Is there a point to learning how to knife fight?

Discussion in 'Knife Arts' started by Gruenewald, Jul 16, 2010.

  1. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    From what I've seen around this forum is seems as though nearly everybody will try to dissuade you from getting into a knife fight, or urge you that the majority of the time a "knife fight" s more like an ambush. It seems as though the chances that somebody proficient with a knife will ever be able to use those skills effectively in a self-defense situation are slim to none.

    This begs the question in my mind: aside from a purely developmental standpoint, learning to knife fight solely to improve yourself and pursue it as a hobby/goal (which knife fighting has never struck me as, due to its overtly lethal nature and how difficult it is to practice when compared with other "martial arts"), is learning to knife fight really worth it at all? Purely from a self-defense standpoint, I mean.
     
  2. elder999

    elder999 El Oso de Dios!

    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2005
    Messages:
    9,714
    Likes Received:
    1,291
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Where the hills have eyes.,and it's HOT!
    Yes.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. Touch Of Death

    Touch Of Death Sr. Grandmaster

    • Martial Talk Alumni
    Joined:
    May 6, 2003
    Messages:
    11,607
    Likes Received:
    842
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Spokane Valley WA
    Yes!!!!
     
  4. dbell

    dbell Blue Belt

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2009
    Messages:
    294
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Ashland, KY
    yes!
     
  5. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    Umm... mind elaborating? In what kind of a situation would knife skills be useful?
     
  6. elder999

    elder999 El Oso de Dios!

    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2005
    Messages:
    9,714
    Likes Received:
    1,291
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Where the hills have eyes.,and it's HOT!
    First off, this:


    doesn't necessarily equate with this:

    In fact, it seems to be an erroneous ***umption on your part.

    So....

    :lfao:

    In all seriousness:


    I carry a knife almost all the time-for cutting boxes, rope, pieces of meat, fruit, and things of that nature. However, I also could use it for multiple unarmed assailants. Or as a last-ditch contingency in a variety of situations.

    I could use the training with a knife like sharp object, like a pen, or scissors, if I were left without any other recourse;in fact, I have.
     
  7. MJS

    MJS Administrator Staff Member

    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2003
    Messages:
    30,187
    Likes Received:
    426
    Trophy Points:
    208
    Location:
    Cromwell,CT
    Well, of course, if at all possible, avoiding a fight is the ideal. Will they all be ambushes? No. Should you learn how to fight against and with a knife? Yes! IMO, if you dont understand a weapon, defending against it will be much harder. Would I use a knife to defend myself? If that was the only tool available to me, yes, I would. Of course, as elder said, just because you may not have a knife, a pen, pencil, or other pointy object could be substituted. :)
     
  8. MA-Caver

    MA-Caver Sr. Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2003
    Messages:
    14,960
    Likes Received:
    306
    Trophy Points:
    193
    Location:
    Chattanooga, TN
    I also say Yes.

    Try this... you are attacked by someone wielding a knife, your MA/SD skills happen to knock it out of their hands but they're still getting back up.
    The knife is near enough for you to pick it up and use it on them... would you? Do you? Could you?
     
  9. Archangel M

    Archangel M Senior Master

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2007
    Messages:
    4,555
    Likes Received:
    154
    Trophy Points:
    173
    As a "skill set" yes. As an "obsession"? You would best be served spending your time on other stuff IMO.
     
  10. mook jong man

    mook jong man Senior Master

    Joined:
    May 28, 2008
    Messages:
    3,080
    Likes Received:
    261
    Trophy Points:
    143
    Location:
    Matsudo , Japan
    Well for me it gave me an understanding of all the angles that the knife can be used in , it also gave me a greater sense of distancing and range.

    Now I have a fairly good idea of just how far away I have to be from someone so that I can make them lunge and miss so that I can counter with my own blade.

    In the system I learned we used a linear fencing type of footwork which gives you the ability to cover a lot of distance with one step , this ability can also come in handy for use in shutting someone down just as they are about to reach and deploy a knife.

    A lot of the attributes developed will carry over into your core martial art as well.
     
  11. elder999

    elder999 El Oso de Dios!

    • LifeTime Supporting Member
    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2005
    Messages:
    9,714
    Likes Received:
    1,291
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Where the hills have eyes.,and it's HOT!
    Yes, yes and YES.
     
  12. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    Thanks everybody. I presumed it would be useful to know in the case of an unarmed assailant, and I suppose you're correct about disarming the opponent and using their weapon.
     
  13. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6,012
    Likes Received:
    926
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    As an addition, knife combat doesn't need to be lethal. In fact, a lot of the knife training that I do is actually not lethal at all, particularly against other knives or weapons, mainly because a "lethal shot" isn't necessarily going to stop a fight straight away, but disabling cuts can.

    Here in Australia, the knife is actually the most common assault weapon encountered, to training to use it familiarises the trainee in it's features, advantages, disdvantages, limitations, strengths, and more. And the tactics and actions for knife use can be easily adapted, as well as providing a range of tactics that can be used against such an attack.
     
  14. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    Yeah, that's what I'm most interested in personally. Does anybody have a specific method or course to recommend with an emphasis on disabling moves (as well as general utility, ofcourse)?
     
  15. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6,012
    Likes Received:
    926
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    If you're talking about disabling cuts with a knife, and good all round understanding and use (including defence against), I can't recommend Michael Janich's stuff enough. Search Youtube, there's a lot of stuff there for you to see (of course, safety first! Make sure you have someone with experience to help guide you through this before attempting anything on your own!).
     
  16. Stick Dummy

    Stick Dummy <b>"Great Guro Wizard of the Gun and Knife"</b>

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2010
    Messages:
    69
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Like everyone else has posted it is all about preparing your mind and body to be able to respond to an aggravated attack.

    The more you train the more you respect what ANY weapon can do to the human body.

    Knives are the #1 choice of thugs based on availability, ease of concealment, and lesser criminal statutes for posession in most locales.

    Age old adage:
    You fight as you train....
     
  17. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    Cool, I'll check it out. Hoping to get a hold of some kind of practice weapons sometime soon; may just end up carving a couple of wooden knives myself (extremely blunt of course) just to start out with.

    Also going to start some generic Krav Maga peripheral/reaction time training soon and perhaps some bursting if I can get those practice knives and gather a friend of mine who's also interested.
     
  18. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6,012
    Likes Received:
    926
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    Uh, you do have someone who knows what they are doing to help guide you, though, right? It's not just you and "an interested friend" in your backyard? You did notice where I said that was rather important, yeah?
     
  19. Gruenewald

    Gruenewald Orange Belt

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2010
    Messages:
    90
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Halifax NS, Canada
    Hehe, yeah. I've got a (slightly older) friend who knows knife fighting, as well as some sparring skills passed down from his father, passed down from his father, etc. (combined with some real life experience, apparently). No idea what kind of skills they are but I do know that he knows enough to teach confidently. Also we're not training with live blades, so I'm not too worried about any accidents at this point in time.

    Obviously we'd only ever move on to live blades after we've gained a considerable amount of experience, and even then we'd do everything in our power to make it as safe as possible (to a point). Also rest assured that this experience would involve the coaching of a professional (and/or constant study of videos/books on the subject). I'm not one to take on dangerous endeavors without research, that's why I'm on this forum lol.
     
  20. Chris Parker

    Chris Parker Grandmaster

    • MartialTalk Mentor
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6,012
    Likes Received:
    926
    Trophy Points:
    263
    Location:
    Melbourne, Australia
    The main reason for going with someone who is experienced is that the less experienced will often have ideas or interpretations which are, unfortunately, less than realistic. And I don't know that you will ever "need" to train with live blades, unless doing cutting on an object (check out Michael's "Porkman" for some cutting with a knife, with a realistic feel).
     

Share This Page