Perkins. This thread is about KCD and Perkins- not Tony Blaur or the others.

 

[oldyangtaijiquan]

When Perkins say that they are documented it probably means that are written in the police reports!

I heard a lot of positive about SPEAR and also from what I saw it could be very interesting. I can't comment it detaily because I am still searching more about it. From what I found it could be something I am searching for. It seems to be simple and effective and is based on method "flinch+wedge" (similar method is used also by Richard Dimitri, Sammy Franco and Richard Ryan).

 

[Don Roley]

When Perkins say that they are documented it probably means that are written in the police reports!

And those police reports should be public record. But we all know that no one is going to be able to find them. The fights were lies. That is the easiest explination. Otherwise he would have presented proof to back up his claims. It would be a great advertising ploy.

But the fact that he has not, after freely making the claim, is proof that he lacks ethics and is a fraud as well as not being very skilled at martial arts.

 

[oldyangtaijiquan]

BTW, I found reviews of KCD book at:
http://www.realcombatonline.com/article.php?article=56
http://www.themartialist.com/pecom/attackproof.htm
Nobody of them rated it as a fraud, so please... Some maybe don't like it, what I could understand, but to despise it is too much vile. If you really like to estimate KCD test it with someone who practice it!

 

[FearlessFreep]

One thing that does comes to mind is the "Murder, She Wrote" reaction.

I mean, if you were the mayor or sherrif of a small town and Angela Lansbury showed up in your town, wouldn't you get her out of town as fast as possible? Given how often people tend to die when she shows up?

Similarly, when someone claims to have been in 'dozens' or 'hundreds' of 'life or death' battles, I'm tending to think that if this was even close to being true that they would probably have been banned from most public places (bars, clubs, restaurants) in their home town (to say nothing of probably having spent some considerable time in jail)

 

[Don Roley]

Nobody of them rated it as a fraud,

I looked at the review of it on The Martialist and the first sentence said that the reviewer didn't learn anything from the book.

It would seem that Perkins has copied a whole lot of stuff from leaders in the field such as Peytonn Quinn and Marc MacYoung and presented it as his own. I know MacYoung has talked about people doing that with his stuff. It is very easy to take something from other people's books, re-write it a bit and then seem to know what you are talking about. Some of us used to do it back in school for reports. In short, it is easy to "talk the talk."

But looking at the video clips, I can see that Perkins can't "walk the walk." Those clips are some of the worst on the internet, and all I can hear from you is that we should not judge him by them. Then why the heck did he put them up on the internet? It just goes to show that even if someone can say, 'keep your balance and pedal' does not mean that they can ride a bike or teach others to do so.

And unless Perkins or his defenders are willing to back up their claim of hundreds of documented life- and- death encounters, then he is going to be looked at as just another incompetent fraud.

 

[oldyangtaijiquan]

Don Roley - All the sentence is »John Perkins' Attack Proof is a remarkably good book that didn't really teach me anything.« and the reviewer also said »this was the first book I'd found that distilled most of what I was learning in a single source«! Perkins never said that he invented the methods that he are teaching (maybe only the way he is doing them ;-), but only that he invented KCD! Also I don't know it the persons that you rated as a leaders in this field such as Peytonn Quinn and Marc MacYoung discovered what they are teaching.
Maybe Perkins on saying that he had »hundreds of documented life and death encounters« exaggerated (as do all for publicity), but this don't mean that his encounters are not documented (as I said probably in the police reports)! To define Perkins as an incompetent fraud is only your subjective opinion.

You mentioned Peytonn Quinn and Marc MacYoung. Also popular systems/instructors (and by many recommended) are Tony Blauer, Richard Dimitri, Sammy Franco and Richard Ryan. How do you estimate their systems? Are they not commercial?

 

[Flatlander]

Mod Note:

Maybe Perkins on saying that he had »hundreds of documented life and death encounters« exaggerated (as do all for publicity), but this don't mean that his encounters are not documented (as I said probably in the police reports)!

According to the Rules for The Great Debate forum, you must cite a reference for this claim if you want it to be considered as valid. Until you do so, kindly refrain from referencing it.

You mentioned Peytonn Quinn and Marc MacYoung. Also popular systems/instructors (and by many recommended) are Tony Blauer, Richard Dimitri, Sammy Franco and Richard Ryan. How do you estimate their systems? Are they not commercial?

This is off topic and irrelevant to this discussion. Please stay focused on Ki Chuan Do, and the claims that:

KCD is a simple and effective self defense sistem. It has only stuff that works. In my opinion is one of the best self defense sistems if not the best!

Thank you.

-Dan Bowman-
-MT Moderator-

 

[Blindside]

If you really like to estimate KCD test it with someone who practice it!

Doesn't this bring us full circle? See page one where a MMA fighter wanted to "come over and test it."

Lamont