Is Taekwondo turning into "the pushing art"?

Discussion in 'Tae-Kwon-Do' started by skribs, Jun 7, 2019.

  1. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    They had to make a special rule for this??
     
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  2. Jaeimseu

    Jaeimseu 2nd Black Belt

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    Yes. Some players would intentionally fall to avoid a counter attack.


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  3. Jaeimseu

    Jaeimseu 2nd Black Belt

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    My conclusion is that the Blue player had no answer to Red and so resorted to gaming the rules. My understanding is that Red had beaten Blue two or three times consecutively and was dominating the scoreboard in this match.

    The worst part to me was watching her celebrate as if it was some wonderful performance.


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  4. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    As the sport evolves and more "cheese" is discovered, that cheese needs to be eliminated from the rules. Another rule is "no monkey kicks", which are basically reverse hook kicks (i.e. an inward strike with the heel to the ribs). These kicks don't have enough power to be very effective in a real situation, but are strong enough to activate the sensors on the chestguard and score a point.
     
  5. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    Sure, but it seems to me that voiding a point if the competitor falls down when he delivers the technique would be an automatic. I am surprised they needed to create a rule specifically to govern that issue.
     
  6. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    The rules are what they are, but I would say that could be an effective kick, depending on the target.
     
  7. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    And it wouldn't be very effective on the target it is scoring on.
     
  8. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    To the ribs? Sure it could be.
     
  9. skribs

    skribs Senior Master

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    A punch would be faster and harder to counter, and you'd have better balance if they grab your arm than if they grabbed your leg.
     
  10. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    That may or may not be true depending on circumstances. But either way it does not change the fact that the inward heel kick to the ribs can be effective.

    Whether or not a different technique or a different set of circumstances might be MORE effective does not diminish the fact that the technique in question is effective.
     
  11. Mitlov

    Mitlov Green Belt

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    Rolling or falling kicks are a staple in Kyokushin. It's not surprising to me that TKD would need to clarify whether or not they're legal in the WT ruleset.

     
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  12. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    They were staple in American karate, too. I so loved rolling and falling kicks, used to smoke people with them all the time in competition....until they made me stop. They said because I lost eye contact with the target for a split second it was dangerous because of that. I countered with "then why are all manner of spin kicks allowed?" Of course they had no answer to that.

    I have found that the people who run competitions in the striking arts don't really care about anything other than making their own jobs easier and, of course, making a buck.

    The cartwheel version of the falling kicks is still my favorite, and I can still land it with one hundred percent accuracy even as an old man. There is no other technique I can say that about. I throw it at shorter than jab distance and I can hit anyone with it any time I want. That's how damn easy it is to throw if you have it in your repertoire.

    As for that video of the two girls competing, I felt embarrassed watching that. The instructor of the girl in blue has no place in the Arts in my opinion. That was awful. Even her grandparents should be embarrassed.
     
  13. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Any chance you've got a video of the falling cartwheel kick? I deal most of my damage in "shorter than jab" so would be cool to try learning it
     
  14. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't, no. But if you can come to Maui I can teach you that kick so you would be able to hit anyone with it just about any time you want. And it would only take a day, maybe two. Honest Injun. I'll even take you to dinner after you get the kick down.

    The thing about that kick within that "shorter than jab range" range - if you aren't familiar with it you will never see it coming. Precisely because you are in that short range. Let's say you have your right foot back, left foot forward....

    You throw a right hand. I don't care what kind of right hand, a cross, a reverse punch, whatever you like. But that right hand is the first part of that kick. And you throw that right hand like you mean it, not just stick your arm out, really throw it to hit the face.

    The rest is just ice cream. And perhaps apologies.
     
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  15. Flying Crane

    Flying Crane Sr. Grandmaster

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    Ok, I would expect that a judge in a tournament ought to be able to tell the difference between something deliberate like these, and someone who simply falls down in the middle of throwing his kick, or immediately after contact because he looses his footing or his balance. This is not rocket science.
     
  16. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    I should hopefully be making my way that way in exactly one year. Going to take you up on that
     
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  17. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    The problem with most judges at most tournaments, at least striking tournaments, is they are usually the people who weren't quite clever enough to get out of judging that day.
     
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  18. kempodisciple

    kempodisciple MT Moderator Staff Member

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    Times like this i wish there was a way to "save" a post on here so i wouldn't forget it.
     
  19. Buka

    Buka MT Moderator Staff Member

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    As Stephen, the mad Irishman from Braveheart said, 'Excellent!"
     
  20. CB Jones

    CB Jones Senior Master

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    Hawaii is now Buka's island...

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