Judeo-Christian wackiness

[ShaolinWolf]

"I can also accept the idea that I may be the one who is wrong to some degree." - Tulisan

I agree with that. I have been wrong in my submitting evidence. I'm sorry, but I can't find all the evidence because we have so many stinking books at my house, I don't know which end is up. All I can say is you'll have to trust me on some of that stuff. I don't remember all the wording. And I can't even remember if they got alot of it documented. But I will say that I know that there was plenty of evidence there. I was wrong in saying it all without showing evidence. We had a book sale for School and I'm not sure whether stuff got sold, or it's just around here somewhere. When I find it I'll post. This is not a simple-backing-out-of-it-because-I-was-wrong-so-now-I'm-gonna-use-some-lame-excuse. It's just I don't know where all this stuff is. I know where a few of the tapes are. I could look at them. I do promise though that when I find stuff, I'll post it. I know what the books look like, but sadly I don't know the full titles. LOL. Sounds typical. Ok, fine say that. I don't care. Kind of embarrased that I can't find this stuff. HEHEH...Anyways, sorry. I'll post when I can.

And just a note: Heretic, I don't do say stuff out of desperation. You constantly say it sounds like desperate things. I'm not desperate in the least. Otherwise, I wouldn't be arguing my point. Also, when I'm desperate, I say very little. I don't ramble or even say much. I keep my mouth shut.

:asian:

 

[ShaolinWolf]

Uhhh... off-topic, guys.

Shut up....LOL. I just asked a question. I could look it up in my geography book. LOL. Ok fine, I'll do that right now and post the answer as a P.S. LOL

 

[CanuckMA]

The days in Genesis are assumed to be of unknown length. The only time they are taken as 24 hour days, is when our calendar is concerned.

This does help matters for the believer, but it only addresses the supposed date of the creation of the Earth --- and not the particulars through which this was said to occur.

The belief is that the universe was created by G-d.

Interesting. Does this "oral tradition" have any particular relationship to disciplines like Kabbalah??

Nothing whatsoever. The Talmud is the compilation of the Mishna, the Oral Law given to Moses at Mt. Sinai, and the Gemara, Rabbis' interpratations and commentaries on the Mishna.

Kabbalah is Mysticism.

 

[heretic888]

I agree with that. I have been wrong in my submitting evidence. I'm sorry, but I can't find all the evidence because we have so many stinking books at my house, I don't know which end is up. All I can say is you'll have to trust me on some of that stuff. I don't remember all the wording. And I can't even remember if they got alot of it documented. But I will say that I know that there was plenty of evidence there.

The problem here, ShaolinWolf, is that you don't seem to know what good, solid evidence is in the first place. You seem to think that, just because someone says it and you agree with it, it must be "evidence". This is not the definition of the word in science.

If they didn't get "all of it documented", then its not actual evidence. Its just claims of evidence. There is a big difference.

And just a note: Heretic, I don't do say stuff out of desperation. You constantly say it sounds like desperate things. I'm not desperate in the least. Otherwise, I wouldn't be arguing my point. Also, when I'm desperate, I say very little. I don't ramble or even say much. I keep my mouth shut.

I didn't mean to imply this was a conscious deception on your part, I just don't believe (based on your posts) that you actually know what good evidence or scientific process is. Everything you've claimed strikes me as if you are just tossing these words around nilly-willy, and can't back them up with good documentation or citation.

I don't think that's desperate or deceptive. Just misinformed.

 

[ShaolinWolf]

Ok, it's probably in this thread, but I have been feeling lazy. Why do you post G-d in place of GOD?

 

[heretic888]

The belief is that the universe was created by G-d.

Ah yes, but I was referring moreso to the particulars of the Genesis story. But, as you said, it is not regarded as literal history so it really isn't that much of a problem.

Nothing whatsoever. The Talmud is the compilation of the Mishna, the Oral Law given to Moses at Mt. Sinai, and the Gemara, Rabbis' interpratations and commentaries on the Mishna.

Kabbalah is Mysticism.

Oh, I was under the impression that Kabbalah was orally transmitted for quite some time (supposedly down from Moses).

Ok, it's probably in this thread, but I have been feeling lazy. Why do you post G-d in place of GOD?

Simple answer is its a Jewish thing.

As I understand it, its against orthodox Jewish belief to actually pronounce the name of God (even in English, apparently) in keeping with Old Testamental laws. Then again, I could be completely off.

Laterz.

 

[CanuckMA]

Ok, it's probably in this thread, but I have been feeling lazy. Why do you post G-d in place of GOD?

Observant Jews will not destroy religious items, or items on which the name of G-d is written. For that reason, you will see Jewish documnts refering to G-d or HaShem (lit. The Name). Now the definition of destruction is obvious with physical media, but is subject to debate with regards to both electrinic storage and display technology. So to cover ourselves, and out of habit, we write G-d.

And before you ask, religious items no longer usable are buried in a Jewish cemetary.

 

[ShaolinWolf]

Ok, I'm misinformed(not about Christianity, because, well, it's Faith, and I'm not aruging on that point.) and I don't present my stuff very well. Anyways, I've done studies at church, not recently, about creation and on my own time. I just seem to have forgotten alot. I have been racking my brain. I used to be able to spout it all out, but I haven't read all that stuff in about 2 years. Man, I feel so totally out of the loop. LOL.


Anyways, there is a certain degree which I feel does not have to be documented. I done certain studies pertaining to the subject and I accept it as evidence. Some people need harder evidence, even tangible. With alot of things, yes, I need tangible, at least visible evidence. But because of so many studies I've done, I see how logical it is and thus it makes sense. I've studied Creation alot and I've seen how it all fits together, with the theory that Noah had dinosaurs on his ark(teenage dinosaurs could fit on his ark, even baby ones). And so many other things. I just take it to my belief because of the other stuff that I've read that connect it. But at times I forget that other people haven't studied it like I study it and thus they weaved basket only seems to them like a pile of weave. So, I guess what I'm saying is I can't present the evidence in the way you want it because it's scattered throughout all the books I've read and it would be so much to go through, considering I've studied from one book to the next. LOL. Anyways, I'll see what little I can find. I have a creation book over in the corner I just found and I'll go through it in a little bit.

And yes, I know that evidence is documented and things that are not documented evidence are subject to change. That's obvious. But I believe in the Bible as 100% truth, but that's because I've chosen to believe it. God says you either believe in 100% or 0%, no lukewarm stuff.

:asian:

P.S. I couldn't find my geography book, so nightingale, could you please just put it in as a P.S. ....LOL

 

[CanuckMA]

As I understand it, its against orthodox Jewish belief to actually pronounce the name of God (even in English, apparently) in keeping with Old Testamental laws. Then again, I could be completely off.

Laterz.

Pretty good. Pronouncing is OK. We just don't know how. Hebrew has no vowels. The name of G-d, in Exodus, is written with the Herew letters yud-hey-vav-hey. Although the exact pronounciation is unknown, this is where Yehova (Jehova) comes from.

 

[ShaolinWolf]

Ah, ok Canucka. Wasn't sure.

 

[Touch Of Death]

Ok, I'm misinformed(not about Christianity, because, well, it's Faith, and I'm not aruging on that point.) and I don't present my stuff very well. Anyways, I've done studies at church, not recently, about creation and on my own time. I just seem to have forgotten alot. I have been racking my brain. I used to be able to spout it all out, but I haven't read all that stuff in about 2 years. Man, I feel so totally out of the loop. LOL.


Anyways, there is a certain degree which I feel does not have to be documented. I done certain studies pertaining to the subject and I accept it as evidence. Some people need harder evidence, even tangible. With alot of things, yes, I need tangible, at least visible evidence. But because of so many studies I've done, I see how logical it is and thus it makes sense. I've studied Creation alot and I've seen how it all fits together, with the theory that Noah had dinosaurs on his ark(teenage dinosaurs could fit on his ark, even baby ones). And so many other things. I just take it to my belief because of the other stuff that I've read that connect it. But at times I forget that other people haven't studied it like I study it and thus they weaved basket only seems to them like a pile of weave. So, I guess what I'm saying is I can't present the evidence in the way you want it because it's scattered throughout all the books I've read and it would be so much to go through, considering I've studied from one book to the next. LOL. Anyways, I'll see what little I can find. I have a creation book over in the corner I just found and I'll go through it in a little bit.

And yes, I know that evidence is documented and things that are not documented evidence are subject to change. That's obvious. But I believe in the Bible as 100% truth, but that's because I've chosen to believe it. God says you either believe in 100% or 0%, no lukewarm stuff.

:asian:

P.S. I couldn't find my geography book, so nightingale, could you please just put it in as a P.S. ....LOL

I'm willing to bet god never used the term no luke warm stuff.
Sean

 

[Nightingale]

LOL.

Mental picture of Noah as dinosaur wrangler.

How, then, can you explain, the total absence of human fossils found with or in similar layers to, dinosaur fossils?

 

[ShaolinWolf]

I'm willing to bet god never used the term no luke warm stuff.
Sean

__________________


Well yeah, but that was symbolic. LOL. That's a symbolism used today. You either on one side of the fence or the other. You can't stay on the fence. Or you can't be luke warm, you should either be hot or cold. That's what I mean. heheh.

:asian:

 

[CanuckMA]

I'm willing to bet god never used the term no luke warm stuff.
Sean

You can't be sure. G-d has a good sense of humour. After all He gave us the platypus, and politicians.

 

[heretic888]

Observant Jews will not destroy religious items, or items on which the name of G-d is written. For that reason, you will see Jewish documnts refering to G-d or HaShem (lit. The Name). Now the definition of destruction is obvious with physical media, but is subject to debate with regards to both electrinic storage and display technology. So to cover ourselves, and out of habit, we write G-d.

And before you ask, religious items no longer usable are buried in a Jewish cemetary.

Ah, thanks for the clarification. :asian:

Pretty good. Pronouncing is OK. We just don't know how. Hebrew has no vowels. The name of G-d, in Exodus, is written with the Herew letters yud-hey-vav-hey. Although the exact pronounciation is unknown, this is where Yehova (Jehova) comes from.

Hrmmm... I seem to recall something about it being against the Law to utter God's name, but I suppose I'm wrong.

In any event, thanks for the clarification.

 

[ShaolinWolf]

You can't be sure. G-d has a good sense of humour. After all He gave us the platypus, and politicians. - CanuckaMA



LOL. True. And the sheep. Have you ever seen the show super sheep? I think it's glen davis? It's hilarious. It's all about how we relate to sheep in God's eyes(you know the sheperd and his flock?). It is so funny. He was saying why couldn't God have said we were a lion. He doesn't want to be a sheep. And yeah, it's funny. And yes, who said God doesn't have a sense of humour. In today's society if Christ had come, he would have probably said that.

 

[heretic888]

Anyways, there is a certain degree which I feel does not have to be documented. I done certain studies pertaining to the subject and I accept it as evidence. Some people need harder evidence, even tangible. With alot of things, yes, I need tangible, at least visible evidence. But because of so many studies I've done, I see how logical it is and thus it makes sense. I've studied Creation alot and I've seen how it all fits together, with the theory that Noah had dinosaurs on his ark(teenage dinosaurs could fit on his ark, even baby ones). And so many other things. I just take it to my belief because of the other stuff that I've read that connect it. But at times I forget that other people haven't studied it like I study it and thus they weaved basket only seems to them like a pile of weave. So, I guess what I'm saying is I can't present the evidence in the way you want it because it's scattered throughout all the books I've read and it would be so much to go through, considering I've studied from one book to the next. LOL. Anyways, I'll see what little I can find. I have a creation book over in the corner I just found and I'll go through it in a little bit.

Or it could just be that all the studies you accepted as "evidence" at the time were just not documented or cited at all. Many "Creationist scientists" engage in this kind of nonsense.

Just because you believe something to be evidence, does not make it evidence. Just because it "makes sense" or "seems logical" to you, does not make it evidence (unless we're talking about logical proofs).

Without proper document, its just empty claims.

 

[CanuckMA]

LOL.

Mental picture of Noah as dinosaur wrangler.

How, then, can you explain, the total absence of human fossils found with or in similar layers to, dinosaur fossils?

But the Bible does not imply that that story is the ONLY story. It even implies that G-d may not be the only one. Adam and Eve may be the first humans, but tehy certainly not the only ones created. Who did Cain and Abel marry?

And the First Commendment implies the existence of other deities. 'I am the Lord your G-d. You will not have other gods before Me.'

Remember that Torah was given as instructions to the Jews. it does not exclude other cultures.

 

[CanuckMA]

Hrmmm... I seem to recall something about it being against the Law to utter God's name, but I suppose I'm wrong.

In any event, thanks for the clarification.

Uttering G-d's name in vain. We utter His name every time we say a blessing.

 

[ShaolinWolf]

Ok, well, I didn't say you have to believe it. I just said it makes sense to me and I find it to be plenty of evidence. Everything does not have to cold hard evidence to be believed. I mean look at evo...errr...n/m....LOL.